PWM desing of reference modern graphics cards

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lb_felipe
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PWM desing of reference modern graphics cards

Post by lb_felipe » Sun Mar 13, 2016 4:58 pm

We know that the reference graphics cards can not control standard PWM fans speed.

My question is whether the MSI GTX 980 Ti Gaming 6G can, in view of this topic: https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showt ... st28312580

What happens is that the Arctic Cooling Accelero Xtreme IV changed the design compared to previous Accelero. The wires were standard black, red, yellow and blue became black, yellow, green and blue so that its fans can have their speed controlled by modern graphics cards.

The adapter that comes with the MK-26 uses the default scheme. It turns out that the USV14 has a different wire arrangement, which may explain the fact that graphics cards get control them.

That is, if you do not use the USV14 with this cooler, as control via graphics card, speed of standard fans? Only with MSI in question on the topic mentioned?

PS.: What intrigues me is that cited MSI has an array equal to the reference boards (or is some kind of mismatch colors?).

Abula
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Re: PWM desing of reference modern graphics cards

Post by Abula » Sun Mar 13, 2016 5:26 pm

I can only give you my insight on my personal experience on GTX780 (reference) upgrade to accelero III and then IV.

The Accelero III used to work fine previous to the GTX780, to what i remember it worked fine, but on the GTX780, the accelero III simply coudnt control the the fans, to what i rememebr it even was unstable, like it couldnt read the signal of the fans reliably. Now on the Accelero IV, something was changed by Artic and now you can control them fine, not to the point of turn them off but you could have them setup with MSI Afterburner to whaver the fan accepted.

Personally i have also tried using MODDYI adapters on other GPUs, like GTX750Ti and GTX970, and i wasnt able to control standard PWM fans, honestly i dont know if the cabling is different or if there is another standard being used, but the fact remains the same i was not able to control them, but the interesting thing is that using the reverse cable i can measure and control the fans on the respective heatsinks.

Overall its very confusing subject, and one that not that many enter or mess with, so you are practically alone, my suggestion is forget PWM, the MK26 is so mighty that you will be fine with a steady rpms, just chose 120mm fans that you like tone wise and be happy, thats what ill be doing with Pascal soon.

lb_felipe
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Re: PWM desing of reference modern graphics cards

Post by lb_felipe » Sun Mar 13, 2016 6:28 pm

Thanks for the suggestion.

I was thinking of MSI GTX 980 Ti Gaming 6G because that thread. It semms that guy can control the speed, but as I don't know English, I am not sure about that.

Beside that, it already comes with a appropriate VRM heatsink.

Speaking of forgeting PWM or any speed control, I just can think of Scythe Slip Stream "SL" (500 rpm) for a silent graphics card cooled by MK-26. As it is sleeve bearing, which do you think is best horizontal way to go with it, convencional upfire (for using with a Fractal Design Define R5) or downfire (Corsair 600Q)?

What about letting MB to control the fans (which may be PWM or DC), like SPCR did once in one of its guide?

Abula
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Re: PWM desing of reference modern graphics cards

Post by Abula » Sun Mar 13, 2016 6:42 pm

lb_felipe wrote:What about letting MB to control the fans (which may be PWM or DC), like SPCR did once in one of its guide?
Well you can control the fans via motherboard there is no issue with that, but the problem is for them to react to the GPU temperature, the motherboard doesnt know what temp is the GPU running, unless there is a probe/connector that could.... but this are dreams my friend. A program that might be able to is SPEEDFAN, but i never had good luck supporting my motherboards.
lb_felipe wrote:I was thinking of MSI GTX 980 Ti Gaming 6G because that thread. It semms that guy can control the speed, but as I don't know English, I am not sure about that.

Beside that, it already comes with a appropriate VRM heatsink.

Speaking of forgeting PWM or any speed control, I just can think of Scythe Slip Stream "SL" (500 rpm) for a silent graphics card cooled by MK-26. As it is sleeve bearing, which do you think is best horizontal way to go with it, convencional upfire (for using with a Fractal Design Define R5) or downfire (Corsair 600Q)?
Well i never really tested the MODDYI adapters on the MSI GTX980Ti, i never planned on using MK26 on them as i knew i needed to SLI them, so there was no space for such a cooler in my setup, but i do plan to go into on Pascal, thats if 1 card can do 4k fine.

That said, i might have some free time between 24 and the 27, i could try testing it, ill be assembling a test bench soon, so i could give a shot, i was suppose to be assembling a microphone setup to measure dbs, but i dont think that will take me that long, so i could take out one of my GPUs transpose it to the test bench, use the MODDYI adapters and tell you if it can control certain fans, i have some Noctua and Thermalright PWM fans at home to see.

But i wont make any promises, beer might get the best of me those days =P

lb_felipe
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Re: PWM desing of reference modern graphics cards

Post by lb_felipe » Sun Mar 13, 2016 8:02 pm

Thanks.

