Apple drops tiny, cheap Mac bomb

The forum for non-component-related silent pc discussions.

Moderators: NeilBlanchard, Ralf Hutter, sthayashi, Lawrence Lee

ActionAttackJohn
Posts: 35
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 8:56 pm
Location: NY
Contact:

Apple drops tiny, cheap Mac bomb

Post by ActionAttackJohn » Tue Jan 11, 2005 11:13 am

http://www.apple.com/macmini/

$499 for a 1.25GHz G4, 256mb of DDR, 40GB hard drive, Firewire, USB2, ethernet, etc.

Availiable DVD-R, Bluetooth, and Airport Extreme.

Jobs advertised it during the keynote as "nearly silent".

sthayashi
*Lifetime Patron*
Posts: 3214
Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2003 10:06 am
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

Post by sthayashi » Tue Jan 11, 2005 11:23 am

Oooh. Does anyone know if Macs are compatible with normal monitors out there?

This is actually cheap enough to be in my budget range.
[size=75][url=http://www.twolf1300.net/sthayashi/SPCR/systems.html]My Power Rig, Storage Rig, HTPC and Main Rig[/url][/size]

Tyrdium
Posts: 272
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2004 7:29 am
Location: Boston, MA
Contact:

Post by Tyrdium » Tue Jan 11, 2005 11:23 am

Hot damn! I swear, the thing looks like it's an April Fool's joke... Anywho... DAMN, that thing is powerful for what it is! 's tiny! And cheap!

*continues drooling*
sthayashi wrote:Oooh. Does anyone know if Macs are compatible with normal monitors out there?
The new ones are. This one has DVI/VGA out.

rocarpen
Posts: 42
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 11:42 am
Location: Vancouver, BC

Post by rocarpen » Tue Jan 11, 2005 11:25 am

sthayashi wrote:Oooh. Does anyone know if Macs are compatible with normal monitors out there?
100% compatible.

Image
Dual 1.6 GHz Xeons @ 2.8GHz | Antec 3000B | OCZ PowerStream 520W | PNY GeForceFX 5900

x1m
Posts: 64
Joined: Wed Sep 15, 2004 12:25 pm

Post by x1m » Tue Jan 11, 2005 11:26 am

Tempting, but all the people I know with macs won't shut up about how wonderful they are. Get a real pc! I don't want to be seen as big headed :P
moo?

sthayashi
*Lifetime Patron*
Posts: 3214
Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2003 10:06 am
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

Post by sthayashi » Tue Jan 11, 2005 11:31 am

x1m wrote:Tempting, but all the people I know with macs won't shut up about how wonderful they are. Get a real pc! I don't want to be seen as big headed :P
Actually, the "we don't get viruses" part pisses me off, but it may surprise some to know that I genuinely want to give Apple a fair shake.
Tyrdium wrote:The new ones are. This one has DVI/VGA out.
Just because the port is the same doesn't mean that they're compatible. But you and others say so, I'll trust you.
[size=75][url=http://www.twolf1300.net/sthayashi/SPCR/systems.html]My Power Rig, Storage Rig, HTPC and Main Rig[/url][/size]

MistaMuShu
Posts: 28
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2003 10:22 pm
Location: Albany, CA
Contact:

Remember the Cube?

Post by MistaMuShu » Tue Jan 11, 2005 11:32 am

I'm glad Apple finally goes back to its root of a simple and affordable desktop. I really look foward to checking one out and seeing how well it performs acoustically.
Best of all, Mac mini purrs along at a whisper-quiet sound level, so there’s no reason to hide it under your desk like an old PC to save your ears.
I'd rather have it convection-cooled like the cube, but with such small spaces, I'm skeptical of this 'purr' Apple describes.

rocarpen
Posts: 42
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 11:42 am
Location: Vancouver, BC

Post by rocarpen » Tue Jan 11, 2005 11:33 am

x1m wrote:Tempting, but all the people I know with macs won't shut up about how wonderful they are. Get a real pc! I don't want to be seen as big headed :P
Well if everyone has a Mac, then they won't be 'elitist' anymore, will they? Come on, do your part! Get a mini!

