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 Post subject: Improve X4 845 stock cooler and make it quieter
PostPosted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 5:43 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2016 5:02 am
Posts: 13
Hi,

i'd like to improve acoustic with the lower amount of money.
I was thinking to remove the stock fan (it is a 7 cm fan) and:

a) find a new silent 7 cm fan (seems i cannot find a good one)
or
b) put a Noctua NF-F12 PWM (suspended in the middle, secured with 4 plastic cords or using an old zalman bracket)

what do you think?

in the b) case, do you think the new fan can handle the cooling (let's say spinning at 80%)

i'll probably going to replace case fans too with a Noctua NF-S12B redux-1200 PWM and a Noctua NF-B9 redux-1600 PWM
(atm the major source of noise is the zalman fan on the back)

note that i don't want it to be completely silent (there are 3 mechanical harddrive that i cannot touch), i just want to improve it on the fans side.

another option is a new heatsink, the ram is 32.8 mm tall, the case can hold up to 150mm heatsink, Noctua NH-U9S or Noctua NH-D9L should fit well, but i'd like to know if there is a cheaper solution that fits in my rig and eventually help with vrm too.

thanks


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Last edited by isvgai on Wed Dec 07, 2016 6:55 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Improve X4 845 stock cooler and make it silent
PostPosted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 3:22 pm 
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A 12cm Noctua should have no trouble keeping that cooler cool at a hard drive's noise level.

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 Post subject: Re: Improve X4 845 stock cooler and make it silent
PostPosted: Sat Nov 26, 2016 8:42 am 
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ty, i think i'll check with some noisy 120 fan i already have and proceed to order the fans if temps are cool.


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 Post subject: Re: Improve X4 845 stock cooler and make it silent
PostPosted: Sun Nov 27, 2016 7:42 am 
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I did a quick test like in the photo, with a Corsair SP120, it was a failure :(
With prime95 small, the core goes at 64° and the cpu start throttling (with stock fan i can insted mantain 3.8mhz turbo all the time).

The fan i used is 62.74 CFM and 3.1 mm/H20
The Noctua one would be (at 1200 rpm) 74,3 m³/h and 1,83 mm H₂O

I guess it will not make it (the case was also open while testing).

Not sure now if i need a smaller fan and/or better positioning

(prolly going with something like THERMALRIGHT True Spirit 120 M is a safer solution)


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 Post subject: Re: Improve X4 845 stock cooler and make it silent
PostPosted: Sun Nov 27, 2016 8:30 am 
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Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2007 10:12 am
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Location: ITALY
isvgai wrote:
I did a quick test like in the photo, with a Corsair SP120, it was a failure :(

From the photo I think you were running the cooler about as a fanless one: the fan do need to touch the heatsink (alternatively you need an adaptor/duct/shroud, as those used on radiators in liquid cooling to focus the airflow), and I guess you may need also a smaller (92mm? 80mm?) fan, or at least one with a rather smaller hub/rotor (like a Scythe Slipstream, as the rotor act as a dead spot).

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 Post subject: Re: Improve X4 845 stock cooler and make it silent
PostPosted: Sun Nov 27, 2016 9:56 am 
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I think too i need a small 80mm fan and direct contact (the naked heatsink is exactly 80mm).
Sadly i'm not able to make direct contact between fan and heatsink (with the tools/materials i have at home).
In the test there was a 1cm/2cm distance between them (the fan was oriented pointing air slightly to the back zalman fan on the left)

The rotor as dead spot is something i did not considered!
That (and the other stuffs above) explain why the cpu sensor was 64° and the motherboard sensor 60°
Usually with stock fan the cpu sensor goes max 59.5° and mobo sensor 65°.

Little OT:
It is still decent stock solution compared to what i've seen in the past years, never gets too loud during normal operations or gaming, i guess it's "near silent thermal solution" as advertised by amd (impressive combo for 61 euros).
But... i may change my mind if i keep it and the summer come :D


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 Post subject: Re: Improve X4 845 stock cooler and make it silent
PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2016 5:50 am 
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I think i will end getting a new cooler.
I was looking at those:

Noctua NH-L12 (49.90 euro)
Noctua NH-U9S (54.90 euro)
Noctua NH-D9L (54.99 euro)
SilverStone Argon AR02 (34.99 euro)

System specs:
AMD Athlon X4 845 (TDP: 65W)
ASRock FM2A68M-DG3+
Kingston HyperX FURY (HX316C10F/4 + HX316C10FB/4)

Now i'm not sure NH-L12 and AR02 will fit with the ram.
Also i'm not sure about the noise level of the AR02 (at least reading the review).

