I've put a ton of work into my system, and it's not SILENT!

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Telix
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I've put a ton of work into my system, and it's not SILENT!

Post by Telix » Tue Nov 08, 2005 2:30 pm

Let me give you the important (heat/cooling/noise involved) system specs:
Athlon 2400+ @ 200x10 @ 1.65V (stock voltage I believe), using a Thermaltake SI-97 heatsink with a 92mm Nexus fan at full speed.
Abit NF7-S with zalman chipset heatsink.
ATI 9800 XT with VGA silencer.
Antec SLK3000B case, with front 120mm Nexus at 7v and stock tri-cool fan in rear at 12v, running on lowest speed.
Seasonic S-12 330W PSU.
3 Seagate 7200.7/8 HD's, suspended via elastic cable in the 5.25" bays.

Most of the time, this is a damn quiet box. With any ambient noise, even the fridge cooling hum when it's charging, it's pretty much silent. If I listen for it, though, or it's nighttime and silent, I can hear the computer with no problem. I use my computer A LOT during the nighttime, and listen to music critically, and value my silence.

The issue is, I don't see where I can cut noise! The sound appears to be mostly coming from the CPU/PSU area - I'm actually not that impressed with the Seasonic's "silence". I think I may be getting some turbulence noise from the front and rear fan intakes and exhausts - does cutting out the grills usually stop this noise?

An option, perhaps, is undervolting the CPU fan, but will that sufficently cool the CPU? It already isn't cool at 44-45C at idle. My case temp is usually around 32C.

I also am hearing a bit of bearing noise on at least one seagate, which annoys me.

Would using an acoustic foam pack benefit me? Which one is usually suggested for the SLK3000B? - no premade pack exists, strangely.

Thanks!

sun.moon
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Post by sun.moon » Tue Nov 08, 2005 2:45 pm

Hi,

Try to undervolt the CPU fan. 7V should be ok, but monitor the temps. I also replaced the tri-cool with a Papst at 5V (see sig). It made a difference.

Also cutting out the front and rear grills made quite a bit of difference. I just used wire snips.

Here is a thread about modding the S12 - two jobs that worked out well. I haven't pursued this avenue yet... But I haven't completely written it off yet either :wink:

Good luck!

-sun.moon
[color=darkblue][size=75]| SOLO w/ 1x 120mm 4412 F/2GLL rear, 2x 92mm 3412 N/2GLLE front | S12II 430W | ASUS P5K Premium | C2D E8400 OCd @3.60 w/ Ultra 120 & 120mm AF12025 PWM | ASUS 8600GT passive | 3GB Kingston ValueRam 800MHz | suspended 1x T166 500GB HDD & 1x 7200.7 120GB HDD | LiteOn DVD R/W | LiteOn DVD R | Vista Ultimate | EIZO S1931 |[/size][/color]

darthan
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Post by darthan » Tue Nov 08, 2005 2:48 pm

If you're running fans at 12V you really shouldn't complain that it isn't silent because, well, it couldn't be. Undervolt that Nexus on your CPU. I bet that the Nexus is the loudest thing in your system. And don't worry about cooling your CPU properly, 45C is perfectly acceptable temps for a CPU (you really should tell us LOAD temps though-that's what really matters) and Athlon XPs are rated to go up to 70C or 75C without troubles. Actually, I'd go so far as to say undervolt it and run Prime95 for a day. If you have no problems, don't worry about your CPU temps. Especially don't worry about your CPU temps because Abit boards are infamous for overreporting the temperature.

Cutting out the fan grills may also be helpful although Antec fan grills are usually pretty non-restrictive. I suspect you may eventually want to replace the Tri-Cool as they are never silent. I use 'em, but that's because they came with my P180 and I am going for tolerable quiet not silence. (And can't justify buying Nexus fans :cry:).

As to the annoying Seagate, well, maybe an enclosure is in order for it or maybe you should replace with one of the current favorite Samsungs.