Seriously though, as someone who had to switch from Mac to PC (I do 3D visualizations), I sorely miss the Mac experience. OSX is unbelievable. Try it out for a bit, and you'll quickly sense the difference. 'Elegance' is the word.
Dual 1.6 GHz Xeons @ 2.8GHz | Antec 3000B | OCZ PowerStream 520W | PNY GeForceFX 5900

tay
Friend of SPCR
Posts: 793
Joined: Sat Dec 06, 2003 5:56 pm
Location: Boston, MA
Contact:

Post by tay » Tue Jan 11, 2005 11:37 am

wow almost perfect. I NEED a digital out or 5 speaker analog output. C'mon apple this couldve made a cute HTPC style box. You could carry your mac mini to your living room to watch divx if you dont want the hassle of having a box dedicated to htpc. *BOO* Does a soundblaster extigy work with OSX?

I still really like it though :)
Phenom II 555 (3 cores unlocked) 1.275v - 4GB - Xigmatek 1293 Cooler - WD 64 GB SSD -CM Mystique - Antec NeoHE 550 - Saphire 6870
e6300 - 2 GB DDR - P180 - Scythe Mine - Samsung 400 GB - 3 120mm fans
imac 7,1 C2D 2.0, 3 GB 250GB.
macbook C2D 2.4 3 GB 320GB Samsung M7E

sthayashi
*Lifetime Patron*
Posts: 3214
Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2003 10:06 am
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

Re: Remember the Cube?

Post by sthayashi » Tue Jan 11, 2005 11:37 am

MistaMuShu wrote:I'd rather have it convection-cooled like the cube, but with such small spaces, I'm skeptical of this 'purr' Apple describes.
From the pictures, it LOOKS like they're using a blower rather than a fan. This is similar to how Cleverpower cools their PSUs, and I think how Arctic Cooling does their VGA silencer series.
[size=75][url=http://www.twolf1300.net/sthayashi/SPCR/systems.html]My Power Rig, Storage Rig, HTPC and Main Rig[/url][/size]

dago
Patron of SPCR
Posts: 445
Joined: Wed Apr 23, 2003 8:50 am
Location: BE, CH
Contact:

Post by dago » Tue Jan 11, 2005 11:54 am

IMHO, it's a perfect move from a commercial point of view in general.

For my personnal use, I was wondering wether to buy one or not, because I've got already plenty of computers (and my family as well). But given the current weak dollar, it may be even more affordable now (it's worth about 110 big macs).... umh....

Here's the only shot of the inside :
Image
Last edited by dago on Tue Jan 11, 2005 12:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Talz
Posts: 223
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2003 9:29 pm

Post by Talz » Tue Jan 11, 2005 11:56 am

If I was in the market for an extra system I would actually have to consider this. Seems to only have one dimm slot though which kinda stinks, and I am dubious of the sound level apple calls quiet. Especially given Apple's marketing practices and history, but the external brick psu is not a bad start. And if it's actually quiet this is a reasonable deal, which is unusual for apple.

Tyrdium
Posts: 272
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2004 7:29 am
Location: Boston, MA
Contact:

Post by Tyrdium » Tue Jan 11, 2005 12:13 pm

As an ex-Mac user (had one of the logic-board problem iBooks, got fed up and switched to a Thinkpad for my laptop, went with PC desktop for gaming and price), I can attest to their greatness. The build quality tends to be quite good, and OS X beats Windows in pretty much everything (except gaming, I guess).
sthayashi wrote:Just because the port is the same doesn't mean that they're compatible. But you and others say so, I'll trust you.
Given that I could plug my iBook into monitors, I'd say they're probably compatible. :P

If you're in the market for a new low- to mid-range computer, I'd go for one of these. Macs are great.

dago
Patron of SPCR
Posts: 445
Joined: Wed Apr 23, 2003 8:50 am
Location: BE, CH
Contact:

Post by dago » Tue Jan 11, 2005 12:21 pm

Noise > yep, but if the power supply is external, I don't think it'll be such a problem to cool a 1.25 GHz G4, which should dissipate around 30W (? can't find the spec, just found that). Especially if they make use of the enclosure itself.

Tay > They also planned a page for all the accessories that may be useful to would-be switches (just click on accessories), and it feature this adapter for digital out ...

UPD : found spec, from what I found, max power used should be below 25.6W. Not such a challenge to silently cool. It is also nice to note that this CPU has lot of powersaving features as well.

burcakb
Posts: 1443
Joined: Tue Mar 09, 2004 9:05 am
Location: Turkey

Post by burcakb » Tue Jan 11, 2005 2:39 pm

I was at the launch of the G4 Cube. I also happened to be marketing manager for Apple/Turkey at the time. I absolutely LOVED the thing.

Unfortunately the hard truth came afterwards. The thing simply cooked. Processor would slow down/lock up, ram errors, DVDs would read incorrectly, etc. You name it, anything heat-related the G4 Cube had.

