Noob builds an i7 w/P183 case

Taxcheat · Post by **Taxcheat** » Thu Jul 16, 2009 10:05 pm

So here's my first ever computer build. My PSU arrives from buy.com later today, so if anything needs fixing now would be a good time to let me know.

First, the obligatory box photo:

Now the build itself -- everything's connected except the power.

Now the specs:
-- Mainboard
MB: Asus P6T Deluxe v2
Ram: OCZ Platinum (3 x 2GB) 1600
CPU: Intel Core i7 920
Fan: Noctua NH-U12P
GPU: Gigabyte 4850 Fanless

-- Case & Cooling
Case: Antec P183
PS: Antec CP-850
Fans: 3 x Scythe S-FLEX SFF21E
Control: Scythe Kaze Server

-- Drives
HD: 2 x WD Caviar SE16 640GB
BD: Pioneer BDR-203BKS Blu-Ray burner

-- Misc
Paste: MASSCOOL G751 Shin-Etsu
Free: 2 x 6 month subs to CPU magazine

Top & rear fans are set to blow outward, the middle fan is an intake blowing on the presumably red hot Radeon. I put temperature probes on the Hard drive, the back of the video card (see yellow tape), at the intake and at the top exhaust. Didn't feel comfortable putting it on heatsinks.

Biggest problem in the build: stupid Noctua instructions said "Take protection cover from the bottom of heatsink before installing." Um, there isn't any protection! Thankfully I googled this before scratching it up too badly.

Thanks to SPCR for the info on how to do this and RoGuE for checking out my specs. Now I just hope the thing turns on when the PSU arrives.

bonestonne · Post by **bonestonne** » Fri Jul 17, 2009 7:20 am

My only suggestion is moving the SATA cables. They appear to go around the back, but there's a ton of extra cable, so you could use a zip/wire tie to tame that a bit, and make it look even neater, but as it is, that's a very clean build.

I'm just a little surprised you're throwing 850W into that, considering a modular 625W could power that with plenty of headroom, saving money, power, cabling...At my old school we have a Dell XPS 730 or something along that model line, QX6850 I think, 8800GTS 640mb, and it's got this absolutely ridiculous 1kW power supply with 5 (yes, 5) +12v rails....completely unnecessary, and very inefficient.

nice use of angled SATA cables...i wish i had more for my computers, but it's more of a preference than necessity.

danimal · Post by **danimal** » Fri Jul 17, 2009 8:55 am

i think that the cp-850 was a good choice, because it's something like 84% efficient with a ~200 watt load, and it could outlive the case

buy.com has that ps for $120, you'd be hard-pressed to find that ratio of quality power delivery vs. $$$ vs. noise in a 650 watt ps.

Taxcheat · Post by **Taxcheat** » Fri Jul 17, 2009 9:05 am

Thanks. I got the CP-850 because I like the design and I don't want to run short of juice in the future. The price difference was pretty minimal.

In the Asus motherboard manual, it says you need a 1000w PSU if you use SLI.

I assume that's an exaggeration, but I might add a better graphics card when the newer chips start coming out in the fall.

RoGuE · Post by **RoGuE** » Fri Jul 17, 2009 9:15 am

Heyyy lookin good taxcheat!

very sexy build.

I would recomend shoving those SATAII cables up into the rear mobo tray area, and maybe add a ziptie half way betteen the drive and the hole to keep the cables together and as clean looking as possible. Then again, mayeb you already did that and I'm wasting my breath lol

Also, I like your GPU intake fan thing. Did you know that having it there is actually better than having it at the front of the case and ducting it back? the reason is fluid dynamics..and I could give u a long shpeal about how that works..but ill just leave it as "good job" for now lol. Make sure tho that you seal up that "tunnel" real well..in fact, adding some poster paper or anything thin/smooth to line the inner walls of the tunnel would be ideal and help minimize frictional losses as the air enters the tunnel. (again..more fluids talk here). I mean, i realize im gettin rediculously in depth, but hey..might as well right? these things are a hobbie for people like us.

Lookin forward to see this thing finished. Oh..and dont stress about the psu..u wont need half that power (least as of now), but at least it will be cool and efficient.

Taxcheat · Post by **Taxcheat** » Fri Jul 17, 2009 7:05 pm

About the tunnel for the GPU. I just sorta noticed that Antec designed it that way. My scientific thinking was: "Closer Fan Cooler Than Farther Fan," not fluid dynamics.

But there is one problem. It's touching the PCI power wire for the card.

I think it's ok, but I'll take a second opinion:

Here's the final build:

Observations -- first, I'm running at max fan (1200rpm) and it has a pleasing woosh. Kinda like a ceiling fan on low. Totally acceptable, and quieter than my QNAP NAS. I haven't deciphered how to get the Scythe controller into manual control mode to lower the speed. The instructions are crap. At max fan:

Idle CPU: 39
Idle MB: 36
Idle GPU: 43
Folding@Home GPU temp: 65.
Furmark for 13 minutes: 85 stable.

When I installed Folding@Home, it automatically started and ran 100% GPU in the background for probably half an hour. I had no idea it was running! The Pioneer drive works flawlessly, but is a vacuum cleaner when burning (I don't care). Can't hear it when playing bluray. Express Gate had me on the Internet literally within 20 seconds of booting for the first time -- no configuration, just awesome. Now I gotta figure out how to hack Express Gate with a more power distro...

Taxcheat · Post by **Taxcheat** » Sun Jul 19, 2009 12:38 pm

Update... two problems:

1. Prime95 runs hot.

Got up to 81C on Core 0 in about 5 minutes.

The other cores were about 3-4 degrees cooler.