Badger
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Post by Badger » Tue Nov 08, 2005 5:49 pm

I also have a 2400+, the mobile variety at 35 watts. If you want to cool it quietly, you can't OC it. I run mine at 166x11= 1.83ghz, at 1.35 volts. I also have an SI-97 and a Nexus 92mm. If you want it quiet, you have to run that 92mm fan at 5v. Running this way, I have case temps of 35-36C, and the CPU idles at 49-51C. Loads around 57-60C.

Also, try removing the 120mm Nexus from the front intake and put it as the exhaust fan at 5 volts, if yours will start up reliably there. Just take the Tri-cool fan out of the equation altogether. In my personal experience, I've had temperatures to be all around lower without the intake fan - a consequence of case pressure and all that jazz.

Also, as sun.moon linked to, that thread is a good resource for eliminating any noise your PSU may make. In it I have my own pictures for swapping the S12's fan for a Nexus, although I highly recommend you silence everything else first before pursuing to silence the already quiet S12.

I think that your hard drives, even suspended, are going to be louder than the S12. I only think this because in my own personal experience, suspending two drives with elastic didn't do much. At least, not nearly as much as putting them in aluminum enclosures.

For other ideas, I recommend checking out my post here http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewtopic.php?t=26455 since our builds are pretty similiar.
[size=75]Antec 3700BQE | Seasonic S12-330 | Intel E4300 at 1.14v at 2.4 ghz with passive Scythe Ninja | Kingston 2 x 1 gb PC3200 | ATI X1950Pro AGP 512 mb with Thermalright HR-03A | WD 120 gb HD in homemade enclosure[/size]

agus_c_o
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Re: I've put a ton of work into my system, and it's not SILE

Post by agus_c_o » Tue Nov 08, 2005 8:28 pm

Telix wrote:An option, perhaps, is undervolting the CPU fan, but will that sufficently cool the CPU? It already isn't cool at 44-45C at idle. My case temp is usually around 32C.
Your Thermaltake SI-97 heatsink should do a good job at 7 volts perhaps even at 5 with a 92mm Nexus fan. Keep in mind that abit boards are known to report higher temps.

My Abit board used to report 7ºc higher CPU temps accordingly to
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article191-page1.html
temps reported were idle CPU 39° , cpuburn in 45 min CPU 53°
So I updated the board Bios and it now reports 9ºc below.
temps report now idle CPU 30° , cpuburn in 45 min CPU 43°
abit KV8 Pro, Athlon 64 2800+, Zalman CNPS7000-Cu fan swap, Kingston 512M, ATI Radeon 9550 @397Mhz 256M@225Mhz..Zalman ZM 80D-HP,Samsung SP0812C JVC FDB suspended, Centurion 5 moded to fit 120mm intake.

Elixer
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Post by Elixer » Tue Nov 08, 2005 9:44 pm

Here's what I would do (or well try):

Remove the tricool fan and replace it with the 120mm nexus at 7V that you have. You shouldn't need a front fan. If you need more cooling power grab a fan controller and run it at a slightly higher voltage.

7V the nexus on your cpu. You will loose some cooling though this is probably one of your worst sources of noise. Try to undervolt your cpu if you can. Check stability with 8+ hours of prime 95.

Block off the side panel intakes? I keep my cpu duct because it improves my cpu temps greatly, however some spcrers block theirs to cut on noise.

Remount cpu heatsink. 45C at idle seems high for your configuration, but it may just be your motherboard is over-reporting. It's definitely worth checking your load temperature with CPU burn or burn-in.

Beyond this I can't think of anything for you to do without major upgrading. I imagine your system is at a point where the hard drives are becoming the prevailing noise and there's not much you can do about that. I guess you could enclose them, but that's a lot of $ for 3 hard drives.
Best of luck.

ChiBOY83
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Post by ChiBOY83 » Wed Nov 09, 2005 1:03 pm

Elixer wrote:Here's what I would do (or well try):

Remove the tricool fan and replace it with the 120mm nexus at 7V that you have. You shouldn't need a front fan. If you need more cooling power grab a fan controller and run it at a slightly higher voltage.

