Search found 113 matches

by jafb2000
Sat Apr 01, 2006 2:09 pm
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Panaflo L1A vs. L1BX
Replies: 5
Views: 2107

In immitable words of Michael Caine, not a lot of people know... Acoustic signature variation on Panaflo (fans starting FB)... o Panasonic: "different date codes will have used different IC's" o Panasonic: "we do switch around the IC's based upon price and availability" o Panasonic: "Perhaps we are ...
by jafb2000
Thu Jan 05, 2006 5:19 pm
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Best 80mm fans for silence?
Replies: 24
Views: 8172

FBA09A12L1BX... o Manufacturers data -- 42.7cfm, 27dB(A) ---- at 12V operation, 22oC, 65% RH o Testing to ---- ANSI S12.11-1987 method on all DC fan motors ---- Testing also to JIS C 9603:1988, DIN 45635 Appendix A of Part 38 ---- Testing also to BS848 1966 Part 2 & ISO R266-1975 ---- ISO 7779 is us...
by jafb2000
Thu Jan 05, 2006 1:10 pm
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Best 80mm fans for silence?
Replies: 24
Views: 8172

That should say... Majority of blue-chip & mid-sellers globally use... o OEM spec ---- usually cut-down spec as my example shows ---- this can involve irritating proprietarisation :-) o Surplus spec ---- new when it is in fact recycled parts ------- saleable return laptop, PC + saleable components o...
by jafb2000
Thu Jan 05, 2006 12:39 pm
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Best 80mm fans for silence?
Replies: 24
Views: 8172

FBA08A12L1BX... o Never a stock item released to distributors ---- uses different PCB & older motor ---- uses non soft-edged switching on the chipset o Only released to OEMs to an OEM specification ---- different bearing grade, less oil, cheaper specs Any available are surplus only... o Panasonic/Mi...
by jafb2000
Sun Jun 05, 2005 4:29 am
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: My latest batch of 80mm Panaflo fans - Not Good
Replies: 19
Views: 5012

There are various series of Panaflo's... ____________________________________________ Geriatric Liquidation Stock - various makers... o Source ---- old warranty reserve, old supplier stock as exit supply chain ---- typically Clearance, Surplus suppliers, Ebay clearance o Quality ---- some may be fin...
by jafb2000
Sat Mar 12, 2005 2:52 pm
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Minebea Panaflos?
Replies: 24
Views: 12444

I'm dissappointed. However, the 01 etc are the older Japan and non current. It comes down to a "blip in the middle": o Early-2003 to Early-2004 -- 3C to 4B ---- acoustic QC variation from outsourcing - initially China, then Japan ---- by 3C I had to use noticeable hand selection (15/100) ---- by 4A ...
by jafb2000
Tue Mar 08, 2005 9:53 am
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Minebea Panaflos?
Replies: 24
Views: 12444

Noted - and USA tends to have hard (true hardwood) floors where any noise will carry and reflect quite remarkably. It seems there is a strong case for an S1A. You may know... o Panasonic Panaflo pilotted a new fan in late 2003 ---- technically H2-2003, it was actually just Nov-Dec o It was called th...
by jafb2000
Tue Mar 08, 2005 8:15 am
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Minebea Panaflos?
Replies: 24
Views: 12444

Hang on a minute - 5V ?? Minimum operating voltages are: o Papst 8-15V -- NATO fave o NMB 6-13.8V -- don't get excited o Panaflo 7-13.8V -- don't get excited below 7V You are triggering the locked-rotor stall logic at 5V. All my testing is done @ 12V - 12.01V. I've no idea how they perform at 5V, it...
by jafb2000
Tue Mar 08, 2005 8:04 am
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Minebea Panaflos?
Replies: 24
Views: 12444

I don't find 3 as a representative sample, at all. o Individual packed fans are subject to handling/shipping o Crated fans have that partly reduced My comments are from testing over 11,000 fans in 2004. No point sending out bad only for it to come back. 80mm L o Old Panasonic China & Old Panasonic J...
by jafb2000
Tue Mar 08, 2005 6:54 am
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Minebea Panaflos?
Replies: 24
Views: 12444

No - sorry I was not clear. Global distributors have several production codes of 80mm L. Some are latest M3 models o 4H 4G 4F in L1A -- 85% superb, 10% great, 5% not acceptable o Single pure tone -- better than the old Panasonic Japan/China fans Some are old Panasonic models o 3C in L1BS -- 70% infe...
by jafb2000
Tue Mar 08, 2005 3:37 am
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Minebea Panaflos?
Replies: 24
Views: 12444

