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 Post subject: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 12:42 am 
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Location: Romania
The place where i usually get fans was out of the black and white 3 pin Nexus 120 so i bought the clear plastic 120 PWM. I had a faint idea it wasn't that silent but i thought "how bad can it be?".
Well. It's bad.
For one, the PWM sucks. My Gigabyte GA-Z77-DS3H runs the fan at a minimum of 1200 rpm. With the fan mounted in the back of the case, pushing air out, I hear the noise from my chair even though the case is under the desk and the fan faces the wall, not me. It's louder than the original Antec fan that I wanted to replace because it had so much dust in it i thought it's beyond cleaning.
Bonus, if i put my head under the desk i hear an extra whirring from the same fan. I think this is not related to the rotation speed but to how the motor is done.
Don't tell me about SpeedFan and friends, I triple boot and any non hardware/bios solution is useless.

So what's good, besides the black-and-white Nexus? Nanoxia? Arctic cooling? Non PWM Noctuas? Should I just clean up my Antec fan? :)

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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 1:34 am 
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Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 3:47 am
Posts: 11
What was the control system for your Antec fan? Specifically, was it PWM? The Nexus PWM fan may indeed have a design defect, but more likely, your motherboard is not set to allow the minimum PWM speed (0% duty cycle). I'm not familiar with the Gigabyte GA-Z77-DS3H, but my similar MSI motherboard has bios settings that adjust the PWM fan's speed. When I set my motherboard PWM controller setting to 0%/70C in BIOS (at bootup) the Nexus D12SL-12PWM runs in the 800 RPM range.
http://www.silentpcreview.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=575466
It can be run even slower by using voltage control or a different PWM controller.
torp wrote:
So what's good, besides the black-and-white Nexus? Nanoxia? Arctic cooling? Non PWM Noctuas?
#### General FAQ #### wrote:
Q: Can someone recommend me a good (heatsink/powersupply/case/fan/hard drive)?
A: Yes.
http://www.silentpcreview.com/Recommended_Fans


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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 2:34 am 
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Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2009 5:06 am
Posts: 27
Location: Romania
nojunk wrote:
What was the control system for your Antec fan? Specifically, was it PWM? The Nexus PWM fan may indeed have a design defect, but more likely, your motherboard is not set to allow the minimum PWM speed (0% duty cycle). I'm not familiar with the Gigabyte GA-Z77-DS3H, but my similar MSI motherboard has bios settings that adjust the PWM fan's speed. When I set my motherboard PWM controller setting to 0%/70C in BIOS (at bootup) the Nexus D12SL-12PWM runs in the 800 RPM range.
http://www.silentpcreview.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=575466
It can be run even slower by using voltage control or a different PWM controller.
torp wrote:
So what's good, besides the black-and-white Nexus? Nanoxia? Arctic cooling? Non PWM Noctuas?
#### General FAQ #### wrote:
Q: Can someone recommend me a good (heatsink/powersupply/case/fan/hard drive)?
A: Yes.
http://www.silentpcreview.com/Recommended_Fans


I mostly wanted to post to reinforce that the Nexus PWM is crap, to prevent others from making the mistake i made.

Gigabyte just has a "PWM duty cycle" which i set to the minimum which is 0.75 - something - per degree celsius. Or a "silent" setting which isn't silent.
The Antec was using the fanmate-like thingy that came with the antec one hundred case, set on low. Constant speed. It was good when the case was new, but I've been lazy with the dust.

Thanks for the guide link, as usual I can't find most of these fans in Romania :)
I'll just clean the Antec 120 (which seems to be on the recommended list) or order a few white voltage controlled Nexus-es online before they disappear out of every store. I do have one in another system and it's inaudible. Not sure if i feel lazy or cheap yet, but that's my problem to solve.

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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 4:48 am 
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Joined: Mon May 16, 2011 11:23 am
Posts: 607
Location: Germany
You could try some of Arctic Cooling fans with the Antec fanmate. http://www.arctic.ac/en/p/cooling/case- ... tml?c=2183

Those Artics are tolerable quiet when hooked up to 5V/7V or 9V. To make it clear: There are roughly half a dozen fans performing slightly better right out of the box, but in my experience those Acrtic fans are reasonable quiet for their buying price.

€: But stay away from the "pro" and "pwm" versions.


