Seasonic S12-430: Beyond the Super Tornado

Mats · Post by **Mats** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 2:07 pm

Tibors wrote:Just looking at the rail ratings, the certificates and how Seasonic named the boxed (FB) and bulk (FT) version of the Tornado.

Slightly offtopic, but I have some questions about FB and FT.

1. Is the FT just as low noise as FB?

2. Most important, should I look for the revision A3 on a FT PSU too?

(I have a feeling this is not the first time this question have been asked, but I just couldn't find any info.)

Torbjörn · Post by **Torbjörn** » Fri Apr 08, 2005 4:14 am

I have been trying to find if out any shop in Sweden is getting the s12 330 PSU. So far no luck but I did find out that kylning.se will be getting the SS-301HT soon. Hopefully some brave soul can buy one and review it!

CheeseWeaver · Post by **CheeseWeaver** » Mon Apr 11, 2005 9:25 am

I live in sweden too, and i am going to order my S12 from http://www.siliconacoustics.com/

the lower price of electronics across the pond easily makes up for the freight cost.

Mats · Post by **Mats** » Mon Apr 11, 2005 10:26 am

CheeseWeaver wrote:the lower price of electronics across the pond
easily makes up for the freight cost.

What would the shipping cost be? What about customs?

I've seen Seasonic in five stores here in Sweden,
www.jmedata.se
www.kylning.com
www.shg.biz
www.overclockers.se
www.datorbutiken.se (only a server PSU)
If you guys know about any other, please tell me. I'm pretty sure that S12 will show up soon, and besides, I'm not in a hurry.

Tibors · Post by **Tibors** » Thu Apr 14, 2005 5:23 pm

After all the theoretical discussions about the differences between the SS-xx1HT and SS-xx0HB I took the plunge. As the OEM PSU's are availlable now and at about half the price the S12's will be.

I posted pictures here, so you can compare them to the ones in the review and see the differences.

Ackelind · Post by **Ackelind** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 12:16 am

Seasonic S12 ARE available in sweden now. Check out shg.biz, they just got it in stock (or atleast soon they will, they have it on their webpage)

MassMan · Post by **MassMan** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 3:02 am

http://shg.dk/produkter/infobox.asp?mod ... enr=820142

s12-400? wtf? getting more and more confused by the minute by all those different names :/

tempeteduson · Post by **tempeteduson** » Mon Apr 18, 2005 11:26 pm

I don't know if anyone has already posted a link to this review of the S12-330, but here it is:
http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=a ... =166&num=3
It's not a very in-depth review, neither one tailored to acoustics, but it does give you an idea of how it compares to the S12-430 reviewed by SPCR. Seems similar to me, and they said it is "pretty much silent," whatever that's worth.

Maybe I should switch over from Antec PSUs, which are no longer on the SPCR Recommended PSUs list...

kma · Post by **kma** » Tue Apr 19, 2005 4:00 am

MassMan wrote:http://shg.dk/produkter/infobox.asp?mod ... enr=820142

s12-400? wtf? getting more and more confused by the minute by all those different names :/

Wery confusesed indeed. I've asked shg about it and they say
"It is 400W - a bulk version for some reason not listed on Seasonics website."

My only question then is - What version is it?

EDIT: After a new visit to their site it seems it's SS-401HT

lenny · Post by **lenny** » Tue Apr 19, 2005 12:03 pm

tempeteduson wrote:Maybe I should switch over from Antec PSUs, which are no longer on the SPCR Recommended PSUs list...

S12 has better efficiency than most Antecs (except for Phantom), has active PFC, and is quieter. I'd say go for it. I did (last night).

As someone mentioned in another thread, eWiz through PriceWatch has the 430W for $78 with free FedEx Ground shipping. Significantly less than NewEgg's price.

I just wish they'd get rid of that "eWiz.com IS YOUR BEST FRIEND!" crap.

IanWorthington · Post by **IanWorthington** » Tue Apr 19, 2005 1:59 pm

I've just installed an S12-430 to replace the PowerMax that shipped with my case.

The good news is that its nice and quiet.

The bad news is that, whilst the case temperature rose by a few degrees (C), the CPU temperature rocketed up 12C to 63C I've had to take the side off the PC to bring it back down to 51C.

Now I don't have a seperate case fan, but I only have an Athlon XP 2200+, not overclocked, 2xHDD, 1xDVD and an old GeForce2 AGP, and with the Powermax I didn't need anything more.

Anyone else had a similar experience? Does the Seasonic *oblige* me to install a case fan?

ian
...

lenny · Post by **lenny** » Tue Apr 19, 2005 2:37 pm

IanWorthington wrote:The bad news is that, whilst the case temperature rose by a few degrees (C), the CPU temperature rocketed up 12C to 63C I've had to take the side off the PC to bring it back down to 51C.

Hi, Ian. Welcome to SPCR Forums!

I'm surprised that the CPU temp went up by so much.

What kind of fan does the PowerMax have? A 120mm, an 80mm or is it one of those two fanned PSUs?