That insides photo unfortunately reminds me too much of the Cube. If it works though, I'd take of my hat to Apple (not to Apple zealots though)

As for MacOS X, the only thing wrong with it is the Apple name in front :roll:
[size=75][url=http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewtopic.php?t=17474]Thor's Hammer[/url]
Loki's Magic: Coming soon...
[url=http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewtopic.php?t=19771]Odin's Chariot[/url][/size]

Tyrdium
Posts: 272
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2004 7:29 am
Location: Boston, MA
Contact:

Post by Tyrdium » Tue Jan 11, 2005 3:09 pm

On the other hand, this has a fan, and Apple has hopefully learned from its mistakes.

acaurora
*Lifetime Patron*
Posts: 1464
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 2:51 am
Location: Elk Grove, CA
Contact:

Post by acaurora » Tue Jan 11, 2005 3:47 pm

Buy.

Reformat.

Windows XP.

Can you say, HTPC/Basic Workstation? ;P
[size=75][url=http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewtopic.php?t=25188&highlight=]My Pretty Black P180 Rig .:drool:.[/url]
[i]"Life, liberty, and the pursuit of mad silence." -acaurora[/i][/size]

Wraith
Posts: 139
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2003 1:57 pm
Location: Minnesota

Post by Wraith » Tue Jan 11, 2005 3:57 pm

Not wanting to start any OS arguments (I don't own a Mac myself), but wouldn't Mac OSX work for HTPC/Basic Workstation, and save $100 or so for WinXP? (Not that you could run WinXP on the Mac hardware anyway right...)

acaurora
*Lifetime Patron*
Posts: 1464
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 2:51 am
Location: Elk Grove, CA
Contact:

Post by acaurora » Tue Jan 11, 2005 4:02 pm

I was just suggesting. Never tried it myself. I have Win XP Pro Full anyways. ;P
[size=75][url=http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewtopic.php?t=25188&highlight=]My Pretty Black P180 Rig .:drool:.[/url]
[i]"Life, liberty, and the pursuit of mad silence." -acaurora[/i][/size]

davidstone28
Posts: 556
Joined: Tue Oct 28, 2003 5:14 am
Location: London, UK

Post by davidstone28 » Tue Jan 11, 2005 4:06 pm

That MiniMac is just a beaut.

I wished they make SFF PCs like that.....

Tyrdium
Posts: 272
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2004 7:29 am
Location: Boston, MA
Contact:

Post by Tyrdium » Tue Jan 11, 2005 4:31 pm

I suppose you could make a Mini-ITX rig of about the same size. It'd be a lot more expensive and less elegant, though.

grandpa_boris
Posts: 255
Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2003 9:45 am
Location: CA

Post by grandpa_boris » Tue Jan 11, 2005 7:43 pm

acaurora wrote:Buy.

Reformat.

Windows XP.

Can you say, HTPC/Basic Workstation? ;P
XP doesn't run on PowerPC.

does that $500 price tag include the OS? apple's page suggests this, but don't think it states it explicitly.
**

grandpa_boris
Posts: 255
Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2003 9:45 am
Location: CA

Post by grandpa_boris » Tue Jan 11, 2005 7:48 pm

dago wrote:spec, from what I found, max power used should be below 25.6W. Not such a challenge to silently cool. It is also nice to note that this CPU has lot of powersaving features as well.
probably not a challenge to cool in a big enough case with a big enough heat sink and a big, slow fan moving air accross it. but there is no room in this little box for that.

i am going to have to wait for reviews that show dB figures.
**

tay
Friend of SPCR
Posts: 793
Joined: Sat Dec 06, 2003 5:56 pm
Location: Boston, MA
Contact:

Post by tay » Tue Jan 11, 2005 7:54 pm

grandpa_boris wrote: does that $500 price tag include the OS? apple's page suggests this, but don't think it states it explicitly.
It includes OS and iLife which despite the silly name is a good sw application suite. And iwork (argh!!) is quite good at $79 only. In addition with a bit of work you can run many xwindows apps that are popular on linux.

