Cooling Phenom2 X6

Cooling Processors quietly

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alexb
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Cooling Phenom2 X6

Post by alexb » Thu May 01, 2014 11:21 pm

I got an AM3 system, upgrading to Phenom 2 X6, and would like to use a quiet heatsink to cool this down, yet, ensuring good cooling for max performance?

Thanks

quest_for_silence
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Re: Cooling Phenom2 X6

Post by quest_for_silence » Fri May 02, 2014 11:49 am

Which is the exact CPU model? Not all the Phenom II X6s are created equal.
And which are the other parts - I mean case, motherboard, discrete graphics card (if any), and so on - in your rig?

alexb
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Re: Cooling Phenom2 X6

Post by alexb » Fri May 02, 2014 3:29 pm

quest_for_silence wrote:Which is the exact CPU model? Not all the Phenom II X6s are created equal.
And which are the other parts - I mean case, motherboard, discrete graphics card (if any), and so on - in your rig?
CPU Planned: Phenom 2- X6 1055. Although I haven't got it yet, currently using X4-640.

- Case: An older Lian Li, kinda similar to this http://www.lian-li.com/en/dt_portfolio/pc-8n/ . It has two 80mm fan front, one 80mm in the back, and one on the top. I am trying to find and replace those with quietest 80mm fans I can fine.

- Mobo: I have an MSI 890GX motherboard, no fans on it. But, am unsure what fan controls are possible via BIOS. I want it to be almost silent in Idle, and don't care as much when it's running/hot.

- Video Card: A noisy MSI Radeon 7700 GPU (which I MUST make quiet). Must somehow change the fan/heatsink.

- Storage: SSD + 2TB Hitachi 5400. Maybe adding a quiet 7200RPM.

Thanks

quest_for_silence
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Re: Cooling Phenom2 X6

Post by quest_for_silence » Sat May 03, 2014 4:47 am

alexb wrote:CPU Planned: Phenom 2- X6 1055. Although I haven't got it yet, currently using X4-640.


There are two part numbers for that CPU: you'd better to pick the lower TDP SKU.
At any rate, I hope you have planned some future jobs for those two further cores, otherwise you may not notice any performance improvement over the Athlon II X4 640.

Cooling that X6 however isn't a particularly though job: you may make it easier undervolting the CPU.
Stock Vcore is around 1.30V (1.42V for Turbo mode) but you could run it safely at 1.1375 (1.225 minimum for Turbo mode), or even a bit less, sparing about 10°C: you may either use the BIOS or K10Stat, but the more efficient way is to disable Cool'n'quiet and using K10Stat at system startup.
As CPU heatsink you may use about any SPCR recommended cooler which fits your enclosure, and it mostly depends on your allotted budget.

alexb wrote:- Case: An older Lian Li, kinda similar to this http://www.lian-li.com/en/dt_portfolio/pc-8n/ . It has two 80mm fan front, one 80mm in the back, and one on the top. I am trying to find and replace those with quietest 80mm fans I can fine.


So it's more similar to this one, I guess.
The quietest setup would probably be two Nexus on the front, tied to the GPU temp, and two Noctua PWM on the back and top, daisy-chained to the CPU header.
If money can be a concern, I think you may source AC F8 rather than the Nexus, and two AC F8 PWM rather than the Noctua ones.

alexb wrote:- Mobo: I have an MSI 890GX motherboard, no fans on it. But, am unsure what fan controls are possible via BIOS. I want it to be almost silent in Idle, and don't care as much when it's running/hot.


With just two headers, it isn't well suited for that enclosure. With reference to the above proposed setup, you need a 3-ways PWM splitter and an y-cable for the case fan header. If you should go for a full PWM setup, you should need a 5-ways PWM splitter only.

alexb wrote:- Video Card: A noisy MSI Radeon 7700 GPU (which I MUST make quiet). Must somehow change the fan/heatsink.

First of all, you should identify more clearly that card, and anyway you may use either SpeedFan or Afterburner to slow down the fan.

alexb
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Re: Cooling Phenom2 X6

Post by alexb » Sat May 03, 2014 8:17 pm

quest_for_silence wrote:
alexb wrote:CPU Planned: Phenom 2- X6 1055. Although I haven't got it yet, currently using X4-640.


