New gaming system advice please

[yan9]

I started a thread a while ago in cases and damping regarding a new case for a gaming build which I wanted
to install in a cupboard but have realised that the Lian Li case that I had chosen and installing in a cupboard
would not really be suitable.

After more research it seems that the Fractal R5 is a better option and I will position it beside the cupboard.
I would like advice on whether there was another case similar but with less depth. The case will sit on the floor
in between the cupboard and a wall also with a wall directly behind, but nothing above.
I would like to know if air flow out through the top of the case would be suitable and possible.

My build will be just for gaming and present games are Arc Survival and Fallout 3 soon to be 4. Monitor resolution
at present 1920-1200, I may change resolution at some point but not by much.

I would like advice on parts please as I have only managed one build before and a very
inexperienced 70 year old.
I would prefer to have as quiet a build as possible and not to have to upgrade for a while
and also not compromise on the price of parts within reason.

I would like an Asus board because of fan control, and possibly Skylake 6700K cpu for auto
overclocking if needed.
For the gpu a quiet as possible 970 family board.
2 x 8gb memory no idea which
cpu cooler the ninja 4
power supply no idea really.

Thank you in advance for any help.

[CA_Steve]

What are the dimensions of the space? This will help to narrow the suggestion list.

CPU: Few games get a noticable bump in performance beyond 4 cores/4 threads. Better to go with the i5-6600K and OC if you need to. Downside to automatic OC'ing is the mobo s/w tends to bump the core voltage up a lot, leading to much higher power use/heat load/need to get rid of the heat/louder coolers.

[Abula]

This is what i would build for a quiet pc,

Motherboard Asus Z170 PRO Gaming £110.04
Memory Kingston HyperX Fury Black Series 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) 2133 MHz DDR4 £78.14 & FREE Delivery in the UK
CPU Intel Core i7 6700K £369.99
CPU Cooler Scythe Ninja 4 CPU Cooler £38.09 & FREE Delivery in the UK
GPU MSI NVIDIA GTX 970 GAMING Twin Frozr 5 £259.98 & FREE Delivery in the UK
PSU EVGA SuperNova P2 650W £94.98 & FREE Delivery in the UK
SSD Samsung 850Pro 500GB £171.25 & FREE Delivery in the UK (chose the size you need/prefer)
HDD WD Red 3TB £84.99 & FREE Delivery in the UK (chose the size you need/prefer)
Case Fractal Design Define R5 £77.99
Extra Case Fan Antec Truequiet 140mm £10.89 (move the included back fan to the front, and install the Antec on the back before mounting the motherboard, gets harder if you don't).
TOTAL £1,434.32

I would like advice on whether there was another case similar but with less depth. The case will sit on the floor

You could built on Micro ATX and end up with a smaller size overall, and if you chose quiet components it will end up as quiet as the Fractal. The necessary changes over the above setup are,
Motherboard Asus Z170M-PLUS £98.41 & FREE Delivery in the UK
Case Silverstone KL06 £58.20 (If you wish to see more, check SilverStone Kublai KL06 Unboxing & Preview)
Extra Case Fan Noctua NF-S12B redux-700 £10.89 & FREE Delivery in the UK (if you dont like the included Silverstone Fans grab two more)

I would like to know if air flow out through the top of the case would be suitable and possible.

Cases that do exhaust the air out on top are like Silvertone FT05 £144.84 & FREE Delivery in the UK, if you wish to read more check SPCR Quiet SLI Gaming PC Build Guide. I did my build on it, and pretty nice case, but you do need to undervolt a lot the AP181, the Asus motherboard should be a good option to do this.

[yan9]

Hello Abula and CA_Steve thanks for your replies.

The space available for the case can be altered as it will be situated in the corner of the room
between a wall and sideboard and the approx width is 300mm with it backing on to a wall.
The reason for asking about the possibility of a case that is not so deep is because anything
deeper than 450mm has it sticking out beyond the sideboard but if the R5 is a better option
then I would prefer that option.