Is the cabling interfering with airflow?

What are the voltages with old and new CPU?

I'm assuming that all other variables (room temperature, what the PC is doing) remained the same between your 63C and 51C figures for new and old PSU.

I've always run a case fan at low speed on my systems. Even a little airflow goes a long way.

IanWorthington · Post by **IanWorthington** » Tue Apr 19, 2005 2:46 pm

Thanks for the welcome lenny.

The PowerMax looks though its just got 1 x 80mm fan -- remember this is a very cheap & cheerful unit!

The cabling, if anything, should be less of an interference that it was -- the S12 ships with a couple of tubes of spiral wrap that I put to good use to tidy stuff up. Hmmm... I'll try stripping it out though and seeing if it makes any difference.

I haven't changed the CPU, just the PSU. I didn't make a note of the voltages with the old PSU.

PC usage is pretty much the same. Its always running F@H so the cpu is always at 100% in any case. Room environment hasn't changed.

ian

IanWorthington · Post by **IanWorthington** » Tue Apr 19, 2005 8:10 pm

Just tried again with the wires well clear of the CPU and PSU. System temperature rose by 3C, CPU temp by 9C over 25 minutes:

Code: Select all

2005-04-19 11:54:25 PM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:37, CPU Temp:54, 
2005-04-19 11:57:45 PM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:38, CPU Temp:58, 
2005-04-19 11:58:45 PM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:38, CPU Temp:58, 
2005-04-19 11:59:45 PM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:39, CPU Temp:59, 
2005-04-20 12:00:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4041, Power:788, System Temp:39, CPU Temp:60, 
2005-04-20 12:01:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:39, CPU Temp:60, 
2005-04-20 12:02:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:39, CPU Temp:61, 
2005-04-20 12:03:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:39, CPU Temp:61, 
2005-04-20 12:04:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:39, CPU Temp:61, 
2005-04-20 12:05:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:39, CPU Temp:61, 
2005-04-20 12:06:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:39, CPU Temp:61, 
2005-04-20 12:07:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:40, CPU Temp:62, 
2005-04-20 12:08:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:39, CPU Temp:62, 
2005-04-20 12:09:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:40, CPU Temp:62, 
2005-04-20 12:10:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:40, CPU Temp:62, 
2005-04-20 12:11:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:40, CPU Temp:62, 
2005-04-20 12:12:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:40, CPU Temp:62, 
2005-04-20 12:13:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4041, Power:788, System Temp:40, CPU Temp:62, 
2005-04-20 12:14:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:40, CPU Temp:62, 
2005-04-20 12:15:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:40, CPU Temp:62, 
2005-04-20 12:16:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:40, CPU Temp:62, 
2005-04-20 12:17:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4066, Power:788, System Temp:40, CPU Temp:62, 
2005-04-20 12:18:45 AM - System FAN:0, CPU FAN:4041, Power:788, System Temp:40, CPU Temp:63,

Case side panel now off again

ian
...

lenny · Post by **lenny** » Tue Apr 19, 2005 8:18 pm

I just remembered something. Is the rear fan hole open? If so, the 120mm fan on the PSU may be sucking air in from that opening, and exhausting it immediately, causing a "short circuit" in your airflow.

Try taping shut the rear fan outlet.

tabbal · Post by **tabbal** » Fri Apr 29, 2005 5:15 pm

I was looking to buy a Seasonic S12-330 from Newegg ... but they don't seem to carry it anymore. So I looked around and found this new place which carries most of the S12 sizes... at unbelievable prices: S12-430 $83/ 380w $62/ 330w $50...
They just started selling Seasonic.
$8.75 shipping by Ground (3-5 days).
http://www.pcalchemy.com/index.php?cPat ... lter_id=38

Please post recommendation if you had any dealings with them!
RR lists them as 10.
Thanks

hmsrolst · Post by **hmsrolst** » Mon May 09, 2005 2:40 am

I currently am using an older Seasonic 300 modded with an L1A in an Antec 3000B. Because the system is based on a Pentium-M, it runs very cool and the PSU fan never ramps up. However, it's getting a bit old in the tooth. Do you think that an S12-330 (assuming it's as quiet as the 430) will be as quiet as my current set up? Quieter?

Post by **MikeC** » Mon May 09, 2005 7:28 am

hmsrolst wrote:I currently am using an older Seasonic 300 modded with an L1A in an Antec 3000B. Because the system is based on a Pentium-M, it runs very cool and the PSU fan never ramps up. However, it's getting a bit old in the tooth. Do you think that an S12-330 (assuming it's as quiet as the 430) will be as quiet as my current set up? Quieter?

Probably not worth the bother unless the system is showing signs of unexplained instability. A P-M draws so little power. If it is a typical system it's probably drawing <50W DC at any time, under any load. The difference in noise will be too small (if there is any) to be significant unless the Panaflo in the PSU is worn out.