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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Wed Jun 26, 2013 7:12 am 
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Location: Romania
In case anyone wonders how the saga ended, I gave up on the PWM and plugged the fan through a fanmate. Had to cut off a bit of plastic to make the 4 pin connector fit the 3 pin fanmate. With the voltage control in the lowest 1/4, it's now silent. Not sure if it does any good, the airflow seems a bit lower than the previous fan.
Well, i have a/c in the room. It will do.

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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Wed Jun 26, 2013 7:55 am 
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Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 3:47 am
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Edit: Did you know that you could put a piece of small single-strand wire (called "TTL gauge" here in the US, just strip the very ends of it before you insert it) into the unused PWM pin of your fan and force it to run at 0% duty cycle ~500 rpm. This is a workaround for your apparent lack of a PWM controller with a 0% PWM duty setting. Obviously you *dont'* do this with the fan plugged into a PWM socket or you create a short circuit. Also, you don't use this at the same time as a low Fanmate voltage, or you might stall the fan. Also, you might prefer your current solution;-)

I'm glad you made it work - now at least you have something to do the cooling work for now. You could always clean the Antec at your leisure.

I'm working on a controller for my own Nexus 120 PWMs that supports *both* voltage control (~12v to ~10.8v) and PWM control. Eventually I plan to upgrade it to support two PWM fans. I'm using the DIY fan controller information on this site (and others).


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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Wed Jun 26, 2013 2:00 pm 
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Location: UK
nojunk wrote:
I'm working on a controller for my own Nexus 120 PWMs that supports *both* voltage control (~12v to ~10.8v) and PWM control.

There are some models of Scythe fans that do precisely this such as the Slip Stream 140 PWM Adjustable VR. There is a 120mm model as well. It involves a PCI bracket (pictured below) fitted with a potentiometer and a switch. The effect in PWM mode with this particular fan is to create a range of speeds varying from 500 to 1200 rpm at the low setting and 650 to 1700 rpm at the high setting. The VR (voltage) mode allows a 500 to 1700 rpm speed range.

Advantages: no software involved, works with any operating system. In PWM mode a preferred idle speed can be easily dialled in. This does not interfere with normal PWM operation. It does involve balancing lower idle speeds against a reduced top speed. Not electronic, so does not cause effects on fans such as buzzing, clicking, whining etc. Can be used on PWM chains, allowing individual fan adjustment with overall PWM control.

Disadvantages: PCI bracket can be difficult to access, additional wiring adds to cable mess inside the case.

Image


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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Wed Jun 26, 2013 10:17 pm 
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Location: Romania
To be honest I prefer fans spinning at a constant low speed to temperature adjusted fans; the noise "quality" change with load is more annoying than a constant whoosh. This PWM experience just reinforced that.
Come to think of it, I'm not so sure I *need* a case fan. This is an Ivy Bridge i7 with an Asus 660. The case fan is right after the CPU cooler, pulling air in the seme direction. It may even hinder more than help :)
I don't remember hearing the cpu/video/power supply fans spinning up even during extended gaming sessions. Of course, I was kind of busy gaming.
In normal use, which for me is mostly writing code in an IDE, sometimes in a virtual machine, the CPU doesn't go over 45 degrees. I've almost never seen all 4+4 "cores" busy.

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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 6:28 am 
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torp wrote:
To be honest I prefer fans spinning at a constant low speed to temperature adjusted fans; the noise "quality" change with load is more annoying than a constant whoosh. This PWM experience just reinforced that.

It all depends on what kind of system we are talking about. It's pretty sweet to be able to build a powerful gaming system that also can be used for quiet office work. Low power idle states and clever fan control makes this a possibility.

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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Fri Jul 05, 2013 5:54 am 
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torp wrote:
To be honest I prefer fans spinning at a constant low speed to temperature adjusted fans; the noise "quality" change with load is more annoying than a constant whoosh. This PWM experience just reinforced that.
Did you know that PWM fans are *not* temperature-controlled? The PWM input can be connected to a constant signal (for example, ground) or to a variable signal (for example, a temperature-based controller like the one in a motherboard). I would prefer that you not bash the PWM fan for the fact that you are not satisfied with your motherboard's variable temperature-controlled PWM signal.

torp wrote:
I'm not so sure I *need* a case fan. This is an Ivy Bridge i7 with an Asus 660. The case fan is right after the CPU cooler, pulling air in the seme direction.
I'm also not sure you need one, but I know that I don't. My Ivy Bridge i5/MSI Z77 system has two heat sink fans and a power supply fan and this is more than enough to keep all of my system's integrated digital thermistor thermometers at the same temperature as the environment, within their margin of error, when idle.