What do you think, suggest? (NH-L12 appeals me, i may be able to run it with 1 fan and use the second one as case fan)


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 Post subject: Re: Improve X4 845 stock cooler and make it silent
PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2016 7:03 am 
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Location: ITALY
Which is your case?

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 Post subject: Re: Improve X4 845 stock cooler and make it silent
PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2016 7:24 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2016 5:02 am
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Zalman ZM-T3

According to this: http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/zalman-z ... -review/6/
Maximum CPU cooler height: 5.9” (150 mm)

This limit alot the selection (there are others ram friendly coolers but around 160 mm height from my research).

PS: sono italiano pure io :)


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 Post subject: Re: Improve X4 845 stock cooler and make it silent
PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2016 11:27 am 
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Location: ITALY
isvgai wrote:
Zalman ZM-T3

According to this: http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/zalman-z ... -review/6/
Maximum CPU cooler height: 5.9” (150 mm)

This limit alot the selection (there are others ram friendly coolers but around 160 mm height from my research).

PS: sono italiano pure io :)

Welcome. :wink:

Probably you picked up a too cheap case, and went too cheap for the mobo too (IMO, of course), but here we are.

The NH-L12 has a 47mm clearance, so it shoud be ok with the 32mm tall Kingstons (so I don't understand your apparent concern about), and the True Spirit 120M (or 120i) offers a good clearance too for probably less money, but it does need a new fan (the stock one sounds so badly) so it will cost about the same (~50).

The other options seem not competitive.

OTOH the 120M is no more available (ok, there's the Rev. A with the plastic shroud which may pose some questions), while the 120i might be interesting with his asymmetrical slanting, but it's not available too in EU.

All in all the €49,90 NH-L12 looks like the one to buy: and if it turned out incompatible, you may just send it back with same reason, "incompatible", I mean you know. ;)

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Luca

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 Post subject: Re: Improve X4 845 stock cooler and make it silent
PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2016 1:25 pm 
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my main concern about the NH-L12 is that the small fan on the bottom may touch the ram (i saw some photos of this happening on pcpartpicker, but on mini itx boards)
in this case i could remove the small fan or, as you say, return it as incompatible :)

and... you are right, the main idea was to build a very cheap media server, i started with ASRock QC5000-ITX/PH (the full build, excluding harddisks, was around 160Euro - and moderately quiet)
After some time i turned it into a low gaming build changing mobo/cpu and adding a 750 Ti.
The 300w be quiet power supply is on the edge atm xD

anyway, ty, have a nice evening


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 Post subject: Re: Improve X4 845 stock cooler and make it silent
PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2016 2:00 am 
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The Thermalright Macho 90 would work.

I just got a be quiet Shadowrock LP and it looks very nice but I haven't got the computer together to test it yet. It has a 120mm fan but it is still only 75mm tall. RAM clearance depends on which direction you mount it in. Being so much larger than the cooler you have now, I imagine it should work a lot better.


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 Post subject: Re: Improve X4 845 stock cooler and make it silent
PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2016 2:35 am 
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Hi, personally I would not buy an expensive cooler for this PC. I would look for 92mm fan tower heatsinks, these will be ample to cool your CPU, which I think is 65w TDP.
My experience is Arctic Cooling fans can be slowed to nicely quiet levels, certainly below 3x HDDs. Try looking for Freezer 7 Pro or Freezer A11, should be 20-30 euro.
Coolermaster Hyper TX3 (or whatever it's replacement is) also great value, although the fan may not spin down as far, but will be better than existing heatsink/fan.
Even Alpine 64 Pro should cool quietly, and should be less 20 euro.

I also like Arctic Cooling case fans, they do all sizes in 3 and 4 pin, and they are cheap, can be very on eBay or the like.