Going to try to take off the cover and see if it's an airflow issue. I didn't tighten the heatsink too much since I didn't want to bend the motherboard. Just turned until it stopped, gave it a few extra tugs, and called it done. I can also add another Noctua fan to the heatsink.

2. Scythe fan controllers are total crap. I read hundreds of complaints on Newegg about it, but bought one anyway. Mine is stuck on full-power to the fans mode (about 11v). Given #1, this isn't that big a deal, actually. I don't feel like taking apart my entire setup to RMA the thing.

On the plus side, I have Winbloat 7 and Ubuntu working nicely together.

RoGuE · Post by **RoGuE** » Sun Jul 19, 2009 1:36 pm

first of all, without a fast fan on that heat sink..you should expect to see high temps when running prime95. Reason is..thats a HOT chip. very powerful..but HOT. That said, I would check the thermal interface material..i dont know if your heatsink came with it pre applied, but it could be too thick, or you could be not covering all ur cores.
also..whats your room temp?

40974111 · Post by **40974111** » Sun Jul 19, 2009 3:24 pm

Also, if your Scythe fan controller is one of the models that has an alarm in it, try giving your graphics card a work out and see if you trip it. The one in my Scythe Kaze Master goes off at 72 degrees, which the graphics card heatsink will easily reach. You can turn the alarm off, that may actually be a reasonable thing to do with such hot running parts.

ame · Post by **ame** » Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:58 pm

2 things to try

1st reseat the heat sink. make sure to use good termal paste. use the method described in this like to apply it

http://www.arcticsilver.com/ins_route_s ... elas5.html

2nd you'r CPU voltage in the BIOS is likely set to auto. If you try manually setting it, you'll se it can go much lower than you might think. this will dramatically affect load temps.

Nice Clean build. try swaping the Noctua 120 fan and scyth rear exhaust. S-flex have very good pressure and Noctuas have good CFM so swapping makes sense.

Shamgar · Post by **Shamgar** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 8:30 am

Good work on your first PC build. Don't you feel proud when you take the obliglatory photos of your components before installation? Keep them for the memories. Something to look back on twenty years from now

. Hey, I'm starting to get emotional now

.

The i7s do run hot, but the NH-U12P should be able to handle it. Maybe the Shin-Etsu needs time to set? Check the instructions again and reapply it if necessary. As the previous poster said, try swapping HS and back exhaust fans to see if anything improves.

Good to see more P183 builds with CP-850. I'm considering getting a P183 for a future build, so I check the gallery from time to time to see the different setups. Sick of seeing all the elf computers getting all the attention.

RoGuE · Post by **RoGuE** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 9:07 am

OH..i just remembered.

High end heat sinks, usually come with high end TIM (thermal interface material). Good TIM will come with information on "setting time". Basically the setting time is the time it takes for the small fragments of material to work themselves into all the groves of the metals. This also involves sever thermal cycles (going from hot to cold and back).

Could it be that the high temps were a result of your TIM not being fully set yet? perhaps, but the temps are still a little warm I think.

Just some extra info thought you might wanna know.

Shamgar · Post by **Shamgar** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 9:55 am

The NH-U12P comes with Noctua's NT-H1 thermal compound. The O.P. states MASSCOOL G751 Shin-Etsu in his spec's. He doesn't say which one he used, but I'm sure both require at least some burn-in time. The NT-H1 seems a bit "generic" to me, but then again, I have not used either material. The Arctic Cooling MX-2 I use doesn't require a burn-in time.

Taxcheat · Post by **Taxcheat** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 4:19 pm

I used the Shin Etsu TIM which came in a tube with no instructions. When I tried to put a drop on the chip, it dumped a gigantic blob, so I had to use a plastic bag to pull off the extra and spread it evenly as I could. It sat at least 24 hours before being turned on. I read a test of 50 thermal pastes, and the Shin Etsu was #1 and didn't claim a setting time like Artic Silver.

Can I reset the Noctua without taking apart the entire system? i.e. leaving the motherboard in the case while fooling around?

As for the Scythe, the temp probes are set in places where temperature doesn't get hot, so there are no alarm problems. If that stupid controller had worked, this baby would be dead silent.

Haven't measured ambient temperature... I guess 23-24C... The air intake temp probe says 28.1.

RoGuE · Post by **RoGuE** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 4:56 pm

i asked about the ambient temp because it's been hot on the east coast the past few days..and ambient temp makes a huge difference in temps..sometimes 10+C over "normal" room temps

Shamgar · Post by **Shamgar** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 9:53 pm

Taxcheat wrote:Can I reset the Noctua without taking apart the entire system? i.e. leaving the motherboard in the case while fooling around?

I'm not sure on that one. I'm guessing you could, once the backplate and mounting screws have already been installed etc., although the U12P is pretty heavy on its own. Maybe ask in the CPU Cooling forum; a few people here have that same heatsink. They've probably been through some similar issues to you. Sorry I couldn't be of more help.

greeksurfer1 · Post by **greeksurfer1** » Sun Dec 06, 2009 6:26 pm

Noob question about the case..

If I was to replicate your system, would there be any reason I should go with a P193 instead of the P183? Are there any advantages or disadvantages in doing so? I've read that the 193 has more room, and a couple extra fans (large in size as well). Would that allow for any kind of expansion in the future that the P183 doesn't have?

greeksurfer1 · Post by **greeksurfer1** » Sun Dec 06, 2009 8:47 pm

greeksurfer1 wrote:Noob question about the case..

If I was to replicate your system, would there be any reason I should go with a P193 instead of the P183? Are there any advantages or disadvantages in doing so? I've read that the 193 has more room, and a couple extra fans (large in size as well). Would that allow for any kind of expansion in the future that the P183 doesn't have?

Also, would the P193 be quieter/louder in the same setup?