7V the nexus on your cpu. You will loose some cooling though this is probably one of your worst sources of noise. Try to undervolt your cpu if you can. Check stability with 8+ hours of prime 95.

Block off the side panel intakes? I keep my cpu duct because it improves my cpu temps greatly, however some spcrers block theirs to cut on noise.

Remount cpu heatsink. 45C at idle seems high for your configuration, but it may just be your motherboard is over-reporting. It's definitely worth checking your load temperature with CPU burn or burn-in.

Beyond this I can't think of anything for you to do without major upgrading. I imagine your system is at a point where the hard drives are becoming the prevailing noise and there's not much you can do about that. I guess you could enclose them, but that's a lot of $ for 3 hard drives.
Best of luck.

....ditto

Telix
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Post by Telix » Thu Nov 10, 2005 12:39 am

Here is what I've tested out so far:

1. Removed Tri-cool and replaced with 120mm Nexus from the front, running at 5v from the low-speed fan header provided from seasonic. This raises my case temperatures, and thus the CPU temperatures, considerably. It essentially makes it impossible to run my CPU fan off the lo-speed header as well. I think I will have to hack a 7v fan connection, as 5v may be too low for the 92mm heatsink fan.

2. The increased case temperatures I believe are causing the Seasonic to ramp up it's fan speed, which is creating increased fan noise.

3. I am hearing more bearing noise than fan noise at the moment, I think.

4. I want to re-seat the heatsink, but do to it well essentially requires the removal of the motherboard. I'll do this when I sound insulate the case.

5. The side intakes have been blocked since day 1 with electric tape.

To do:

1. I may attempt some sort of sound insulation with vinyl tiles and corkboard around the 5.25 bays where the drives are suspended, and on the sides of the case itself. I don't know how well this kind of technique cuts down on high-pitched bearing noise.

2. Replace Seasonic fan with Nexus 120mm.

3. Purchase or create some 7v fan headers, or some Zalman fanmates.

4. Cut out fan grills to reduce turbulence noise and line with vaccuum tubing. I think if I cut the grills and run the Nexus at 7v, it will help drop the case temps and stop the Seasonic from ramping up so much. It will also enable me to run the HSF at 7v as well.

lunix
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My feedback

Post by lunix » Thu Nov 10, 2005 1:06 am

I'm pretty happy with my Thermal Take Sonic Tower CL-P0071 for my CPU heatsink. It is fairly lightweight for its size and I don't need a dedicated CPU fan for my AMD Athlon 64 3500 processor. I use a Vantec Stealth 120mm system fan to cool it when necessary using the onboard temperature control mechanism. What I find is when doing light work like browsing the internet, the temperature stays at a cool 30C. I set the fan to kick in at 40C which only happens when doing heavy work like playing a game. Even running at 1400RPM, the system fan can cool the CPU back down to 35C in a minute so the cooling capacity seems adequate.

Since I also have a fanless VGA card and an Antec SmartPower, there is no system noise during light use except for harddrive seeks which are barely noticable. However I am not happy with VGA card stock heatsink and am considering replacing with a Zalman heatsink to improve cooling. Secondly, the Vantec Stealth does not respond to the variable speed control of my temperature control system so it is either off or stays at 1400RPM. Furthermore the Vantec has a slight rattling noise at slow speed that annoys me. Thus I recently ordered a Nexus 120MM fan to see how it fares under variable speed control and slow speed noise.