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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Fri Jul 05, 2013 10:50 am 
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I bought one of these Nexus PWM fans a few years ago, after many happy experiences with the 3-pin Nexus (SPCR's reference fan forever). It was total crap. I threw it away.

Remember when Ford was a top brand and then they brought out the Pinto? :oops:

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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2013 11:09 pm 
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nojunk wrote:
Did you know that PWM fans are *not* temperature-controlled? The PWM input can be connected to a constant signal (for example, ground) or to a variable signal (for example, a temperature-based controller like the one in a motherboard). I would prefer that you not bash the PWM fan for the fact that you are not satisfied with your motherboard's variable temperature-controlled PWM signal.

I kind of agree with you. It's not the PWM specifically that needs bashing, but the implementation on this motherboard (GA-Z77-DS3H).
But the part that deserves the most bashing here is the Nexus fan, which is much louder than the previous, non PWM implementation. At any speed, even if not used as a PWM fan.
Sadly, mentioning the PWM is the most clear way to distinguish the old Nexus from the new Nexus.

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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Thu Jul 18, 2013 1:35 pm 
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I bought two same kinds of fans, and have been happy with them for a few years. Not perfect, but they're on a HTPC that's a bit far, so it's OK.

However in the last few weeks I started to experiment with them to improve things - and noticed, that at BIOS's "AUTO" setting, my MB uses Voltage control instead of PWM (how odd, I'd presume PWM is preferred?). I know this, since in Linux, if I set to voltage controlled, pwm1 device read 2 (which means BIOS controlled), but at PWM control mode, pwm3 read 2. Both pwm1 and pwm3 devices control the same fan, with the exception that when controlling trough pwm1, the fan stops around ~60 (of maximum of 255, I need ~70 to restart), whereas when using pwm3, the range is from 1 to 255. So the pwm3 gives more precision in adjustement (oh, btw., pwm2 is my second fan, which, although is a 4-pin header in the MB; can only be voltage-controlled - according to BIOS options, and also in Linux; there's only 1 pwm file associated with it).

(Oh and sorry, the above may be gibberish to those who are not using Linux and / or are not familiar how the fan controlling works in linux ;-). In short, a pwmX is a file in sysfs, that represents the FAN controller, and is used by software to control the fan connected to it - or a priviledged user can fiddle with it manually. Every file has a pwmX_enable, that can be read to get the mode the fan is in, or written; 0=disabled (full speed), 1=manual (or software), 2=BIOS).

How can I deduce from the above that at AUTO setting, the BIOS uses voltage control instead of PWM? That brings me to the bottom line - and the reason I replied - is, that I noticed that when I use PWM with these fans (or the one that can be PWM-controlled) - they start to sing! I mean, not in a nice way, but a very annoying way :evil:. From Linuxes behaviour, readouts at pwmX_enable (0=disabled, 1=manual, 2=BIOS) and my ears I deduced the BIOS's behaviour (When I set BIOS to PWM, the singing starts, and goes away at "auto" or "voltage control" - or "disabled", for that matter; but also, if I set in Linux pwm3 to manual, the singing starts, but if pwm3 is disabled and pwm1 and manual, the singing stops).

The noise so annoying, that although PWM would be more accurate than voltage-controlled, it makes the whole purpose of controlling the fan speed moot since the "singing" - or whining, whirring, not sure which word I should use do describe it - is so annoying (even at 500RPM). Also, I have to note that the whining intensity is in no way connected to the RPM - it's only somewhat lower at a low RPM, as on a higher RPM - and non-existent (even at the same RPM, or actually any RPM) when voltage-controlled.

I've read in many places that some fans make a clicking sound when PWM-controlled, but this sounds anything but clicking to me. But it's probably related to those issues.

Also, I've had some stability issues on my MB (not too disturbing, they come and go away for a long time - and were GPU -related, I can compile away as much as I like without any issues). Also, I've noticed that the fans never really ramp up, even at high load, when BIOS-controlled. When I found this thread, I started to wonder, that maybe the temperatures that I've seen (that I've thoguht were bogus, as Linux's lm_sensors doesn't actually tell from where a reading is made, and sometimes they are erroneus) actually are my NB temperatures (at idle, 85°C, at load, 98°C, or maybe have been even more since I haven't been watching - when fans are BIOS-controlled)!

