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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2011 11:28 pm 
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suhbehgee wrote:
OK, wife doesn't care so i'll show someone else...

First HD suspension with 4 x 300GB velociraptors...

Sorry for blurry/dark shots, used camera phone.


Very creative, and very nice trick!!! :)

One thing though: I notice the slanted drive. I would be very careful to get those drives levelled - that seems to be pretty much the only requirement for placement of a drive. It can be on its side or upside-down, but it has to be level or the platters will have trouble spinning correctly. Worst case damage, best case reduced performance.


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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2011 8:53 am 
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Quote:
One thing though: I notice the slanted drive. I would be very careful to get those drives levelled - that seems to be pretty much the only requirement for placement of a drive. It can be on its side or upside-down, but it has to be level or the platters will have trouble spinning correctly. Worst case damage, best case reduced performance.


Yeah, i ran out of washers and screws that would properly hold that last p-clip. I might tie it up a little higher to level it up, but i thought drive orientation was a non-factor as per here:

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=21533

Anyway, i have another velociraptor as spare in case of failure.


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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 3:56 am 
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Made a slight modification to previous clothing elastics. I added a velcro for added protection.

Image

Full rig profile: i7-2600s, GA-Z68XP-UD3 & Antec Sonata v1 (pics added!!)

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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2012 5:30 am 
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Techno Pride wrote:
Made a slight modification to previous clothing elastics. I added a velcro for added protection.

Full rig profile: i7-2600s, GA-Z68XP-UD3 & Antec Sonata v1 (pics added!!)


Won't the suspended harddisks touch the vertical HDD steel bars?

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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 8:11 am 
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Here is my ~4 years old solution based on Lian-Li PC-P80 + 11 x Samsung 1TB. 3.5" drives are installed into the 5.25" bays to have a lot of free space around them, and therefore reduce resistance against airflow passing the drives; airflow is created by 3x140mm front door fans (stock ones were replaced with Noctua's) working at low rpm.

with opened front door:
Image

closer:
Image Image

side view:
Image


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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 12:30 am 
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kuzzia wrote:
Techno Pride wrote:
Made a slight modification to previous clothing elastics. I added a velcro for added protection.

Full rig profile: i7-2600s, GA-Z68XP-UD3 & Antec Sonata v1 (pics added!!)


Won't the suspended harddisks touch the vertical HDD steel bars?


It's fine. There is just enough space on the sides.

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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:51 pm 
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With my current server setup (19 3.5-inchers and 3 2.5-inchers), I've gone a different route. I really don't like to think about what an unlucky push to my case, an earthquake, or whatever would result in, with drives suspended with elastic bands inside, bouncing around with active heads wreaking havoc on my platters. Instead, I've suspended my case. I've mounted the thing on the wall, using rubber foam as buffers to provide shock protection and give noiseless operation. Much better IMHO :)


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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 12:20 am 
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Image
Lamptron fan screws

Image

I changed my drive suspension again. Used the default Antec Sonata drive rails. Instead of the screws, I used these to prop up the drive. I cut off 2/3 of the rubber screw (of the right side).

Shamelessly stole this idea from another forum.

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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2012 9:58 am 
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Techno Pride wrote:
Image
Lamptron fan screws

Image

I changed my drive suspension again. Used the default Antec Sonata drive rails. Instead of the screws, I used these to prop up the drive. I cut off 2/3 of the rubber screw (of the right side).

Shamelessly stole this idea from another forum.

Interesting idea!
Could you provide (or link to) pics with the rails and rubbers attached to the rails, and the whole fully installed picture?


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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2012 2:37 am 
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jjwa wrote:
Techno Pride wrote:
http://www.kwikpiks.com/files/74/misc/RubberScrews-Closed-04.jpg
Lamptron fan screws

http://www.kwikpiks.com/files/74/misc/lamptron_cut.jpg

I changed my drive suspension again. Used the default Antec Sonata drive rails. Instead of the screws, I used these to prop up the drive. I cut off 2/3 of the rubber screw (of the right side).

Shamelessly stole this idea from another forum.

Interesting idea!
Could you provide (or link to) pics with the rails and rubbers attached to the rails, and the whole fully installed picture?


Hi I'll take pictures the next time I open the case. But the last time I checked, there may be problems with the rubber melting with a 7200rpm drive. The 5400rpm Caviar Green appears to be fine.