Whatever heatsink / fans you have it won't be that quiet without fan control to slow them down to minimal speed that still cools enough, you might be able to do this with control off the motherboard, or need hardware fan controls, even just simple fanmate type device can be fine, to tune the speed to balance noise/cooling.

Are the hard drives suspended or soft mounted? This makes a lot of differance to get rid of low humming and resonance. Just resting on packing foam or even bubble wrap can work at the simplest, or more intrecate solutions with elastic suspension.

Good luck.
Seb

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 Post subject: Re: Improve X4 845 stock cooler and make it [quieter]
PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2016 6:32 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2016 5:02 am
Posts: 13
@QUIET!
Ty, i cannot find infos about ram clearance on both Macho 90 and Be Quiet LP but i see they are around 44 euro and NH-L12 seems still a better option.

@SebRad
I'm still undecided, i don't like too the idea to get a 50 euro cooler for a 65 euro cpu.
About replacing the fan, i saw few photos of guys using zip ties for the job (is it safe to let them pass thru heatsink fins, doesn't they melt over time? Maybe there are some better solutions?)

I agree on arctic cooling fans/heatsinks (i have one 120, silent version, installed on the front of this pc)
Usually when i build a pc for friends, i default with i3/i5, an arctic 120 pwm fan and the freezer 13 (but for amd i don't like the restricted vertical mounting for the fan and again it may interfere with the ram).
I used the freezer 7 two times but seems less solid (both in terms of cooling and construction quality), but it is still a candidate too.
I fear the A11 and Alpine 64 would not make much difference compared to the stock cooler (iirc i read few bad reviews about them, but maybe the guys did not know what they were doing)
And ye, i was looking also at the TX3.

The mobo can control only cpu and 1 case fan, but slowing the back fan have bad impact on both cpu and mobo temps (that is why i also need a new 92mm back fan at least).

About HDs, i have 2x 2.5 mounted on the top, one inside the 5.25 bay (just using two screws), one just down in the 2.5 bay.
The 3.5 HD is instead mounted vertically in the 3.5 bay.

I guess i can suspend them vertically or on the bottom (some tailor elastic could make it, i can also remove the 3.5 bay i think).
Is suspension dangerous, can it lower the life of HDs? (even if done in a proper way)
I don't care about the two 2.5 drives, but the 3tb wd red must live for long time xD

ty, have a nice day.


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 Post subject: Re: Improve X4 845 stock cooler and make it quieter
PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2016 2:16 pm 
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looks like the Scythe Katana 3 may do the job for 27 euro (it seems ram/vrm friendly and the perfect fit for 65W)
the old model is discontinued (now there are 2 models, type a/i), someone know if is it still good as the spcr 2009 review?


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 Post subject: Re: Improve X4 845 stock cooler and make it quieter
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 9:03 am 
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i got Scythe Katana 3 and a 92mm noctua redux pwm
everything is sick quiet now xD
i had to use an old Zalman ZM-MC1 for the front 120mm fan (i discovered the arctic "silent" fan was not so silent)
i used rubber washers to improve harddrives (2 hd are "semi-decoupled"), the major source of noise now is the 3.5 drive (i need a major case rework to improve this)

i configured sk3 and noctua redux to start at 900rpm (they can go as low as 500/600rpm)
they spin around 1200rpm when the cpu reach 55° (the max temp i get at this speed is 60°, with prime95 or gaming)
atm i cannot tell the difference between 900/1200rpm (need to check this night when the enviroment is more quiet)

i'm impressed with scyte katana 3, compact, cheap, silent, good ram clearance.
i'll trash the arctic freezer 13 and default with it on my next builds (seems perfect up to i5-6600 and all the 65w amds cpu).


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 Post subject: Re: Improve X4 845 stock cooler and make it quieter
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 9:45 am 
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Thanks for sharing :wink: : did you try the stock Scythe fan? :?:

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Luca

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 Post subject: Re: Improve X4 845 stock cooler and make it quieter
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 10:12 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2016 5:02 am
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yes, i'm using the scythe stock fan; the noctua redux is the exhaust fan on the back
i configured them via bios to go nearly at the same speed according to the cpu temp
the noctua max out at 1600rpm (not fully quiet at this speed)
the stock scythe can go up to 2700rpm (VERY noisy at this speed, quite impressive range anyway)


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