So, after installing and enablign some SW fan controlling that really ramps up the fans when at full load, the stability issues seem to be gone. Either that or it was a loose cable I've havent found previously (I've been upgrading the hardware a bit, so something that was loose might have come properly inserted). Also, as a bonus, now my HTPC is more quiet at light load than it was before! (but, of course loud when doing something CPU/GPU/NB-intensive, like blasting demons heads off, but I wont hear the fans behind the shotgun noise anyways).

Doesn't help the OP, and the crappy BIOS control - but does re-instate that SW fan controlling is a solution in some cases - either for noise, but sometimes it's also inadequate for cooling. Just beware of the PWM, it can cause weird noises sometimes! Try voltage-control instead, it might not actually be the fan.

Just my 2¢, wanted to share my experiences.


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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2013 6:13 am 
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The OP has been using Linux for years, including software development for Linux/embedded Linux.
All these years, he has never bothered to figure out how to set up lmsensors, which is why he prefers BIOS or simply hardware based solutions.
The Nexus 120 PWM fan that he was whining about is humming along silently on voltage control from a FanMate.
The OP is hackintoshing these days, and on that road software fan control is even more difficult to do.
Also, the OP has since bought two voltage controlled Nexus 120 mm fans which are waiting unopened for the 120 PWM to become dusty and annoying enough to swap again.

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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2013 1:27 am 
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The problem with most PWM fans is they run at faster speeds than non PWM ones
The Nexus one can go up to 2000rpm (as usual some samples can be a bit over or under)

I've no idea why you'd want that kind of fan rotation myself.
I've tended to stick to voltage control myself, but for builds where I've used PWM fans. I've gone for the Gelid ones, their equivalent 120mm fan runs at around 1500 rpm max, though some go up to 2000rpm. Again not sure why that is, but in field use the Gelid fans I've used are quite smooth sounding, and very satisfactory at lower speeds, and not uncomfortable at higher ones. But I'd be surprised to see one running at full speed unless you were doing a fairly meaty over clock or something.

Nexus 80mm PWM goes up to 2800rpm!

There are plenty of alternatives out there PWM wise various makers. Nexus are not really worth looking at, they're still riding the wave for their decent but not long lasting basic range.


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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2013 4:56 pm 
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Location: Seattle
I can also testify to the badness of the Nexus 120 PWM. The one I'm returning made a high-frequency chirp every few seconds, in addition to other poor sonic qualities. The chirp did not diminish at lower speeds.

Guess I'll try the Scythe or Noiseblocker PWMs, or give up on the whole PWM thing.


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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2013 5:17 pm 
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colin2 wrote:
Guess I'll try the Scythe or Noiseblocker PWMs, or give up on the whole PWM thing.
Try Scythe first, with slipstreams you can drop them really low, around 250rpm or ramp them to 1300rpm, very nice fans, just very hard to find in the US, Scythe "SLIP-STREAM PWM" 120x25mm Case Fan - Sleeved

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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2013 9:53 pm 
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Abula wrote:

So, not surprisingly, that link brings up 'Out of Stock'. However from the same source the Noctua NF-P12 PWM. The P12 has a speed range of 300 to 1300 rpm with an included Low Noise Adapter to hold down top speed to 900 rpm under PWM control. Yes, it is about $13 more than the Scythe but you do get a complete fitting kit including a Y cable to chain the fan off the CPU PWM fan header. Also supplied is a PWM extension cable and rubber mounts. Using the Silent BIOS option in Asus motherboards or the more recent boards from Gigabyte it is not unrealistic to expect idle speeds of 300 to 400 rpm from the P12, effectively silent.


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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2013 10:19 pm 
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I recently bought the brand-new Noctua NF-S12A PWM (120mm, the latest revision, arguably THE quietest among their products) which replaced my previous case fan, Arctic Cooling F12 (120mm). I can attest to the quietness of NF-S12A running at around 600rpm. It's considerably quieter than Arctic F12.

YMMV.