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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:19 am 
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Location: Australia
Silverstone Fortress - suspending the drives to get rid of the vibration hum and resonance 8)

What I used - cut to 12-13 inches
Image

Rigged up - bottom fan removed to allow easy access
Image

Standard shoe lace style double knot, but the second one is quite loose, so I can undo it if needed -had to stretch it out a bit before tying it up
Image

The finished result - twist the bands together once before inserting a drive or 2 twists for SSD - quite secure due to the greater width of these bands, won't flop or move around.
Easier to mount than the factory solution 8)
Image

But in the end I just plugged the SSD directly into the bracket of the first slot of the drive cage in the Silverstone FT-02 - cartridge style :lol:
Image


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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2012 3:48 am 
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Location: Sweden
I was hoping this thread would have a pic of hdd suspension on the fractal design mini :(


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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2012 6:20 am 
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Location: Australia
AckeDman wrote:
I was hoping this thread would have a pic of hdd suspension on the fractal design mini :(


Use your imagination 8)


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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Sat Jul 14, 2012 3:24 pm 
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My most recent PC build.
Bolts in the HDD are from Dell drive rails, non-threaded section so can be put in tight and still leave section to attach to. I used zip-ties to connect the elastic to the bolts so can't come lose. 4 strands at top to support weight and 2 at bottom to hold it stable. Works great, can turn the case on side etc and HDD barely moves even though not that tightly held.

Image

Image

My own PC has the HDD in Scythe Quiet Drive, sitting outside the case on bit of foam, specifically WD20EARX "green" drive, very very quiet.
Image

Regards, Seb

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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 2:20 am 
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I saw this video, before I noticed this thread.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9EV6pLzcRb0
He uses his 5.25" cage, and put in 7.5cm rubber plumming O-rings.

I had 2 problems.
1) My Fractal Design Arc Midi does not have a large hdd-cage I can use.
2) I can't find large O-rings.

So I came up with 2 alternatives.
1) I was thinking of building my own cage to put the disks in. However, I was afraid that if I didn't do it right, the cage would become another source of vibration. So I started thinking of a real cage, with bars, in stead of walls. I happen to have an old, large piece of concrete iron. I cut a piece of it. Folded it in the right size. I tied up the ends with tie-wraps, to make sure it would stay in the correct shape when putting it under pressure of tight elastic suspension.
2) Couldn't find the O-rings. My local plummer specialist had only 1 O-ring that looked good (I needed 4). The material made me think of kid's skipping rope. So I went to a toy store, and bought a skipping rope. The good thing was: the ends have a hook (to attach the ends to handles), which would make it really easy to attach the rope to the cage.

Result: HDD cage for 2 HDDs.
Image

I also have a waterpump that could use suspension.
It turned out it didn't really improve the noise. But the suspension does free the bottom of the pump from the foam. And thus there is no risk of overheating the pump anymore.
Image

PS. Those layers of noise-insulation hardly help. I learned (after building this) that that type of foam is meant to be used to "deaden" the sound. No more reflections. But it hardly stops noise going through it. It stops only 20-30% of the noise. So I plan to replace it with cotton-based insulation foam. (See here an example.) That stuff is supposed to work much better. Not easily available though, it seems.


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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 6:29 am 
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Gryzemuis wrote:
I saw this video, before I noticed this thread.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9EV6pLzcRb0
He uses his 5.25" cage, and put in 7.5cm rubber plumming O-rings.

I had 2 problems.
1) My Fractal Design Arc Midi does not have a large hdd-cage I can use.
2) I can't find large O-rings.

So I came up with 2 alternatives.
1) I was thinking of building my own cage to put the disks in. However, I was afraid that if I didn't do it right, the cage would become another source of vibration. So I started thinking of a real cage, with bars, in stead of walls. I happen to have an old, large piece of concrete iron. I cut a piece of it. Folded it in the right size. I tied up the ends with tie-wraps, to make sure it would stay in the correct shape when putting it under pressure of tight elastic suspension.
2) Couldn't find the O-rings. My local plummer specialist had only 1 O-ring that looked good (I needed 4). The material made me think of kid's skipping rope. So I went to a toy store, and bought a skipping rope. The good thing was: the ends have a hook (to attach the ends to handles), which would make it really easy to attach the rope to the cage.

Result: HDD cage for 2 HDDs.
Image

I also have a waterpump that could use suspension.
It turned out it didn't really improve the noise. But the suspension does free the bottom of the pump from the foam. And thus there is no risk of overheating the pump anymore.
Image

PS. Those layers of noise-insulation hardly help. I learned (after building this) that that type of foam is meant to be used to "deaden" the sound. No more reflections. But it hardly stops noise going through it. It stops only 20-30% of the noise. So I plan to replace it with cotton-based insulation foam. (See here an example.) That stuff is supposed to work much better. Not easily available though, it seems.

Your choice of suspension material isn't quite right: It really needs to be elastic, stretchy. Thin bungie cords would be a way better choice. The trick is not to tighten the suspension too much or let it be too slack (which risks the HDD falling out).

As for the "blue fill" recycled blue-jeans cotton batting, it is a fiberglass insulation alternative -- I used 8"x2 thick layers in my anechoic chamber. See -- http://www.silentpcreview.com/article876-page9.html However, you're right that it too, does not really block noise, only absorbs it as it passes through, and the effectiveness gets much worse with decreasing frequency (below ~200Hz, its absorption falls dramatically). Only one thing will block the noise -- walls of high mass/density.