I am hopeful you will do that. :)

Off topic: Why do you do matter of having 4k for gaming? Excuse me for my intrusion, but I have read that with current monitors 4h is a pointless except for static image. This has to do with motion clarity, PWM flicker, strobbling etc.

Everthing I read from a guy known as Menacingtuba or NCX over the web forums. Link: http://wecravegamestoo.com/forums/monit ... iscussion/

He is on Hardforum and OCN. I can see his point, but I am not a specialist to say whether or not he is right.

edh
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Re: PWM desing of reference modern graphics cards

Post by edh » Mon Mar 14, 2016 1:42 am

I have no trouble using one of these cables:
http://gelidsolutions.com/products/inde ... d=11&id=60

boost
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Re: PWM desing of reference modern graphics cards

Post by boost » Mon Mar 14, 2016 2:25 am

edh wrote:I have no trouble using one of these cables:
http://gelidsolutions.com/products/inde ... d=11&id=60
Worked great for me, too, on my GTX970.

lb_felipe
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Re: PWM desing of reference modern graphics cards

Post by lb_felipe » Mon Mar 14, 2016 3:30 am

edh wrote:I have no trouble using one of these cables:
http://gelidsolutions.com/products/inde ... d=11&id=60
boost wrote:Worked great for me, too, on my GTX970.
OK, thanks, but what fan is used?

quest_for_silence
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Re: PWM desing of reference modern graphics cards

Post by quest_for_silence » Mon Mar 14, 2016 3:31 am

boost wrote:
edh wrote:I have no trouble using one of these cables:
http://gelidsolutions.com/products/inde ... d=11&id=60
Worked great for me, too, on my GTX970.
+1 (on 460, 560ti-448, 650ti, 660, 970).

lb_felipe wrote:OK, thanks, but what fan is used?

A PWM one.

edh
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Re: PWM desing of reference modern graphics cards

Post by edh » Mon Mar 14, 2016 4:27 am

I have noticed that the fan curve behaviour changes when swapping a fan using the Gelid adaptor cable. It is also perhaps possible that with some graphics card firmware fan speed routines that the use of a 3rd party fan which runs at a lower RPM causes the card to failsafe and run the fan at 100%.

Imagine the graphics card thinking like this:

1. I'm powering on, fan speed at 100%. :|
2. I'm a graphics card, here is my RAM, here are my outputs. :|
3. Checking fan speed, my reference fan runs at 3000rpm at 100% but I'm only seeing 800rpm. The fan must be broken or something, only one thing to do.... :?
4. POWEEERR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Setting the fan speed for 100% all of the time! :twisted:

baii
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Re: PWM desing of reference modern graphics cards

Post by baii » Mon Mar 14, 2016 11:12 am

I used the gelid one on 7970 290(x) and fury. All 3 can control arctic f9.
On the 290, I tried a few other fan like ss120, ty147a, slim scythe pwm and those all work. The ones that didn't work was nzxt x31 stock 120mm fan.

lb_felipe
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Re: PWM desing of reference modern graphics cards

Post by lb_felipe » Mon Mar 14, 2016 6:12 pm

quest_for_silence wrote:
boost wrote:
edh wrote:I have no trouble using one of these cables:
http://gelidsolutions.com/products/inde ... d=11&id=60
Worked great for me, too, on my GTX970.
+1 (on 460, 560ti-448, 650ti, 660, 970).

lb_felipe wrote:OK, thanks, but what fan is used?

A PWM one.
Thanks.
edh wrote:I have noticed that the fan curve behaviour changes when swapping a fan using the Gelid adaptor cable. It is also perhaps possible that with some graphics card firmware fan speed routines that the use of a 3rd party fan which runs at a lower RPM causes the card to failsafe and run the fan at 100%.

Imagine the graphics card thinking like this:

1. I'm powering on, fan speed at 100%. :|
2. I'm a graphics card, here is my RAM, here are my outputs. :|
3. Checking fan speed, my reference fan runs at 3000rpm at 100% but I'm only seeing 800rpm. The fan must be broken or something, only one thing to do.... :?
4. POWEEERR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Setting the fan speed for 100% all of the time! :twisted:
Briliant thinking!

Brilliant thought!
baii wrote:I used the gelid one on 7970 290(x) and fury. All 3 can control arctic f9.
On the 290, I tried a few other fan like ss120, ty147a, slim scythe pwm and those all work. The ones that didn't work was nzxt x31 stock 120mm fan.
Thanks for collaborate with our base of knlowedge. That seems like what edh said.

quest_for_silence
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Re: PWM desing of reference modern graphics cards

Post by quest_for_silence » Tue Mar 15, 2016 12:03 am

lb_felipe wrote:Thanks for collaborate with our base of knlowedge. That seems like what edh said.
From what I may understand, no, it doesn't.

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