Upgrades are a tad bit pricey but you can wait and see till someone else opens the box (voiding warranty) to add a 1 GB stick yourself. 802.11g airport extreme is 79 bucks. Bluetooth is another 50.
Phenom II 555 (3 cores unlocked) 1.275v - 4GB - Xigmatek 1293 Cooler - WD 64 GB SSD -CM Mystique - Antec NeoHE 550 - Saphire 6870
e6300 - 2 GB DDR - P180 - Scythe Mine - Samsung 400 GB - 3 120mm fans
imac 7,1 C2D 2.0, 3 GB 250GB.
macbook C2D 2.4 3 GB 320GB Samsung M7E

autoboy
Posts: 1008
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 8:10 pm
Location: San Jose, California

Post by autoboy » Tue Jan 11, 2005 8:31 pm

quote]
probably not a challenge to cool in a big enough case with a big enough heat sink and a big, slow fan moving air accross it. but there is no room in this little box for that.

i am going to have to wait for reviews that show dB figures.[/quote]

i'm not sure why everyone thinks you need a big case to cool effectively. A big case heats up just like a small one, it just takes longer. The ATX form factor is not designed for heat so you need big cumbersome heatsinks and big cases. Some laptops use desktop proc and they cool just fine. Probably use the same technique as a laptop. I'm thinking this thing would be great for my mom and then i could play with it sometimes too.

ActionAttackJohn
Posts: 35
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 8:56 pm
Location: NY
Contact:

Post by ActionAttackJohn » Tue Jan 11, 2005 8:47 pm

acaurora wrote:Buy.

Reformat.

Windows XP.

Can you say, HTPC/Basic Workstation? ;P
Mac OSX performs most computing tasks better than Windows XP, with the exception of gaming.

Creative (as much as they suck) and other companies offer USB2 sound cards, with 7.1 digital output. VLC for Mac will play pretty much anything you throw at it.

So leave OSX on it, use it as your HTPC, and stop worrying about windows cruft and viruses.

Mats
Posts: 3044
Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2003 6:54 am
Location: Sweden

Post by Mats » Tue Jan 11, 2005 9:25 pm

Just put it on the back of your TFT with some glue and you got yourself a cheap iMac!!! :lol:

Anyway, only 2 USB ports are embarrasing, you use one for keyboard/mouse, and then you got one left... :?

jiclark
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 12:42 pm
Location: San Juan Mtns, SW Colo.

Post by jiclark » Tue Jan 11, 2005 10:00 pm

I have to admit, I'm a bit of a Mac zealot, but you guys are amazing!
Actually, the "we don't get viruses" part pisses me off...
Why, because it's true? ;-}

And listen to your friends here, OS X (which is included, btw; it is on ALL Macs) is not the evil borg you seem to think it is.
Anyway, only 2 USB ports are embarrasing, you use one for keyboard/mouse, and then you got one left...
Every Mac keyboard has two ports on it as well. Plus, have you never used a hub?

C'mon you guys, would it kill you to admit that this thing is simply amazing? I understand why some Mac-heads may have made you angry in the past, and I'll be the first to say that Steve Jobs is as egomaniacal as they come, but wouldn't it be nice if Apple actually gained enough market share to make Gates et al have work a little harder on their end?

I'll get off my soapbox now, and prepare my butt for roasting... ;-}

Pjotor
*Lifetime Patron*
Posts: 485
Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2003 9:06 pm
Location: Uppsala, Sweden

Post by Pjotor » Tue Jan 11, 2005 10:14 pm

Don't touch that reply button!

Seriously -- so far most of the posts in this topic have steered clear of OS wars (which is great), but it's getting awfully close... Can we please try to keep it free of "Apple vs Microsoft" (vs Linux vs FreeBSD vs WhateverOS) posts? I'm sick and tired of reading posts in other forums where the word "Apple" has led to fruitless OS bashings.

In Sweden there is the saying, "You can't compare apples to pears" (means you can't compare things which are fundamentally different), which I think fits very well here.
Happy silencing!

Mats
Posts: 3044
Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2003 6:54 am
Location: Sweden

Post by Mats » Tue Jan 11, 2005 10:15 pm

jiclark wrote:
Anyway, only 2 USB ports are embarrasing, you use one for keyboard/mouse, and then you got one left...
Every Mac keyboard has two ports on it as well. Plus, have you never used a hub?
Yeah but on the other hand there's no keyboard included!! :wink:

A hub???!? What's that?? :lol:

Come on, even most laptops have three USB ports and they don't need one for the keyboard. Four ports would have been sweet, and it's not a question about money or space! It would have been better to have two more ports instead of a modem port! Show me any other brand new desktop computer with only two USB ports.

I've never owned an Apple and I think that they are fantastic. You shouldn't think that we are anti-Apple just because we give some criticism!!!

Post Reply