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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 5:23 am 
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The problem that i see with noctuas is even if they are advertising very low rpms to their new line

Noctua NF-F12 PWM 120mm Fan ---> Min. Rotational Speed (PWM) 300 RPM
Noctua NF-S12A PWM 120mm Fan ----> Min. Rotational Speed (PWM) 300 RPM
Noctua NF-A14 PWM 140mm Fan ----> Min. Rotational Speed (PWM) 300 RPM
Noctua NF-A15 PWM 150mm FAN ----> Min. Rotational Speed (PWM) 300 RPM

Its like noctua standarized all their pwm to be able to drop to 300rpm, but in reallity doesnt seem like this is the case. From SPCR First 140 mm Fan Roundup: Noctua, Phanteks, Xigmatek, page 3 on NF-A15,

Image

No 300rpm as advertised by Noctua, not sure if this is the case with the rest, but in noctuas defense, i believe Asus motherboards and FanXpert2 dont treat all headers the same (only CPU_FAN is truly a PWM header), so from that picture its can be seen its used on chassis fan header so this could be the issue that the fan doesn't drop to the advertised 300rpm. Personally im still considering their 140/150mm line out of not having that many options for Fractal Design Define R4.

But there are some options, for example the fan that comes on the Archon, Silver Arrow SBE and probably on the new upcoming HR-22, Thermalright TY-150 PWM fan, according to thermlaright website, Fan Speed : 500~1100RPM (PWM), but im my personal experience like with the TY 140/141/147, this fans were rated 900-1300rpm on PWM, but motherboard like Intel, MSI and Asus were able to drop it to 700rpms, this is also the case here with TY150, from SPCR Fan Roundup #6: Scythe, Noiseblocker, Antec, Nexus, Thermalright

Image

Enough of the big fans and derailing the thread, was just to prove a point. Back to 120mm that are more commonly wished by most, i recently rebuild my gaming setup (MICROMI), and this time i did had fanxpert2 with the GENE VI, and this is how Noiseblocker NB-BlackSilentPro PLPS 120mm x 25mm Ultra Quiet PWM Fan - 600-1500 RPM - 8-24 dBA do on it,

Image

From that FanXpert2 graph/test, you can see that the fan is fully controllable from 0-100%, but its different than lets say the Thermalright above, as it starts from 0%, a lot of motherboards have 20% as miniumum thresholds, so this will limit the fan to 905rpms, with fanxpert i can overide this and use the full control like you see in the bottom of the pic where my two PLPS are running at 648/639 respectively. Noiseblocker imo sound great, just their PWM design of rpm or control is not as good in terms of not dropping that low, if they were to allow let say 200rpm for 0% and then grown on it would be great, but they start on 650rpm, so this imo is to high for 0% threshold (specially since most motherboards have 20% restriction), either way they are good fans but not as good in their design as Scythe Slipstream PWM.

As a final note i do want test personally some noctua fans, specially out of not bieng able to get Scythe fans in US, i want to see if they can dropped off to their advertise 300rpm on the CPU header with Asus motherboard with fanXpert2, i might order some fans on september and test, just its a pain to take out my motherboard to use this fans headers, but i have plans on moving toward R4 before years end, so i gotta test some fans for that build. But im still undecided, the build will be decided upon what CPU cooler i use, if i go with Noctua NH-D15 ill try to work out with 140mm noctua pwm fans, but if the Thermalright HR22 comes out sooner (i believe it will), with TY150 being able to drop so low, i probably gona go with some Antec True Quiet 140mm, even though not PWM fans they can droped really low, and let fanXpert2 do its magic.

Image

For all people looking for 120mm PWM fans, i strongly suggest you give a shot to Scythe Slipstreams PWM, their range is really great 300-1300rpm and i have tested even on bios on Intel and really wonderful fans, or their new iteration that seems the same just with the blades with some texture/grooves, Scythe Glidestream, i believe the replacement will be Scythe GlideStream 120 PWM fan (SY1225HB12M-P), just impossible to get them on the US, but Europe and Asia should be fine.

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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 9:20 am 
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Abula wrote:
Its like noctua standarized all their pwm to be able to drop to 300rpm, but in reallity doesnt seem like this is the case.
...No 300rpm as advertised by Noctua...

Sorry you have got this wrong.

