A Liquid That Won't Get Things Wet

azraeltecat · Post by **azraeltecat** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 8:20 am

Hi i was just wondering if any of you had any experiance with this stuff.
The chemical compound is called ˝Novec 1230˝

total-immersion watercooling. Just think of the possibilities

More here:
http://science.slashdot.org/article.pl? ... 26&tid=134

http://www.yorbamicro.com/stuff/Sapphir ... 30-FAQ.pdf[/img]

El Doug · Post by **El Doug** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 5:40 pm

but how are the thermal characteristics? no way to tell if this chemical is superior to oil

ckolivas · Post by **ckolivas** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 8:39 pm

3m fluorinert FC-77 has been around for ages and is considered the ultimate in immersion cooling, used in the Cray supercomputers of the past. An affordable solution would be nice as FC-77 is stratospherically expensive, but basically perfect.

El Doug · Post by **El Doug** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 8:45 pm

thought they had some other, even more obscene chemicals that would not freeze until -100C, so people were sticking phase changer heads INTO the liquid to cool it down.

ckolivas · Post by **ckolivas** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 8:52 pm

From the website:

3M™ Fluorinert™ Electronic Liquid FC-77
The wide liquid range of Fluorinert liquid FC-77 (-110 deg C to 97 deg C) allows its use in heat transfer applications in the semiconductor industry, and also makes it useful in electronics testing.

That's the stuff.

theyangster · Post by **theyangster** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 8:58 pm

and how much is it?

refresh my mind on how sound is muffled by liquid...I seemed to have forgot...

ckolivas · Post by **ckolivas** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 9:01 pm

theyangster wrote:and how much is it?

refresh my mind on how sound is muffled by liquid...I seemed to have forgot...

It was about 1000 bucks for 250ml last time I checked. I don't think the 3m site says anything about price.

Was that some tongue in cheek comment about sound being muffled by liquid? I'm not sure how to respond...

theyangster · Post by **theyangster** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 9:18 pm

wow that's expensive

sorry, didn't mean to sound rude/sarcastic, I just forgot why sound is muffled thru liquid. because it is thicker? I just can't remember

ronrem · Post by **ronrem** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 9:30 pm

theyangster wrote:and how much is it?

refresh my mind on how sound is muffled by liquid...I seemed to have forgot...

Turn on the radio. Fill the bathtub. Put your ears below the waterline. Note how muted the radio sound becomes. Do not drop the radio INTO the tub.

It seems mineral oil is cheaper,by a lot,and probably less toxic.

ckolivas · Post by **ckolivas** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 9:35 pm

ronrem wrote:
theyangster wrote:and how much is it?

refresh my mind on how sound is muffled by liquid...I seemed to have forgot...
Turn on the radio. Fill the bathtub. Put your ears below the waterline. Note how muted the radio sound becomes. Do not drop the radio INTO the tub.

It seems mineral oil is cheaper,by a lot,and probably less toxic.

Actually this is quite non toxic and almost absolutely inert.

ckolivas · Post by **ckolivas** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 9:43 pm

Fluorinert has fascinated me for years. Just for more information, apparently they start with water, knock of the hydrogen and replace it with fluorine making difluoride oxide. The process is probably patented and some trade secret, or perhaps the demand is so low that noone else has bothered making such an expensive product. The substance looks just like water and is indistinguishable from it. Obviously it is not just F2O as there are a range of fluorinerts available so there must be more to it. I wasn't aware there were different fluorinerts till I tried searching for it on the 3m website recently.

Here's a url that may well change in the future: http://www.3m.com/3Msearch/3Msolutions/ ... rt-liquids

Oh and will you look at that? Novec (which started this topic) is listed there

azraeltecat · Post by **azraeltecat** » Thu Jan 19, 2006 1:49 am

This is what Novec is and what it is used for:
This coating can be used in the disk drive, MEMS, LCD and printed circuit board industries to provide anti-wetting, anti-stiction, anti-migration and anti-corrosion properties. It is a replacement for Fluorad coating FC-722, FC-724, FC-725 and FC-732.

I found a pdf file thet explains a lot:
Unfortunatly it has some problems, it´s boiling point is 48C, it evaperates in 3-5 days.

http://www.tycomarine.com/docs/fire/ext ... -02-04.pdf[/url]

kirkengaard · Post by **kirkengaard** » Tue Jan 31, 2006 12:00 am

theyangster wrote:refresh my mind on how sound is muffled by liquid...I seemed to have forgot...

Con has it right.

The problem is not one of sound being muffled by liquid, but of wave transmission across boundaries. If you and your loud computer were both immersed in fluorinert (hypothetically speaking), you would hear it better than through air. Place both source and pickup in the same medium, and the longitudinal waves will carry cleanly from source to pickup. The denser the fluid medium, the longer a wave will retain its original characteristics in that medium. Separate source from pickup across the boundary between disparate media, such as air and fluorinert, and the transmission of longitudinal waves across the barrier, due to inherent inefficiencies, tends to silence the source relative to the pickup.

At least, I think I've got that right. It's a nickel tour of fluid-dynamics, FWIW.