There are two part numbers for that CPU: you'd better to pick the lower TDP SKU.
At any rate, I hope you have planned some future jobs for those two further cores, otherwise you may not notice any performance improvement over the Athlon II X4 640.

Cooling that X6 however isn't a particularly though job: you may make it easier undervolting the CPU.
Stock Vcore is around 1.30V (1.42V for Turbo mode) but you could run it safely at 1.1375 (1.225 minimum for Turbo mode), or even a bit less, sparing about 10°C: you may either use the BIOS or K10Stat, but the more efficient way is to disable Cool'n'quiet and using K10Stat at system startup.
As CPU heatsink you may use about any SPCR recommended cooler which fits your enclosure, and it mostly depends on your allotted budget.
Ok, thanks. I also found an X4 965 but I think that's 125 watts... I think the extra cores would only help with software the uses extra cores like some video encoders, also the L3 cache should help... but in general I won't be spending much on top of my CPU as gains are not significant. Key is how to cool either, eventhough the current AMD Stock fan is actually not that bad when it throttles down (it has no heatpipe though).
quest_for_silence wrote:
alexb wrote:- Case: An older Lian Li, kinda similar to this http://www.lian-li.com/en/dt_portfolio/pc-8n/ . It has two 80mm fan front, one 80mm in the back, and one on the top. I am trying to find and replace those with quietest 80mm fans I can fine.


So it's more similar to this one, I guess.
The quietest setup would probably be two Nexus on the front, tied to the GPU temp, and two Noctua PWM on the back and top, daisy-chained to the CPU header.
If money can be a concern, I think you may source AC F8 rather than the Nexus, and two AC F8 PWM rather than the Noctua ones.
alexb wrote:- Mobo: I have an MSI 890GX motherboard, no fans on it. But, am unsure what fan controls are possible via BIOS. I want it to be almost silent in Idle, and don't care as much when it's running/hot.


With just two headers, it isn't well suited for that enclosure. With reference to the above proposed setup, you need a 3-ways PWM splitter and an y-cable for the case fan header. If you should go for a full PWM setup, you should need a 5-ways PWM splitter only.
EXACTLY that case! How did you find that one? I searched on their site for a while :) . Now, question is how do I tie the fans to run based on temps? Any guides anywhere? I wish the damn mobo did that out of the box.
quest_for_silence wrote:
alexb wrote:- Video Card: A noisy MSI Radeon 7700 GPU (which I MUST make quiet). Must somehow change the fan/heatsink.

First of all, you should identify more clearly that card, and anyway you may use either SpeedFan or Afterburner to slow down the fan.
Ok, let me look that up. It was very hard to find a quiet video card... this one has a massive fan, but it's freaking loud!!!

quest_for_silence
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Re: Cooling Phenom2 X6

Post by quest_for_silence » Sun May 04, 2014 12:19 am

alexb wrote:Key is how to cool either, eventhough the current AMD Stock fan is actually not that bad when it throttles down (it has no heatpipe though).


I don't like the stock fan, I wouldn't call it "quiet" not even if I were paid to say so: but it's your call.

At any rate, some brief, partial comparisons on Anandtech Bench:
  1. X4 635 vs X6 1055T
    X4 645 vs X6 1055T
    X4 635 vs X4 965BE
    X4 645 vs X4 965BE


By the way, another possible candidate is the X4 960T, which could run a tad quieter and faster.

alexb wrote:EXACTLY that case!


Well, that case would look like to have just 3 80mm fans, and not 4 80mm fans as you said (not that it changes very much the outcome).

alexb wrote:Now, question is how do I tie the fans to run based on temps? Any guides anywhere? I wish the damn mobo did that out of the box.


You'd do well to carefully read this article (along with your mobo manual).

alexb wrote:It was very hard to find a quiet video card... this one has a massive fan, but it's freaking loud!!!


Well, it was enough to look for an advice on this forum before buying: anyway, as said, you should first of all identify that card.

alexb
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Re: Cooling Phenom2 X6

Post by alexb » Fri May 23, 2014 9:55 am

Thanks for all the help... I however JUST found out that my motherboard (MSI 890GX) accepts AM3+ CPUs and Bulldozer architecture with just a BIOS update.

