Sonata III: swap the PSU?

blake · Post by **blake** » Thu Jun 21, 2007 11:41 pm

Is it possible to remove the power supply unit in the Antec Sonata III case (Eathwatts 500W) to install a larger one?

I have heard it is very difficult with this case?

Any suggestions for a silent(er) 800W+ supply?

disphenoidal · Post by **disphenoidal** » Thu Jun 21, 2007 11:51 pm

What are you running that could possibly require an 800W power supply?

merlin · Post by **merlin** » Fri Jun 22, 2007 12:28 am

blake wrote:Is it possible to remove the power supply unit in the Antec Sonata III case (Eathwatts 500W) to install a larger one?

I have heard it is very difficult with this case?

Any suggestions for a silent(er) 800W+ supply?

Don't see why the power supply would be hard to remove...it's plenty easy in the sonata 1 and 2...just make sure you don't already have a motherboard and stuff inside. And ditto on the why 800W question!

Shobai · Post by **Shobai** » Fri Jun 22, 2007 12:31 am

short answer: nothing.

long answer: see above.

even SLI'd 8800GTXs, quad core processors, peltiers and watercooling, numerous hard drives and a small fridge wouldn't use an true 800W PSU.

[edit: to answer the question]

as for swapping the psu, they adhere to a form factor, so as long as the original is an ATX power supply, any other ATX PSU will be a drop in replacement. so it shouldn't be a problem swapping it =]

blake · Post by **blake** » Fri Jun 22, 2007 12:42 am

I was told if you want to SLI your Nvidia (esp 8800GTX) with 2 hard drives etc, you will need more than the 500W supply, i.e. 800W

Disagree?

mcoleg · Post by **mcoleg** » Fri Jun 22, 2007 2:23 am

yes, we will. first off, you are better off with a case that is large than sonata for 8800gtx sli due to the heat it will produce.

actually, what cpu are you planning on?

blake · Post by **blake** » Fri Jun 22, 2007 2:52 am

But its all about compactness and style. I do not want a monstrous, ugly 900

You can do SLI with an 8800GTS, no? That is my PSU concern. CPU: E6600

Das_Saunamies · Post by **Das_Saunamies** » Fri Jun 22, 2007 3:10 am

A Seasonic Energy+ 550/650W will cater to your SLI needs I bet.

What you need more than the Watt reading is reliable, constant, high-grade power. This can only be achieved by using high-quality components -- throwing more Watts at the problem will have the same result for some time, but the brute force solution is always a waste of resources. All the general advice and calculators rely on the assumption that the asker is a chump who will buy the cheapest $/W ratio, so it makes sense to overshoot the advice just to make sure they don't end up with a dud. (from local point of view, 800W "powerhouse" is a dud)

Browse around in the forums, actual system power draw and recommended PSU load have been discussed. My quick and dirty version is: even normal SLI systems that haven't been hand-picked by W don't usually eat up anywhere near 500W of load power, and the units are tested to run under some load anyway. One should pick a unit that will take their system's peaks and run at 60-80%(thereabouts) load for best efficiency.

I'm no expert, but all the info is right here if you have the time to read it.

Post by **NeilBlanchard** » Fri Jun 22, 2007 3:28 am

Hello,

Even a dual quad core, SLi system barely hits over 400watts (IMMSC). A SeaSonic S12 430watt would be plenty -- and it also is one of the quietest if not the quietest PSU's around.

Das_Saunamies · Post by **Das_Saunamies** » Fri Jun 22, 2007 4:46 am

Yeah. I exaggerated myself, just to make sure. If the guy doesn't know what he's doing, power rating +1.

For example neglecting dusting and airflow will call for headroom; poorly planned connections shouldn't be a problem anymore.

There's also a new S12II out, 80+ efficiency tags and all.

And to reiterate the point earlier made, the PSU swaps in a Sonata I or II have only been difficult for me if the CPU cooler has been in place. The design doesn't allow for the PSU to be retrieved through the 5.25" bays nor is there room to wedge it out next to the CPU cooler. Otherwise it's standard fare: screw off, screw on.

I'd at least try out the Earthwatts before ditching it . If it works and doesn't bother you, the swap may not be worth the extra money. SPCR has it on the Recommended list and the 430W model has been reviewed.

jaldridge6 · Post by **jaldridge6** » Fri Jun 22, 2007 12:00 pm

oh forget the whole watts thing. hey blake, get an 800 watt PSU and also buy "kill-a-watt" wattage meter. You just plug your computer into it and itll tell you how many watts its drawing from the wall. Overclocked qx6700 in SLI draws like 500 watts. I'd say a 600 watt reliable power supply would be fine, but you can get an 800 watt and itll make no difference really. youll pay a little more, but your electric bills wont be much different [depends on efficiency rating] ...

jaldridge6 · Post by **jaldridge6** » Fri Jun 22, 2007 12:01 pm

BTW earthwatts fan clicks like hell, and there are massive amount of coil buzz. it is not a quality psu.