I will have a look at all the recommended components and then report back, thanks.

[Abula]

The space available for the case can be altered as it will be situated in the corner of the room between a wall and sideboard and the approx width is 300mm with it backing on to a wall.

The reason for asking about the possibility of a case that is not so deep is because anything deeper than 450mm has it sticking out beyond the sideboard but if the R5 is a better option then I would prefer that option.

If keeping with the 450mm is important, i leave you the specs of each of the cases for you to consider.

Fractal Desgin Define R5 (WxHxD): 327 x 615 x 540mm
Silverstone Kublai Series KL06 211mm (W) x 375mm (H) x 405mm (D)
Silverstone Fortress Series FT05 221mm (W) x 483mm (H) x 427mm (D)

Personally i prefer the Fractal Design Define R5 because of its simplicity, practical and easy to build, but as long as you chose quiet components i think either of the choices can end up with a very quiet build. Here its more up to you, if the depth is important for the aesthetics of your home.

I will have a look at all the recommended components and then report back, thanks.

If you have any questions post them =)

[CA_Steve]

300mm width and 450mm depth.

Silverstone FTZ01 ITX case mounted vertically is only 107mm wide and 351mm deep. So, enough room for the side mounted fans to breath.

If you go with a standard tower and front to back airflow, you'll want to keep the back of the case 100mm away from the wall in order to not impede the airflow. So, you'd want a 350mm deep case.

[yan9]

With the research that I have done with the help of this site I had deduced that the R5 was one of the
better cases regarding quietness and temperature dependant on component choice.

Know I realise that there are other smaller cases more suited in size to fit the position that I have for
the case, but I had pressumed something like the Silverstone FTZ01 or the other smaller cases suggested
would be a compromise with temperature and sound compared to the R5. If this is correct then I would
prefer to choose one of the larger cases such as R5 or FT05.

With the R5 and the fitting of it sandwiched in between wall and sideboard and backed on to a wall.
Would it be a working possibility to add a fan in the top with the already installed rear top fan to expel air.

Or would I be better with the FT05 which has an air flow from bottom to top and also slightly smaller
case. But I am a little concerned about cable management and noise with this case.

[CA_Steve]

With unobstructed rear fan, the R5 is quieter than the FT02 or the FTZ01. Temps can run cooler in the FT05 - but it's minimal for your build.

For grins, I took a folded piece of paper and blocked the rear fan grille on my R4 (signature build). The idle noise of my GTX 960 overwhelmed any increase in noise of my slow (460 rpm) Antec True Quiet fans (which are just slightly and perhaps unnoticably quieter than the stock R5 fans). If I had a Gfx card with idled fans for 2D loads, maybe the answer would be different. I didn't take the time for a stress test to compare temps.

So, I'll be less conservative and say: Go for the R5. Put the two stock fans in front and try it with a 3rd fan in the rear. Your cabling can only be crushed so far Chances are there'll be at least 3cm of space. You can always play with moving the rear fan to the top.

Or, if you don't wnat the case to stick out as far, get the FT05. It'll be a bit louder.

[Abula]

With the research that I have done with the help of this site I had deduced that the R5 was one of the better cases regarding quietness and temperature dependant on component choice.

Know I realise that there are other smaller cases more suited in size to fit the position that I have for the case, but I had pressumed something like the Silverstone FTZ01 or the other smaller cases suggested would be a compromise with temperature and sound compared to the R5. If this is correct then I would prefer to choose one of the larger cases such as R5 or FT05.

