Dont understand...hd4850 10w idle @ 68c

Matija · Post by **Matija** » Mon Jul 21, 2008 12:05 pm

Well, so much for that... I remain convinced that it's a hardware issue after all.

mrk22 · Post by **mrk22** » Mon Jul 21, 2008 5:53 pm

Shemale wrote:The 8.7 driver is out, and power-play is not working properly.
The temperatures are the same and the power consumption from the wall remain the same

Thanks for testing this out. It's sad news, but I'm much happier knowing than wondering.

wanky · Post by **wanky** » Tue Jul 22, 2008 3:47 am

well since 8.7 don't fix it i just tried modding my sapphire 4850 bios. lowered 2d voltage to .94v works fine tho there is next to no idle temp difference despite the lower clocks and voltage. this does make me think there is hardware minimum voltage which is why these cards were released with these bios values in the first place. i guess i could verify this by measuring vgpu on the card to see if it changes

well at least i put clocks 4,5,6 (video stuff) to a middle 3d mode setting so when im using tv card its not on full power. tried setting lower voltage (1.084v) for full 3d but i noticed minor artifacts when running furmark so i just set it to -- which defaults to 1.123v for my card. the fan curve adjustment to your liking sure is nice too.

thejamppa · Post by **thejamppa** » Wed Jul 23, 2008 5:34 am

I am now just waiting that manufacturers come with their own cooling solutions for the HD 4850 and that powerplay will be enabled without Bios upgrade. Idea would have something like Akasa Vortexx Neo: http://www.akasa.com.tw/akasa_english/s ... 3_bluv.htm on cooler out of box ( I just hope they would kill the blue leds )

Now my dream version would have dual slot card that exhausts the air out of the case like old Arctic Colling silencers or HIS IceQ-products... but Noise would probably be pain and I really wish that I could use vga coolers own power plug so I can directly control its behaviour with CCC-profiles.

HD 4870 would be almost like that but its so overkill for my needs ( currently 17" CRT temporarily as I am waiting new 22" TFT ) I don't think my needs would much require HD 4870...

Edit: After reading VortexxNeo's review in Chilled PC I decided risk myself with it. Hey it only costs 26â‚¬, which is still around 6 â‚¬'s more than Accelero, but easier installation and exhausts air out of case.

I can live with bright blue leds *growls loudly* Since they are very deep in the case and cannot shine in the eyes like led fans etc. Chilled PC review that in their test HD 4850 stock cooler results: 72 C's in idle and 84 C's with Ati+Tool etc out side of the case and with VortexxNeo Idle were 29 degree's C and load were 42 degree's C. I placed one Vortexx in order waiting for my HD 4850.

I'll put some user review of it once I get systems together and then I should have Canon Ixus 400 camera on my hands (once my brother gives it to me next week or so ) so i wouldn't need to bother you guys with crappy phone camera pictures.

Initial suspection: Cooler probably kills reference cooler in temperatures insideand out side the case. 80mm fan od that style rp'ming 2500 rpms is probably way too loud for SPCR but there might be headroom for using manual control, which I will find out if I find fanmate2 somewhere ^^

Vaiski · Post by **Vaiski** » Wed Jul 23, 2008 7:37 am

I'm thinking about going for 4850 and putting Accelero S1 with 2x120mm fans on it.. that should keep every part of card cool. Anyone else done that?

thejamppa · Post by **thejamppa** » Wed Jul 23, 2008 7:44 am

Some I know in here have put Accelero and run it with single 120mm undervolted fan. So dual fan might be a slight overkill... And some run their HD 4850 passively with Accelero.

Stumbles · Post by **Stumbles** » Thu Jul 24, 2008 8:17 am

thejamppa wrote:I am now just waiting that manufacturers come with their own cooling solutions for the HD 4850 and that powerplay will be enabled without Bios upgrade. Idea would have something like Akasa Vortexx Neo: http://www.akasa.com.tw/akasa_english/s ... 3_bluv.htm on cooler out of box ( I just hope they would kill the blue leds )

Now my dream version would have dual slot card that exhausts the air out of the case like old Arctic Colling silencers or HIS IceQ-products... but Noise would probably be pain and I really wish that I could use vga coolers own power plug so I can directly control its behaviour with CCC-profiles.

HD 4870 would be almost like that but its so overkill for my needs ( currently 17" CRT temporarily as I am waiting new 22" TFT ) I don't think my needs would much require HD 4870...

Edit: After reading VortexxNeo's review in Chilled PC I decided risk myself with it. Hey it only costs 26â‚¬, which is still around 6 â‚¬'s more than Accelero, but easier installation and exhausts air out of case.

I can live with bright blue leds *growls loudly* Since they are very deep in the case and cannot shine in the eyes like led fans etc. Chilled PC review that in their test HD 4850 stock cooler results: 72 C's in idle and 84 C's with Ati+Tool etc out side of the case and with VortexxNeo Idle were 29 degree's C and load were 42 degree's C. I placed one Vortexx in order waiting for my HD 4850.

I'll put some user review of it once I get systems together and then I should have Canon Ixus 400 camera on my hands (once my brother gives it to me next week or so ) so i wouldn't need to bother you guys with crappy phone camera pictures.