As these are all PWM fans, the advertised rpm can only be achieved by using a CPU PWM header, the CPU_OPT PWM header on some Asus and Gigabyte boards or by a PWM splitter cable (Noctua supply one of these as standard). That does not seem unreasonable to me. Like all PWM fans they can be driven by voltage control, such as by being plugged into 3-pin chassis fan headers. However the performance of any PWM fan used as a 3 pin fan will not necessarily reflect its performance while running under PWM control. The advertised minimum 300 rpm claimed by Noctua can be achieved at around 20% PWM duty cycle for those motherboards that can drop this low. As already mentioned in this thread, that includes Asus motherboards with the Silent profile BIOS option and the more recent Gigabyte boards which also have a Silent BIOS profile choice. In the case of Asus motherboards the Silent BIOS option alone will be enough. Where Fan Xpert is available, it can be useful but is not essential.


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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 9:49 am 
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lodestar wrote:
Abula wrote:
Its like noctua standarized all their pwm to be able to drop to 300rpm, but in reallity doesnt seem like this is the case.
...No 300rpm as advertised by Noctua...

Sorry you have got this wrong.

As these are all PWM fans, the advertised rpm can only be achieved by using a CPU PWM header, the CPU_OPT PWM header on some Asus and Gigabyte boards or by a PWM splitter cable (Noctua supply one of these as standard). That does not seem unreasonable to me. Like all PWM fans they can be driven by voltage control, such as by being plugged into 3-pin chassis fan headers. However the performance of any PWM fan used as a 3 pin fan will not necessarily reflect its performance while running under PWM control. The advertised minimum 300 rpm claimed by Noctua can be achieved at around 20% PWM duty cycle for those motherboards that can drop this low. As already mentioned in this thread, that includes Asus motherboards with the Silent profile BIOS option and the more recent Gigabyte boards which also have a Silent BIOS profile choice. In the case of Asus motherboards the Silent BIOS option alone will be enough. Where Fan Xpert is available, it can be useful but is not essential.
If you were to reach my full post you would have read that i said in noctuas defense.... where i also agree into it could been the way the fans were tested into what Header they were used, but out of not having a fan to test atm i can only guide my self into what SPCR has tested, and this is how they tested the Noctua NF-A15. I will test them down the line, as there are not that many options for PWM fans on 140s.

Would be great if you could post a screenshot of you noctua PWM fan operating on the CPU_FAN header running at 300rpm on any software like HWmotior?

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GameMi >> MSI Z87-GD65 | Intel Core i7-4790K | Thermalright Silver Arrow IBE + 3x Noctua NF-A15 PWM @500rpms| Crucial Ballistix Sport 32GB DDR3 1600 | nVidia GTX780 + ARCTIC Accelero Xtreme IV | Samsung SA850 27'' 2560x1440 | Samsung 840pro 512GB | Hitachi 7K1000 1TB | Fractal Design Define R4 + 4x Noctua NF-A14 PWM @450rpm | SeaSonic SS-860XP2
Other builds ---> ServeMi | CamMi | MiniMi | HTPCMi


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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 11:36 am 
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I have published Fan Xpert callibration data for Noctua PWM fans - in PWM mode - on SPCR on several occasions. This is an example, about half way down the page, from November last year http://www.silentpcreview.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=64339&start=60. As you will note Fan Xpert calibrates the NF-P12 PWM at 299 rpm at 20% duty cycle. As PWM control is thermal actual fan speeds can be above this figure, in this instance an idle speed of 350rpm. The higher speed is due to the influence of ambient temperature.

abdula wrote:
...this is how they tested the Noctua NF-A15. I will test them down the line, as there are not that many options for PWM fans on 140s.

I build and modify PCs for family members, most of whom are gamers. The latest project is to fit a Noctua NF-A14 PWM fan, this seems to be a conventional 140mm version of the NF-A15. If you're interested I can supply the Fan Xpert calibration data for this fan in PWM mode. Incidentally I have not yet calibrated this fan with Fan Xpert so I have no idea what the numbers will be. I will carry out a second calibration using the supplied Low Noise Adapter to see what effect that has.


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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 2:34 pm 
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The Noctua NF-A14 PWM fan has a conventional 140mm frame but the specification is different to the NF-A15. The NF-A15 has a specified top speed of 1200 rpm. The A14 PWM top speed is claimed as 1500 rpm or 1200 rpm with the Low Noise Adapter (LNA).

Running this fan under PWM mode and calibrating it with Fan Xpert gives these figures (duty cycle percent and fan speed):

20% 342
30% 463
40% 680
50% 781
60% 1004
70% 1171
80% 1240
90% 1406
100% 1577

With LNA

20% 332
30% 463
40% 570
50% 753
60% 878
70% 981
80% 1054
90% 1110
100% 1171


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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 3:33 pm 
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Thank you loadstar, really appreciate the information and the numbers specially this gives me a clear picture into what to expect.