Chances are, with a proper suspension of decently quiet HDDs, you will not need any acoustic foam to make them inaudible -- assuming a decent case. To contain the pump noise, I'd use something like a thick wall aluminum box to completely house it (with rubber gasket holes for the hoses & wiring), and float the pump in the box in a layer foam that will keep it from making direct contact with the metal box. The density of the foam should be chosen so it can stop mechanical vibration from getting into the box. Most foam also transfers some heat if it is not too thick/dense. Floating the whole encased pump assembly with elastic suspension will maximize the noise reduction.

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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:57 pm 
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MikeC wrote:
Your choice of suspension material isn't quite right: It really needs to be elastic, stretchy. Thin bungie cords would be a way better choice. The trick is not to tighten the suspension too much or let it be too slack (which risks the HDD falling out).


ive had good luck in the past with strips of old bicyle inner tube hung (lightly stretched) vertically, with a couple over sized washers to keep screws from torquing the rubber too much.

Code:
|    |
|    |
|[==]|
|    |
|[==]|
|    |
|    |


"|" is rubber
"[==]" is hdd

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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 3:16 am 
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MikeC wrote:
Your choice of suspension material isn't quite right: It really needs to be elastic, stretchy. Thin bungie cords would be a way better choice. The trick is not to tighten the suspension too much or let it be too slack (which risks the HDD falling out).

The plastic cord that I use it quite elastic. Maybe not as much as bungie cord, but I would think elastic enough. And yes, I did experiment a bit how tight I should tie it. I made it quite lose. But I'll see if I can find bungie cord, and see if that improves things. As I said, seeking noises are completely gone. I copied a hundred gigabyte from one disk to another (and then deleting it), just because I enjoyed not hearing my disks rattle at all. :)

Quote:
As for the "blue fill" recycled blue-jeans cotton batting, it is a fiberglass insulation alternative -- I used 8"x2 thick layers in my anechoic chamber. See -- http://www.silentpcreview.com/article876-page9.html However, you're right that it too, does not really block noise, only absorbs it as it passes through, and the effectiveness gets much worse with decreasing frequency (below ~200Hz, its absorption falls dramatically).

Thanks for the link. I had missed that article. Impressive work.
I learned that the foam does not do a lot of stopping noise going through. But now you are saying that also the cotton-based insulation doesn't work well ? I read that "ridig fiberglass plates" would be much better than the foam. And that cotton-based would be even better. But if it still block less than half the noise, maybe I shouldn't bother ?

Quote:
Only one thing will block the noise -- walls of high mass/density.

One of my friends suggested that I should buy 2 boxes. Of slightly different size, and the biggest should fit in my cupboard. Then fill the space between them with sand. I'm not sure I like that idea. 1) it has the potential to become filthy, 2) getting my tubes/wires through the 2 boxes is not optimal. 3) I need to mess with a lid or door, where the hinges might become sound-bridges. 4) Will sand stop vibration-noise, or do I still need to suspend my pump ? A lot of work, for something that might not be effective.

Quote:
Chances are, with a proper suspension of decently quiet HDDs, you will not need any acoustic foam to make them inaudible -- assuming a decent case.

I have a Fractal Design Arc Midi. It has not been designed to be quiet. (I think the R3 and R4 are for that). But with openings for fans, there is always room for noise to escape. I can't understand how one can claim a case is silent, when there are fans in it ? Even when the fans themselves don't make noise, but some component inside.

I might buy bitumen plates for noise dampening. And I have some of that foam still that I could put on top of the bitumen. That could maybe absorp some of the HDD spinning noise.

Quote:
To contain the pump noise, I'd use something like a thick wall aluminum box to completely house it (with rubber gasket holes for the hoses & wiring), and float the pump in the box in a layer foam that will keep it from making direct contact with the metal box. The density of the foam should be chosen so it can stop mechanical vibration from getting into the box. Most foam also transfers some heat if it is not too thick/dense. Floating the whole encased pump assembly with elastic suspension will maximize the noise reduction.

Would foam be better than sand ? I guess 2 boxes with sand will be heavier, and are harder to hang in suspension.

My new SSD arrived this morning. Let's see if I can keep my HDDs spun down.
And hopefully my new fan controller will arrive tomorrow, so I can undervolt my pump.
If those things don't work, I will look at more drastic actions.

One other trick might be to buy a NAS, and put the 2 HDDs in there. The downside is, I see customer reviews claiming that their NASs do 60-25 MByte/sec. Old fashioned HDDs do 250-300 MBps, GbE is 125 MBps. So 25 MBps seems pretty slow. Not a problem when watching movies on my TV. But manipulating files and games around could take some time. (Copying 10GB takes 7 minutes. Painful when you were used to local storage).


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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 6:43 am 
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If you fill cavities with sand, it becomes a solid heavy mass. Yes, it has internal damping qualities, but it would not be as mechanically isolating for the low frequency vibration of the pump. I'd never use it -- way too messy.

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 Post subject: Re: HDD Elastic Suspension... Show your pics!
PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 5:39 am 
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Not pretty but it works, no more vibrations from hdd.
I also added these monster heatsinks :mrgreen: , got my temps down from 41c to 33c.
I 'll probably put smaller heatsinks on top, the bottom one is fine.
Image


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