So, doing a full 180... which FX CPU gives me the best bang for the buck to be (1) Faster than my current CPU, (2) can be quiet

Thanks!

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Re: Cooling Phenom2 X6

Post by CA_Steve » Fri May 23, 2014 11:07 am

Is it the MSI 890GXM--G65? If so, here's the cpu compatibility list. For fun and amusement, here's Anantech's CPU bench for the Athlon x4 II 645 vs the FX-8150.

alexb
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Re: Cooling Phenom2 X6

Post by alexb » Fri May 23, 2014 11:20 am

CA_Steve wrote:Is it the MSI 890GXM--G65? If so, here's the cpu compatibility list. For fun and amusement, here's Anantech's CPU bench for the Athlon x4 II 645 vs the FX-8150.
Thanks, it looks like it all depends on what... some areas it's twice as fast, some areas only 30%.

Any idea WHY only some FX series are supported? Like 4100 and not 4300? or 6100 and not 6300? Could I get into trouble if I get a 4130, or 6300? Aren't they just the same with different CPU speed? or there's more to it (the stepping maybe)?

washu
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Re: Cooling Phenom2 X6

Post by washu » Fri May 23, 2014 12:20 pm

alexb wrote:Any idea WHY only some FX series are supported? Like 4100 and not 4300? or 6100 and not 6300? Could I get into trouble if I get a 4130, or 6300? Aren't they just the same with different CPU speed? or there's more to it (the stepping maybe)?
The x3xx are Piledriver based while x2xx and x1xx are Bulldozer based. Piledriver is a newer revision so that is likely why it does not work on your board.

alexb
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Re: Cooling Phenom2 X6

Post by alexb » Fri May 23, 2014 12:26 pm

washu wrote:
alexb wrote:Any idea WHY only some FX series are supported? Like 4100 and not 4300? or 6100 and not 6300? Could I get into trouble if I get a 4130, or 6300? Aren't they just the same with different CPU speed? or there's more to it (the stepping maybe)?
The x3xx are Piledriver based while x2xx and x1xx are Bulldozer based. Piledriver is a newer revision so that is likely why it does not work on your board.
Ok, thanks, so for sure x3xx series won't work, right? What about varieties of x1xx? Like 4130, 4170, etc... if it's not listed?

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Re: Cooling Phenom2 X6

Post by quest_for_silence » Fri May 23, 2014 12:35 pm

alexb wrote:Ok, thanks, so for sure x3xx series won't work, right? What about varieties of x1xx? Like 4130, 4170, etc... if it's not listed?


Can't you just return the CPU (with no money penalty), in case it won't work?

alexb
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Re: Cooling Phenom2 X6

Post by alexb » Fri May 23, 2014 1:12 pm

quest_for_silence wrote:
alexb wrote:Ok, thanks, so for sure x3xx series won't work, right? What about varieties of x1xx? Like 4130, 4170, etc... if it's not listed?


Can't you just return the CPU (with no money penalty), in case it won't work?
I guess I could, but as this is an older machine I am trying to find a used CPU for cheap to do the upgrade.

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Re: Cooling Phenom2 X6

Post by CA_Steve » Fri May 23, 2014 2:48 pm

most likely scenario: MSI stopped updating the bios - so no newer part numbers recognized/listed in the support list.

quest_for_silence
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Re: Cooling Phenom2 X6

Post by quest_for_silence » Fri May 23, 2014 9:00 pm

alexb wrote:
quest_for_silence wrote:
alexb wrote:Ok, thanks, so for sure x3xx series won't work, right? What about varieties of x1xx? Like 4130, 4170, etc... if it's not listed?


Can't you just return the CPU (with no money penalty), in case it won't work?
I guess I could, but as this is an older machine I am trying to find a used CPU for cheap to do the upgrade.

I might be wrong but, unless you have some special requirement to fullfill, such as playing a specific game or using some specific piece of software, which really takes advantage of a few more hundreds of MHz, IMO it's unlikely you may find an FX CPU really for cheap, while being significantly faster than your Athlon II X4 640.

Anyway, https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=162959.0

Please pay attention that with such a mobo and case combo it's probably not advisable to OC the CPU, or to pick a 125W one (most likely the faster ones): personally I won't use anything faster than a FX-6300.

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