Ackelind · Post by **Ackelind** » Tue May 10, 2005 8:48 am

tempeteduson wrote:I don't know if anyone has already posted a link to this review of the S12-330, but here it is:
http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=a ... =166&num=3
It's not a very in-depth review, neither one tailored to acoustics, but it does give you an idea of how it compares to the S12-430 reviewed by SPCR. Seems similar to me, and they said it is "pretty much silent," whatever that's worth.

Maybe I should switch over from Antec PSUs, which are no longer on the SPCR Recommended PSUs list...

Haha! I really like that review. They decided to only test it with an old server computer anno 1998 since it is a "330W version is not meant for new PC’s".

My PrescHOT and 6600GT, dvdrw and 2 * sata hdd is run by a 250W enhance PSU, and I've never ever encountered any stability issues.

winguy · Post by **winguy** » Thu May 12, 2005 2:21 am

MikeC wrote:Seasonic USA said they would send me a sample of the SS400HT

Anyone's gotten hold of a SS-400HT ?

IanWorthington · Post by **IanWorthington** » Fri May 13, 2005 8:37 am

lenny wrote:I just remembered something. Is the rear fan hole open? If so, the 120mm fan on the PSU may be sucking air in from that opening, and exhausting it immediately, causing a "short circuit" in your airflow.

Try taping shut the rear fan outlet.

Thanks for this, but that didn't make too much difference - the mesh has rather more metal than holes, so I'm not too surprised.

In the end I found a cheap Panaflo low speed and put that in last night. CPU temperature still went up but only about 5C to 63C. And checking the log this morning after a couple of hours the Seasonic fan increased its speed from 700 rpm to 900 rpm and the temperature this morning was finally back down to where it started.

Guess the hot air is very local to the cpu and is taking a while to be drawn into the psu to ramp it up a bit.

Thanks for your help

Ian
...

Green Shoes · Post by **Green Shoes** » Fri May 13, 2005 10:26 am

Just got my S-12 in yesterday, but thanks to Monarch still don't have a mobo to plug it into yet

. Just for kicks I jumped it (green wire to any black on the 24-pin connection) and played around with my fan controller. I know there's no heat in the case yet but man, that fan is quiet. I'm pumped.

winguy · Post by **winguy** » Mon May 16, 2005 12:31 pm

Sea Sonic Electronics announces the new version‘S12’series power supply
As discussed here.

mattg82 · Post by **mattg82** » Tue May 17, 2005 2:34 am

Edit

XCase now have s12-430,500 & 600 in stock.

Post by **MikeC** » Sun May 22, 2005 1:30 pm

Seasonic recently made a complete change over to ADDA fans from Yate Loon fans used originally in their S12s and later Super Tornados. We know how much impact a fan change can have to acoustics, so we decided to run another quick test on a new sample of the S12-430 and post the results as a POSTCRIPT of the original article.

Green Shoes · Post by **Green Shoes** » Sun May 22, 2005 8:00 pm

*Whew!* The one I bought two weeks ago is a Yate Loon model; quiet as a mouse

. It's odd that they changed the efficiency curves, even unintentionally; anyone that will actually be drawing 300+W with these would opt for the 500W or 600W model. Hmmm....

Post by **MikeC** » Sun May 22, 2005 8:17 pm

Green Shoes wrote:*Whew!* The one I bought two weeks ago is a Yate Loon model; quiet as a mouse . It's odd that they changed the efficiency curves, even unintentionally; anyone that will actually be drawing 300+W with these would opt for the 500W or 600W model. Hmmm....

The differences are too small to be noticeable. Really. We're talking 2~5W either way at the AC power draw level. Just because I can measure it does not mean it means anything.

And listening to them, I have to say at anything less than ~300W, the measured differences don't really jibe well with what I heard. They are close, very close. Like I wrote, if you took one away, I'd be perfectly OK with using the one that was left (whichever one) in my systems. It's too subtle and at too low a level to be picking at. I probably would not be able to tell whether one had a YL or an ADDA with blind A/B testing except at certain speeds and very close to the fan.

So, in reality, no whew required. In fact, I do think the Japanese capacitors are a good thing. I have some motherboards that suffered the leaky cap syndrome not much more than 12 mos after purchase. Not pretty and rather expensive.

PS · Post by PS » Mon May 23, 2005 2:45 am

How could you tell they had suffered said "leaky cap" syndrome, Mike?

-PS

Mats · Post by **Mats** » Mon May 23, 2005 3:03 am

PS wrote:How could you tell they had suffered said "leaky cap" syndrome, Mike?

-PS

http://www.badcaps.com/

Green Shoes · Post by **Green Shoes** » Mon May 23, 2005 5:56 am

Ah, thanks for the reassurance, Mike, building another comp for the Wife in a couple months and would like to stick with Seasonic.

Seasonic S12-430: Beyond the Super Tornado

Seasonics in sweden

Re: Seasonics in sweden

s12-400?

Re: s12-400?

CPU temperature up 12C after S12 installation

Re: CPU temperature up 12C after S12 installation

SEASONICS at Low Prices