My initial plan was to wait for Noctua NH-D15 which should include two Noctua NF-A15 PWM, and for case fans to use 3x the NF-A14 PWM, using a Akasa 5 pwm splitter to control all fans from the CPU_FAN socket (maybe one from the opt just to see the rpms from the two different fans). Something that i didnt notice is what you just posted, A15 has 1200 rpm max, and A14 has 1500rpm max, but both come from 300rpm on 20% if i guess correctly, so it should be very similar at idle but A14 should ramp higher as temps goes up. Btw since you have tested lots of noctuas and done builds for your family, would you think its a good idea what im planning in terms of using 2x A15 for cpu and 3x A14 for case fans and all being controlled by single CPU FAN headder with akasa splitter? the idea also is to test without FanXpert, this is why i was thinking on using pure PWM fans and all controlled by CPU_fan header, i would prefer if i dont have to load extra software but its not a big deal if i have to use fanXpert, its just more a wish.

Again thanks for the numbers you save me having to prebuy them to test =)

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GameMi >> MSI Z87-GD65 | Intel Core i7-4790K | Thermalright Silver Arrow IBE + 3x Noctua NF-A15 PWM @500rpms| Crucial Ballistix Sport 32GB DDR3 1600 | nVidia GTX780 + ARCTIC Accelero Xtreme IV | Samsung SA850 27'' 2560x1440 | Samsung 840pro 512GB | Hitachi 7K1000 1TB | Fractal Design Define R4 + 4x Noctua NF-A14 PWM @450rpm | SeaSonic SS-860XP2
Other builds ---> ServeMi | CamMi | MiniMi | HTPCMi


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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 11:14 pm 
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Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 3:29 am
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Location: UK
Abula wrote:
...would you think its a good idea what im planning in terms of using 2x A15 for cpu and 3x A14 for case fans and all being controlled by single CPU FAN headder with akasa splitter?
Yes, that will work fine. All the power for the fans will be drawn from the Sata connector if you use an Akasa Flexa cable. Only the control signal will be drawn from the CPU PWM header. I have used the Flexa cables both FP3 and FP5 as well as the AK-CB002.

If you use a PWM splitter cable just setting the Silent profile in the BIOS of an Asus motherboard will hold down fan speeds to minimal levels (typically 300 to 400 rpm) at idle and low system load until the CPU temperature reaches around 40C. There is no need to use Fan Xpert but you can run it under Windows as a monitoring tool.

Akasa Flexa cables are not available in America or Canada; Newegg carry an AK-CB002 equivalent, the Rosewill Model RCW-FPS-401.


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 Post subject: Re: Bought a Nexus 120 PWM, big mistake
PostPosted: Sun Aug 25, 2013 10:36 pm 
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Location: Guatemala
Hey loadstar, you got thinking and planning my next build... =), bought some noctuas to test in many Asus FanXpert2 and BIOS and on MSI bios (testing next week on friends pc), I manage to test a lot of fans this weekend, NF-A14 PWM and NF-A15, TY150, interestingly the GENE IV has different numbers on your NF-A14 PWM on FanXpert2,

Image

Image

I also tested your suggestion on pure bios, on silent profile (manual doesnt allow below 40%), but im no where near the numbers that i can get with fanXpert2, still pretty good, but i wanted to be close on bios,

Image

Going to test MSI Bios in the next days, a friend has a MSI Z77GA43 that i built for him, so i want to go test there the same fans to see how it does, ill porbably start a new thread comparing them as im derailing this thread.

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GameMi >> MSI Z87-GD65 | Intel Core i7-4790K | Thermalright Silver Arrow IBE + 3x Noctua NF-A15 PWM @500rpms| Crucial Ballistix Sport 32GB DDR3 1600 | nVidia GTX780 + ARCTIC Accelero Xtreme IV | Samsung SA850 27'' 2560x1440 | Samsung 840pro 512GB | Hitachi 7K1000 1TB | Fractal Design Define R4 + 4x Noctua NF-A14 PWM @450rpm | SeaSonic SS-860XP2
Other builds ---> ServeMi | CamMi | MiniMi | HTPCMi


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