All fans are hand picked irrespective of the buyer :-) Consistency wise: o Older fans -- about 3-5 levels of acoustic variation ---- from few-tone to multi-tone-this-one-is-kirk-cobaine's-voice (30%) o Recent fans -- about 2 levels of acoustic variation ---- pure single-tone (85%) to muted-few-tone ...
by jafb2000
Mon Mar 07, 2005 12:38 pm
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Minebea Panaflos?
Replies: 24
Views: 12444

Couple of notes to add... o Some fans are OEM - so different codes o Starting 9, or a letter is an example These changes are quite normal - and incremental. o Unless you have a particularly bad old model o There is little to particularly gain from a new model o However if buying, it is worth conside...
by jafb2000
Mon Mar 07, 2005 6:53 am
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Minebea Panaflos?
Replies: 24
Views: 12444

In brief. ______________ Identifying M3: Panaflo fans have 2 lines of codes on the label: o 1st-line -- production year / month / date / plant + fan option code ---- eg, "4F23**** - 1A" o 2nd-line -- part number ---- eg, "FBA08A12L" M3 fans started in June 2004: o 1st-line starts 4F or later ---- 4F...
by jafb2000
Tue Feb 08, 2005 10:44 am
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Sale: Panaflo 80mm L1A @ $5.00 CAD
Replies: 9
Views: 2598

You can get guaranteed japanese panoflos at this site. That's really what you want. I think they are $7 apiece. If the picture code is correct, that is a 5yr old design. April 2004 - Panasonic Panaflo ceased. o Minebea & Panaflo merged after long working together ---- Minebea/NMB = Ball-bearings, F...
by jafb2000
Sun Aug 08, 2004 2:50 pm
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Abnormalities in individual fans
Replies: 4
Views: 1172

A common spec for fans is 10%. However, depending on the make that can be a "catch-all". o EBM-Papst generally 1-2% o Panaflo generally vary 1-1.4% For example, qty-100 1900rpm Panaflo fans vary: o rpm - spec 1900rpm, TQM data is 1911, 1915, 1922 re 1/2/3 s.d. o current - spec 71ma, TQM data is 51, ...
by jafb2000
Sun Aug 08, 2004 2:39 pm
Forum: The Silent Front
Topic: Shuttle does Pentium M?
Replies: 2
Views: 1271

A P-M on the desktop would be an interesting development. Indicative of how SFF / laptop seem to be converging somewhat. Not too sure how competitive it would be against the obvious Athlon Desktop board with Mobile-Athlon - a nice combination. The P4 architecture is somewhat tired: o Intel competed ...
by jafb2000
Sun Aug 08, 2004 1:57 pm
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Panaflo L1J?
Replies: 39
Views: 15582

That is how the fans come out of the crate. Panaflo codes follow the form "FB-A-08A-12-L-1AX" o FB (Fan Type) ---- FB - Panaflo Tubeaxial Fan o A (Bearing Type) ---- A = Hydrowave Fluid Bearing ---- K = Ball-Bearing (NMB I believe) ---- E = Pivot Bearing (cheaper form of fluid bearing) ---- X = big ...
by jafb2000
Sun Aug 08, 2004 5:20 am
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Panaflo L1J?
Replies: 39
Views: 15582

Not in factory crates they don't. o L1A come with 2-wire bare tails ---- more specifically red/black solid-core with bare tinned ends o L1J come with 2-wire 2-pin connector ---- more specifically red/blue stranded with 2-pin connectors There is no code for 4-pin Molex incidentally. 1BX is 3-wire (re...
by jafb2000
Sun Aug 08, 2004 3:39 am
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Panaflo L1J?
Replies: 39
Views: 15582

Coincidence :-) o Panaflo L1A & L1J are the same, China or Japan o 1A means 2-wire bare-wire-tails, 1J means 2-wire 2-pin-tails About signals: o TACHO SIGNAL - only exists on 1BX option code fans ---- L1BX is not available (I can get it, but you'll wait 26-38wks) ---- L1BX has a different PCB & Moto...
by jafb2000
Tue May 11, 2004 11:56 am
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Fan noise and PWM
Replies: 38
Views: 17045

Anywhere on the planet can produce good custom PCB fan controllers. However, when you start mentioning: o Customs heatsinks - things get spendy ---- you generally need 250kg of alloy + extrusion die o Standard heatsinks - things are still spendy ---- so they often undersize or don't fit one The few ...
by jafb2000
Mon May 10, 2004 1:24 pm
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Fan noise and PWM
Replies: 38
Views: 17045

*smile*.