There will be always compromises, to me for example the biggest issues on a case like FTZ01 would be the CPU cooler, because of its size you will be limited to much smaller coolers / fans, thus putting a high end CPU like i7 6700K could end up much more noticeable than in a case that you can fit the Ninja 4, air wise the FTZ01 while limited i think the dual chamber helps a lot keeping hot components separated. If you go this route, i would follow steve advise into a lower quad. When i did my build i check a lot of others build temps, and usually none hyperthreaded cpus had 10C less in load, and thinking the 6700K has 4.0ghz base clock it will be hotter also, so for this alone on a very small case i would avoid it, so following Steve advise, i would recommend a 6500 or lower, you can always cap clocks or underclock to keep it with in certain heat output.

With the R5 and the fitting of it sandwiched in between wall and sideboard and backed on to a wall. Would it be a working possibility to add a fan in the top with the already installed rear top fan to expel air.

You can remove the moduvents on the top and have fans there to exit heat, i dont see an issue here, just would be more noticeable for a case on the floor than on the back. Also remember that you have cables on the back, specially thick cables like the PSU that will not allow you to place it right to the wall.

Or would I be better with the FT05 which has an air flow from bottom to top and also slightly smaller case. But I am a little concerned about cable management and noise with this case.

While the FT05 exhaust on top, you still need some room on the back for the PSU to breath and for the cables to exit, you cant put tight to the wall. Cablemangement on the FT05 is adequate sort of speak, it get the job done, but you do have to put some effort as the space on the back is limited, the Define R5 has very good space and lots of spaces to route cables, much easier to slack on the cablemanagement. Now regarding quiet, the R5 would be easier to take to inaudible levels, first because your hardware wont be as hard to cool, and second because there are tons of 140mm fans to chose on (if you dont like the included fans), while on the FT05 you only have AP181 (included) and AP182, that said with Asus FanXpert you can drop the the AP182 200rpms where they are inaudible (i don't use them that low as they barely move air) but its to tell you that an FT05 can be drop off very quiet, on the other hand the included AP181 only drop around 500rpms (that with switch on low and using Asus FanXpert) where they are audible but low enough, i usually idle mine around 450rpms or so, lower than this my twin GTX980ti would scale temp faster ending with more noise, these are things that you have to test on your setup, as a single GTX970 will be much easier to keep cool down so you can drop the fans lower, each setup is different and the tweaking is key for you to end up with the quietest PC you can build.

If you go the route of the FT05, test the included fans first (AP181), dont be scared about the initial noise, these fans above 900rpms produce a lot of noise, switch them to low and then run FanXpert and drop them as low as you can, and test your PC while gaming, see if its quiet enough, if you have room on the temps and you feel you want lower rpms but the AP181 can reach lower, then consider swapping the fans for the AP182, if you wish to read more about them check Taming the beast, Silverstone AP182. I do enjoy doing all this swapping, testing and tweaking, if you don't, just go with the R5 and accept the sticking out or go with another case.

[yan9]

Well I have made a decision and will go for the Fractal R5 and would like to thank
you both for your much appreciated advice and help.

I will now research the other components that you have suggested and come back
here for more advice on them and possibly others if that is ok.

[yan9]

I have decided more or less on a spec very similar to the one that Abula gave me but would like some more information on components please.

Case Fractal R5

Motherboard Bundle Asus Z170 Maximus Vlll Hero -Skylake core i7 6700K cpu

Memory unsure lots to choose from what are differences between these, apart from some are I assume faster, which would be better for me.

Kingston Fury Black 16GB (2x8GB) DDR4 PC4-19200C15 2400MHz Dual Channel Kit - Black (HX424C15FBK2/16

Kingston Fury Black 16GB (2x8GB) DDR4 PC4-21300C15 2666MHz Dual Channel Kit - Black (HX426C15FBK2/16

Kingston Savage Black 16GB (2x8GB) DDR4 PC4-19200C12 2400MHz Dual Channel Kit - Black (HX424C12SBK2/

Kingston Savage Black 16GB (2x8GB) DDR4 PC4-21300C13 2666MHz Dual Channel Kit - Black (HX426C13SBK2/

Kingston Savage Black 16GB (2x8GB) DDR4 PC4-24000C15 3000MHz Dual Channel Kit - Black (HX430C15SBK2/

CPU Cooler Scythe Ninja 4 - will the memory fit under.