Initial suspection: Cooler probably kills reference cooler in temperatures insideand out side the case. 80mm fan od that style rp'ming 2500 rpms is probably way too loud for SPCR but there might be headroom for using manual control, which I will find out if I find fanmate2 somewhere ^^

Yes, please let us know how this goes. I'm want to put a 4850 in my HTPC/gaming project, but I'm worried about heat/noise. I won't be able to fit the Accelero s1 in my Antec Fusion case without some serious bending, so I'm looking for another nice, quiet option. It doesn't need to be totally silent (especially under load), but I would hope to not be able to hear it from my couch when idle.

Your help would be much appreciated.

Thanks!

thejamppa · Post by **thejamppa** » Thu Jul 24, 2008 11:20 am

Stumbles wrote: Yes, please let us know how this goes. I'm want to put a 4850 in my HTPC/gaming project, but I'm worried about heat/noise. I won't be able to fit the Accelero s1 in my Antec Fusion case without some serious bending, so I'm looking for another nice, quiet option. It doesn't need to be totally silent (especially under load), but I would hope to not be able to hear it from my couch when idle.

Your help would be much appreciated.

Thanks!

I hope this will work, as I just saw Sapphire HD 4850 Toxic with pre-fitted Zalman VF900... made me drool bit...

FartingBob · Post by **FartingBob** » Thu Jul 24, 2008 1:55 pm

thejamppa wrote:Some I know in here have put Accelero and run it with single 120mm undervolted fan. So dual fan might be a slight overkill... And some run their HD 4850 passively with Accelero.

Ive got my 4850 with an accelero and 500rpm slipstream , and i could get rid of it, but i dont need the extra slot and as SPCR showed the 500 is basically as quiet as you can get.

Passive would be fine providing you have an intake fan aimed roughly in its direction. 2 fans on the S1 is overkill.

Matija · Post by **Matija** » Sun Jul 27, 2008 11:26 am

I've been thinking...

I want the 4850, but I don't want 110W heating up the air inside my case. That Akasa thing would be perfect, or anything that exhausts heat out immediately. What are the odds of someone coming up with a card that has a stock dual-slot cooler? Anyone spotted anything?

thejamppa · Post by **thejamppa** » Sun Jul 27, 2008 12:57 pm

Matija wrote:I've been thinking...

I want the 4850, but I don't want 110W heating up the air inside my case. That Akasa thing would be perfect, or anything that exhausts heat out immediately. What are the odds of someone coming up with a card that has a stock dual-slot cooler? Anyone spotted anything?

HIS probably will soon bring their IceQ series on this like always have released IceQ version with rear exhaustion since 9800 pro and VGA silencer combination. They have nice rear exhaust IceQ 3 series with HD 38x0 but fan is not silent and not quiet by SPCR standard...

Ahma · Post by **Ahma** » Mon Jul 28, 2008 9:09 am

Hi,

Could someone try lowering core/memory frequencies with AMD GPU Clock Tool and see if idle temperatures drop.

I have HD 4870 + WinXP and when I lowered memory clock to 200 MHz instead of default 900 MHz my idle power consumption dropped about 30-35 watts and idle temperatures with aftermarket cooler dropped ~14Â°C. Of course when you start 3D application you'll have to restore higher clocks, but it's only one click in Clock Tool, so...

I don't know if this works in similiar way with 4850, but if someone's willing to try some frequencies, please post your results here.

Also worth noticing: dropping GPU frequency doesn't affect idle power consumption or temperature at all with HD 4870, so I don't know what the current "PowerPlay" is supposed to do...

Ahma · Post by **Ahma** » Mon Jul 28, 2008 9:11 am

AMD GPU Clock Tool

and a pic of my GPU-Z (couldn't post links/URLs with my first post, darn :)

mrk22 · Post by **mrk22** » Mon Jul 28, 2008 7:09 pm

Saphire put out a 4850 with a stock Zalman cooler on it and the temps seem to be much improved.

http://www.hexus.net/content/item.php?i ... 60&page=11

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nafets · Post by **nafets** » Mon Jul 28, 2008 11:22 pm

Ahma · Post by **Ahma** » Tue Jul 29, 2008 12:40 am

Great post there, nafets!

Thanks for the info on AGCT shortcuts, gonna create them right away.

Let's hope we get a tool for controlling the voltage on the card soon. Then we might be able to take advantage of idle core freq drop way more than now. And also if there would be some kind of fix for the 2d/3d mode switching when using PowerPlay.. Then we could make use of changing BIOS settings without that annoying flickering.

Hope they can make some improvements with 4870 idle power consumption in the next CCC version or release a new better working BIOS or something.. At the moment power saving requires too much from the user IMO.

Thank you once more for the tips.

MoJo · Post by **MoJo** » Tue Jul 29, 2008 1:48 am

One question nafets: what about video decoding?