Badger
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Post by Badger » Thu Nov 10, 2005 1:09 pm

Telix wrote:Here is what I've tested out so far:

1. Removed Tri-cool and replaced with 120mm Nexus from the front, running at 5v from the low-speed fan header provided from seasonic. This raises my case temperatures, and thus the CPU temperatures, considerably. It essentially makes it impossible to run my CPU fan off the lo-speed header as well. I think I will have to hack a 7v fan connection, as 5v may be too low for the 92mm heatsink fan.
Have you tried removing the front fan completely? It may seem odd, I know, but for a lot of people it does help.
[size=75]Antec 3700BQE | Seasonic S12-330 | Intel E4300 at 1.14v at 2.4 ghz with passive Scythe Ninja | Kingston 2 x 1 gb PC3200 | ATI X1950Pro AGP 512 mb with Thermalright HR-03A | WD 120 gb HD in homemade enclosure[/size]

sun.moon
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Post by sun.moon » Thu Nov 10, 2005 3:24 pm

Telix wrote:5. The side intakes have been blocked since day 1 with electric tape.
The first verison of my setup also had the side intakes taped shut. After opening the CPU intake my CPU temps dropped 2-3 degrees C. You might want to try that, or the duct for that matter.
[color=darkblue][size=75]| SOLO w/ 1x 120mm 4412 F/2GLL rear, 2x 92mm 3412 N/2GLLE front | S12II 430W | ASUS P5K Premium | C2D E8400 OCd @3.60 w/ Ultra 120 & 120mm AF12025 PWM | ASUS 8600GT passive | 3GB Kingston ValueRam 800MHz | suspended 1x T166 500GB HDD & 1x 7200.7 120GB HDD | LiteOn DVD R/W | LiteOn DVD R | Vista Ultimate | EIZO S1931 |[/size][/color]

sthayashi
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Re: I've put a ton of work into my system, and it's not SILE

Post by sthayashi » Thu Nov 10, 2005 10:48 pm

Telix wrote:Athlon 2400+ @ 200x10 @ 1.65V (stock voltage I believe), using a Thermaltake SI-97 heatsink with a 92mm Nexus fan at full speed.
Abit NF7-S with zalman chipset heatsink.
ATI 9800 XT with VGA silencer.
Antec SLK3000B case, with front 120mm Nexus at 7v and stock tri-cool fan in rear at 12v, running on lowest speed.
Seasonic S-12 330W PSU.
3 Seagate 7200.7/8 HD's, suspended via elastic cable in the 5.25" bays.
Heh, my guess would have been the VGA Silencer, the 3 Seagate drives, or the Stock case fan.

Get yourself some cable ties, stop those fans and determine the answer. Sound is tricky. Just because it "sounds" like it's originating from the CPU/PSU does not actually mean that it is (and yes, I've fallen victim to that).
[size=75][url=http://www.twolf1300.net/sthayashi/SPCR/systems.html]My Power Rig, Storage Rig, HTPC and Main Rig[/url][/size]

Telix
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Post by Telix » Fri Nov 11, 2005 11:34 am

Badger wrote:
Have you tried removing the front fan completely? It may seem odd, I know, but for a lot of people it does help.
Sorry this wasn't clear. The front fan is totally removed. The 120mm Nexus is at 5v in the rear of the case.

Telix
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Re: I've put a ton of work into my system, and it's not SILE

Post by Telix » Fri Nov 11, 2005 11:38 am

sthayashi wrote: Heh, my guess would have been the VGA Silencer, the 3 Seagate drives, or the Stock case fan.

Get yourself some cable ties, stop those fans and determine the answer. Sound is tricky. Just because it "sounds" like it's originating from the CPU/PSU does not actually mean that it is (and yes, I've fallen victim to that).
The VGA Silencer is silent on it's low speed setting - I've tested. I can hear an appreciable difference in sound output (with my head by the open case) when I lower the HSF fan to 5v, but it simply gets too hot to do that. Nevertheless, the drive bearing noise (I thought Seagates were nearly silent!) and PSU noise are overpowering the HSF noise anyway.

I think my next steps are going to be re-seating the HSF on the CPU, getting some Fanmates, and hacking some sound insulation into the 3000B, to attempt to eliminate drive noise. My biggest concern at the moment is the PSU, which IS NOT as silent as I was led to believe. I probably will replace the fan with a 120mm Nexus.

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