GPU MSI Nvidia GTX 970 Gaming Twin Frozr 5 is there anything better before going up to the 980 cards.

PSU EVGA SuperNova P2 650W are there any better.

SSD Samsung 850 Pro 500GB will this be ok for O/S and Games, with a possible internal or external HDD for backup.

Case fans keep the two included case fans and move rear exhaust to the front for an extra intake and replace rear exhaust with ? Antec Truequiet or Noctua model ? or replace all 3 fans with ?. I would like quiet fans and controllable low rpm fans if possible.

Would I need to order anything else such as extra cables, fixings etc.

[CA_Steve]

Motherboard Bundle Asus Z170 Maximus Vlll Hero -Skylake core i7 6700K cpu

Both are fine, but overkill for just gaming. If you want to save $'s and not impact performance, then go with i5-6600k and Asus Z170 Pro Gaming.

Memory unsure lots to choose from what are differences between these, apart from some are I assume faster, which would be better for me.

Kingston Fury Black 16GB (2x8GB) DDR4 PC4-19200C15 2400MHz Dual Channel Kit - Black (HX424C15FBK2/16

This is fine. Memory controller performance is very flat for RAM speed vs fps. Your games don't require more than 2x4GB.

CPU Cooler Scythe Ninja 4 - will the memory fit under.

Yes.

GPU MSI Nvidia GTX 970 Gaming Twin Frozr 5 is there anything better before going up to the 980 cards.

It's a good choice. For Fallout 4 with Ultra settings you'll see 75fps or so at your resolution. If you move up to a 1440p monitor, this drops to 50-60fps. [/quote]

PSU EVGA SuperNova P2 650W are there any better.

Depends on how you define better?
- You can get the be Quiet! Straight Power 10 500W for £70. It's always on fan is whisper quiet. But, this supply doen't have modular cables.
- You can get the modular version for £79

I don't see a UK online vendor with the EVGA P2..but, if you can find it for a similar price to the above, then yeah, it's better. If it's a lot more, then go for the SPP10.

SSD Samsung 850 Pro 500GB will this be ok for O/S and Games, with a possible internal or external HDD for backup.

For games, the benefit of an SSD is purely load times...and you won't notice a difference between the 850 Pro and 850 Evo...except for paying a lot more for the Pro.

Case fans keep the two included case fans and move rear exhaust to the front for an extra intake and replace rear exhaust with ? Antec Truequiet or Noctua model ? or replace all 3 fans with ?. I would like quiet fans and controllable low rpm fans if possible.

I suggest building with the stock fans and see if you like them. Then, decide from there.

Would I need to order anything else such as extra cables, fixings etc.

Got cable ties?

[yan9]

CA_Steve

Thanks for checking out my proposed build parts, are there any recommended parts suppliers
that I can view or be advised on.

Regarding the GPU MSI Nvidia GTX 970 Gaming Twin Frozr 5, if I decided to go for a 980 card
instead to make the computer a little more future proof for newer games which card would you
recommend.

Is it alright to install the operating system and games on the one SSD.

[Abula]

Regarding the GPU MSI Nvidia GTX 970 Gaming Twin Frozr 5, if I decided to go for a 980 card instead to make the computer a little more future proof for newer games which card would you recommend.

Imo a bad investment, around 7 months we will see Nvidias Pascal, that its rummored to be a big leap, personally i dont believe that, even if it is, nvidia will nerf it down to milk us the usual 30-40% boot in performance, but either way its a lot more than we get from intel from gen to gen. I would recommend to stick with the GTX970, unless you do need the GTX980, and personally what i would do is go with GTX960 and sell it once Pascal GTX970 replacment comes out.

But to answer the question, MSI GTX980 Gaming.