You have to play around with PWM frequency and may have
to accept a 60-100% range rather than 50-100% range.

2kHz is a common figure, which isn't particularly pleasant :-)
--
DB.
by jafb2000
Mon May 10, 2004 4:07 am
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Vertical vs. horizontal - what bearings work when?
Replies: 6
Views: 10305

o Vendor - fans (Panaflo, NMB, Papst, some Adda/Delta) o Sleeve - yes, fan blade vertical o Line drawings - Papst & NMB have pictures ---- Panasonic Panaflo have some cut-away drawings ---- however a fluid bearing isn't much to see since they rely on fluid-dynamics ---- the discrete components are s...
by jafb2000
Sat May 08, 2004 2:06 pm
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Vertical vs. horizontal - what bearings work when?
Replies: 6
Views: 10305

Actually Hydrowave is one of 3 fluid-type bearings: o Pivot bearing o Hydrowave bearing o Fluid Dynamic bearing - development of the hydrowave capsule None use ball-bearings. o Pivot bearing gives most of the benefit of Hydrowave at a lower cost, and in SOME fan sizes can be a little quieter (eg, 60...
by jafb2000
Sat May 08, 2004 7:43 am
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: 4 fans evaluated - 120mm (the sequel)
Replies: 27
Views: 25076

> Dang - another thread here asked exactly that question and I advised > the other way! My logic was we were talking undervolted 4412FGL so > the vibrations are low anyway. But also Papst have those little > individual balances: I was hoping these would be turning an average > balnced fan into somet...
by jafb2000
Sat May 08, 2004 5:38 am
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: 4 fans evaluated - 120mm (the sequel)
Replies: 27
Views: 25076

I'm working on it, will take time. New Panaflo fans in stock, the later models as the merger runs in and a few minor changes begin to pan out into fresh distributor stock. Basically it will be when Panaflo distributors also get NMB. Of course, they will be called M3 then as fan maker, but the two ra...
by jafb2000
Fri May 07, 2004 2:41 pm
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: 4 fans evaluated - 120mm (the sequel)
Replies: 27
Views: 25076

> Also... the specs on the Papst seem to have it pushing > 55 cfm at 26dba, do you believe this to be true? Papst do test correctly - but remember the noise is more broadband as the rpm of a 120mm fan rises and particularly in an enclosure since you are moving from the free-air part of the P-Q curve...
by jafb2000
Fri May 07, 2004 2:32 pm
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: 4 fans evaluated - 120mm (the sequel)
Replies: 27
Views: 25076

This isn't cheap, but you forgot one fan: o 120x25mm o NMB 4110KL-04W-B10 Ticking in the tier-1 fans: 1) Foremost design criteria is life over extended temperatures o Temperature: ---- cheapy fans die at high or low temps ---- PSUs run hot, usually dual-ball-bearing specified ---- traffic control ci...
by jafb2000
Fri May 07, 2004 12:59 pm
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Fan noise and PWM
Replies: 38
Views: 17045

For a single fan or a few fans, the Zalman may be cheaper - and
you can probably upgrade it re wattage if you need to re heatsink.
by jafb2000
Fri May 07, 2004 6:10 am
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: Fan noise and PWM
Replies: 38
Views: 17045

PWM problems occur on several levels: 1) PWM Frequency choice o 2kHz -- relatively common in industry, but an audible o 20kHz -- increasingly common trying to get above acoustic range 2) PWM interaction with fan microprocessor o Top fans don't use a simple transistor switching system o They use a mi...
by jafb2000
Tue Mar 02, 2004 2:26 pm
Forum: Fans and Control
Topic: What are the most quiet 120mm and 92mm fans?
Replies: 19
Views: 4821

Yes, "/2" on the end of a papst designation means tacho output, where Papst choose to make it available (production is variable). Be aware Papst is moving under it's "real" name EBM, or EBM-PAPST depending on what locale you are in. Papst isn't a sub-division, but it was used as a segment name for t...