The 48x0 cards have H.264 decoding on-board. How does underclocking affect it? I don't imagine memory speed would have much of an impact but GPU core speed should.

nafets · Post by **nafets** » Tue Jul 29, 2008 1:23 pm

elitezoid · Post by **elitezoid** » Wed Jul 30, 2008 7:48 am

nafets wrote: For me 250MHz, was the lowest I could go with my HD4870's memory. Any lower and I'd get "yellow snow" artifacting. Lowering the memory from the default 900MHz to 250MHz, while in idle mode saves around 30W, which is fantastic. As you've also stated, temperatures on my card, in Gpu-Z, dropped from 7C to 12C, which is also excellent.

On the other hand, underclocking the GPU from 500MHz to 160MHz results in a paltry 1W savings, and had little or no effect on temperatures. B

Tried this on my card last night, while the GPU could be clocked right down to 50MHz the memory started causing screen corruption if I went below 450MHz which is a real shame considering this appears to be where the heat and energy savings are.

Is there anything else I could try or am I stuck with a poorly under clocking card?

Think it might be worth reverting back to the original HIS bios as currently I'm using the newer MSI bios?

Tzupy · Post by **Tzupy** » Wed Jul 30, 2008 8:16 am

HIS Radeon HD 4850 ICEQ4 unveiled, link to vr-zone forums:
http://forums.vr-zone.com/showthread.php?t=307694

Kaleid · Post by **Kaleid** » Wed Jul 30, 2008 8:28 am

Tzupy wrote:HIS Radeon HD 4850 ICEQ4 unveiled, link to vr-zone forums:
http://forums.vr-zone.com/showthread.php?t=307694

Now its starting to look like something. Unfortunately the fan is still too small to be really quiet.

Matija · Post by **Matija** » Wed Jul 30, 2008 8:38 am

I don't think I've ever seen HIS cards for sale in Croatia

We're swamped with Gigabytes, PowerColors and Sapphires...

MoJo · Post by **MoJo** » Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:38 am

nafets wrote:The only reason I don't mess with voltages is because I have no idea what values are suitable for undervolting during the 2D state. I am very certain of the stability while running the HD4870 with lowered GPU/mem clock speeds, but I'd be rather uncertain with using lowered voltage settings.

Is there any reason not to try it? If the settings are temporary, undervolting certainly won't hurt the card. I recently got one too so once I get it installed I might give it a try.

As far as video decoding goes, I'm assuming that would fall under the 3DLP (Low Power) state. Currently both the HD4850 and HD4870 have GPU/mem clocks that are the same in 2D and 3DLP states. I don't do any of that so I can't say what the performance impact would be, running underclocked. Your best bet if you do video decoding is to add a third shortcut, which would be the default 3DLP state. An example from my HD4870;

Okay, thanks. I guess I'll have to experiment myself too.

Out of interest, to anyone with Vista - what does Aero do? Force the card to LP3D all the time?

nafets · Post by **nafets** » Wed Jul 30, 2008 1:27 pm

nafets · Post by **nafets** » Wed Jul 30, 2008 7:24 pm

mjw21a · Post by **mjw21a** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 12:22 am

Who cares guys. Installing the Accelero S1 on my system dropped my HD4850 temps significantly (more than 20C) and its passive. Why are we worried about temps? It's just inadequate cooling coupled with power management not being enabled.

nafets · Post by **nafets** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 2:29 am

Stumbles · Post by **Stumbles** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 8:12 am

Quick question:

I'm looking for a nice gaming video card to go in a HTPC case (antec fusion 430). I can't fit the 4850 plus an s1 in this case without some serious bending, but I don't want to deal with high idle noises that I've seen complained about on the stock cooler.

Would the sapphire toxic be a good choice? I've read that its quieter, cooler, and faster.

Also, I've never built a PC before, so would anyone have a good idea of if the Toxic would fit in the antec fusion? It looks like it would to me (obv. taking up an extra slot), but I'm just checking.

Thanks!

mjw21a · Post by **mjw21a** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 2:05 pm

nafets wrote:My results shown in the pictures are with an HD4870 with an Accelero S1 Rev. 2. Any improvement in temperatures seen is a result of lowered 2D GPU/MEM clocks.

I'm not really looking for lower temperatures, but rather lower power usage, during IDLE. The lower temperatures is just an added bonus...

I'd just be patient dude. Eventually newer driver revisions will fix this, how long we have to wait is the question though. Personally it doesn't worry me, just get the most efficient PSU you can get, it will offset the actual power used

SPCR reckons the new Enermax PSU's are the bomb, I just got my Corsair/rebadged Seasonic as it was about $100AU cheaper than the Enermax.

nutball · Post by **nutball** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 10:59 pm

mjw21a wrote:Eventually newer driver revisions will fix this, how long we have to wait is the question though.

Could you do us all a favour and give us a link to an official statement from ATI that backs up this optimism? I've seen nothing from them whatsoever, despite some trying their best goad Mr Baumann into contradicting suggestions that PP on 4870 is to all intents and purposes either "broken" or "not worth giving a name".

Dont understand...hd4850 10w idle @ 68c

HD4870 + AMD Gpu Clock Tool = Lower heat + Less energy...

Re: HD4870 + AMD Gpu Clock Tool = Lower heat + Less energy..

Re: HD4870 + AMD Gpu Clock Tool = Lower heat + Less energy..