[yan9]

Thank you Abula I had not realised that Pascal would be as much of an upgrade.
I will therefor take onboard your very good advice, I may still get the 970 but not
the 980 card, thanks.

[CA_Steve]

Perhaps one of the SPCR members in the UK can comment on good e-tailers.

[lodestar]

Scan at Bolton, Lancashire are probably one of the biggest UK e-tailers but as always compare prices including delivery with elsewhere. They do at least stock a decent range of Scythe CPU coolers at reasonable prices. This includes the Ninja 4 for £37.99.

[lodestar]

...replace rear exhaust with ? Antec Truequiet or Noctua model ? or replace all 3 fans with ?. I would like quiet fans and controllable low rpm fans if possible.

The deluxe choice for a rear exhaust fan would probably be the Noctua NF-A14 PWM Fan which has a nominal speed range of 300 to 1500 rpm. Your choice of motherboard would allow this to run under idle conditions between around 350 to 450 rpm, depending on ambient temperature. If you use the Asus Fan Xpert software this would reduce speeds by around 100 rpm, to 250 to 350 rpm - effectively silent.

An alternative, more recent option is the Fractal Design Venturi HP-14 PWM 140mm which has a speed range of 400 to 1500 rpm. This fan would run slightly faster under idle conditions than the Noctua, but not by much - less than 100 rpm I would suspect. It is cheaper than the Noctua, from Scan at £14.99 while the A14 is £17.20. The Fractal Design is a black fan which may be a plus point for some people. A PWM Y cable is included in the price, maybe not important to you. The A14 also includes a PWM Y cable. In addition Noctua provide a PWM extension lead (not significant for an exhaust fan), rubber mountings and a PWM Low Noise Adapter. The Low Noise Adapter changes the rpm range of A14 from approx. 300 to 1500 to 300 to 1200. It means that at intermediate points between these two settings the fan runs slower and quieter.

A PWM exhaust fan could be run from the CPU_OPT header on your motherboard. This PWM header cannot be set independently but follows the settings for the CPU PWM fan header. Typically to get the slowest idle speeds the Silent option would be selected when fans are tuned using the Asus BIOS options and/or Fan Xpert software. This would keep the CPU and CPU_OPT fans at their lowest possible speeds during idle or low system stress conditions, only under gaming conditions would fan speeds ramp up.

[yan9]

Hi Lodestar

Thank you for your help and advice, I had looked at a few e-tailers such as Scan, Amazon, Overclockers etc.
I had seen a reasonable deal on a motherboard bundle at Overclockers.

Obviously money counts but my main concern is with after sales service incase of any faulty parts, can you
advise me regarding this, it is the only thing holding me back from ordering at present.

Thanks for the information on the fans and setup, I will probably purchase an extra fan for the rear exhaust
and move the one that comes with the Fractal R5 to the front. I just need to make a decision on the fan
Venturi, Noctua or True Quiet.

[lodestar]

Obviously money counts but my main concern is with after sales service incase of any faulty parts, can you
advise me regarding this, it is the only thing holding me back from ordering at present.

It's hard to advise on this one although I have bought PC parts from the three companies you mention plus Aria, Dabs, eBuyer and More Computers. The bundle deal from Overclockers could make sense in that buying the motherboard, CPU and memory from multiple sources would cause an obvious issue if (hopefully in the unlikely event) the new system fails to boot. Buying the rest from numerous sources, if need be, should pose less of a problem. However the cost of carriage looms large so it may be cheaper overall to order primarily from one source if the numbers make sense.

In terms of returning faulty parts, I have only done this with Scan who are in fact within an hours drive from me. I took a faulty part into them and it was exchanged on the spot. Incidentally I have no connection with any of the companies mentioned apart from as a customer.

[yan9]

Thanks Lodestar

I will just have to take a pick of the main dealers after looking at prices of components
and hope all goes well.