ALSO: I dont think GTX will fit in the sonata case. You should double check that. I am sure there is a better case you can get. I agree, the 900 looks like shit. i just had one and im selling it on ebay.

AntecRep · Post by **AntecRep** » Fri Jun 22, 2007 2:57 pm

8800GTX will not fit in a Sonata. So far only 3 of our cases will work with the 8800GTX: Nine Hundred, P190 and Titan.

mcoleg · Post by **mcoleg** » Fri Jun 22, 2007 3:53 pm

AntecRep is right, of course. that's what power tools are there for, of course

jaldridge6 - m/b you got a bad unit, mine's dead quiet.

blake - you can easily do 8800gts sli plus e6600 with earthwatts 500. it's pretty powerfull, seasonic-made unit.

read up here on the power consumption:

viewtopic.php?t=41127&highlight=

Shobai · Post by **Shobai** » Fri Jun 22, 2007 5:03 pm

Blake, have a look at the Tech Report's review of the GTX, 2900XT, QX6800 - they do power readings at load and idle which are helpful for working out what sort of power supply you'll need. please take a look at the system config for each power graph, because the different components in each will mean each graph is different.

http://techreport.com/reviews/2007q2/co ... ex.x?pg=13 http://techreport.com/reviews/2007q2/ra ... ex.x?pg=15 http://techreport.com/reviews/2007q1/ge ... ex.x?pg=14

it comes down to this though [if you don't get anything else from this discussion, pick this up] :

the thing you need to watch with PSUs is the current rating on the rails. for example, nVidia recommends 8800GTXs be given 28A [amps] from the 12V rails of the supply. [in reality they don't really need that much, but it covers them from user stupidity]. so, when you're looking at a PSU, disregard everything anyone would tell you about it until you check the total current the 12V rails can supply.

now, newer PSUs will have multiple rails, which is good if you use them. eg, having a supply like the Neo HE 430W and plugging the GTX into a single 12V rail will most likely cause it to fail, and potentially take other components with it. why? because while each of the 3 rails can supply 16A, we're only using one rail to try and supply the whole 28. now, maths time: 16-28=?=busted PSU =]

so, check the rails, check how you connect the devices to the PSU.

lastly, there's what we call the "fudge factor". this is where manufacturers say "hmm, what can we get away with?" and it shows up in ratings that are at max load, non continuous. makers like seasonic, antec and others have a much better track record of listing what the PSU will supply indefinately. check out the spec sheet for the Neo HE 430W i mentioned before:

http://www.antec.com/specs/NeoHE430_spe.html

now, looking at the "output" section, what do we get if we add up all the "available power" figures? is that more or less than what antec says on the very next line?

so, in conclusion, some PSU makers are bodgy and fudge the figures, giving all PSU makers a bad name. hardware makers like nVidia realise this, and make sure that they cover themselves by recommending PSUs after taking into account this fudging. lastly, stupid people like you and myself buy these horribly overrated power supplies without researching anything about them =]
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mcoleg · Post by **mcoleg** » Fri Jun 22, 2007 5:55 pm

Shobai wrote:
the thing you need to watch with PSUs is the current rating on the rails. for example, nVidia recommends 8800GTXs be given 28A [amps] from the 12V rails of the supply.
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k, like... 28A is for the whole system, not for the card. 8800GTX alone = 132W full load, 70W idle. divide by 12v and there's your amps.

check out the link in my post, there's more numbers.

Shobai · Post by **Shobai** » Fri Jun 22, 2007 9:46 pm

sunshine, do you have a GTX? i'm sorry, but while you and i both know that the card won't need that much, that's what nVidia recommends.

come to think of it, i think that's why i said

for example, nVidia recommends 8800GTXs be given 28A [amps] from the 12V rails of the supply.

[edit for clarity] : on reflection, you rightly picked me up on saying the recommendation is for the GPU alone, i thought i had written it more clearly in my previous post. the recommendation is for the PSU to supply 28A, not the card requiring.

having said that, what i said still stands: that's what nVidia recommends.

Sonata III: swap the PSU?

Sonata III: swap the PSU?

Re: Sonata III: swap the PSU?