sub $500 system

[buck1s]

Any suggestions on components?

I greatly prefer silence over power. No gaming on this machine. I will be creating/running statistical models, but need nothing too much faster than my Mac G4 867MHZ PowerPC, 2G ram that I have at work. I will also need to use Timbuktu and VNC to remote into work from this machine.

Does a socket 939 MB make sense? Don't need dual core now but might like to upgrade someday.

Thanks.

[jaganath]

Any suggestions on components?

Seasonic/Nexus PSU
Cheapest socket 939 mobo (that supports Cool n'Quiet)
Athlon 64 3000+ CPU (socket 939)
Budget graphics card
Budget RAM
NIC card etc
Samsung Spinpoint 160GB IDE

I will also need to use Timbuktu and VNC to remote into work from this machine.

Sorry, am not familiar with these programs. What kind of system overhead do they require?

Google/Froogle these components and see if it comes in under $500 (US?).

[qviri]

One thing that comes to mind is Socket 754 and a Sempron. Apparently Semprons above 2600+ undervolt very nicely, allowing for quiet operation. You might be able to fit a Socket 939 and a Venice-core Athlon64, which would also be quiet, but do the calculations, as I don't know what you want.

Since you will not be gaming, get either a board with onboard video or a $30 passively cooled low-end card.

I don't know how much RAM the statistical models will need, that's for you to decide.

For a case, Antec's SLK3000B on Amazon for $50 is agreed to be a nice one. Power supply, just pick one from the recommended list.

I hope the $500 doesn't include a monitor?

NIC card etc

I was under the impression all motherboards come with an onboard NIC these days?

[mpgalvin]

pricewise: look into onboard (gfx, sound, nic/modem) instead of addon cards. a bottom-of-market addon card won't really get you much more performance than an suitable onboard solution for a "daily driver" system.

another way to drop costs is a barebones setup, but it can require a bit of digging to get the mobo specs. lots of sff systems by that route, if that's something you'd consider.

[stupid]

Building a system for $500 or less is quite a challenge and at that price you may not necessarily get one that is quiet enough you. "Quiet" generally comes at a premium. I will use the prices at Newegg.com to give you an estimate; does not include shipping cost. Also, I assume you have a spare keyboard and mouse, or that you are able to "acquire" them at no cost.

Anyway, I would recommend the 90nm Athlon 64 3200+ S939; it produces less heat than the 130nm version. While you can build a cheaper system using a S754 Sempron, you will be locking yourself into a socket that is basically at the end of it's life. S939 will soon replace the S754 as the budget CPU, additionally S939 is the way to go if you want to upgrade to dual core in the future. But S939 is expected to be phased out by the beginning of 2008 based on articles that I've read. Price is $162.

You will want a motherboard with integrated sound and video so I would recommend the ASUS A8N-VM Socket 939 NVIDIA GeForce 6100. While it is not the absolute cheapest, Asus does enjoy a good reputation, and nVidia is well known for it chipset and graphics. Price is $72.

I am assuming you will want 2GB of RAM for statistical analysis. Gigaram 2GB (2 x 1GB) 184-Pin DDR SDRAM is a budget brand that seems to have good reviews. Price is $173.

Alternatively you can go with 1GB of RAM to save money. Patriot Signature Series 1GB (2 x 512MB) 184-Pin DDR is another budget brand that seems to have good reviews too. Price is $72.

As for a case, the Antec Solution SLK3000-B Black is a good choice. Plenty of good reviews, not inherently very quiet, but if you throw enough money at it is can be silent. This is only the case, not Power Supply is included. Price is $49, but the shipping will kill you at $19. If you can get this at Buy.com with free shipping then go for it.

Total price so far with 2GB of RAM (excluding shipping cost and tax) = $456.

Total price so far with 1GB of RAM (excluding shipping cost and tax) = $355.


Okay, the next major component you need to get is a PSU. As you can see from above, having 2GB of RAM leaves you with only $44 to spend, where as having only 1GB of RAM leaves with $145 in your budget. $44 is not much for a PSU, but if you are willing go overbudget, then I would recommend the SeaSonic S12-330 which is selling for $59. It is very quiet, has a very good reputation for stability and is more than powerful enough for this budget system. It also has an efficiency of up to 80%, which means it can save you a few bucks a year on electricity (especially if you leave the system on 24/7), but more importantly produces less internal heat; a major sticking point for a quiet PC.

Right now if you stick with 2GB of RAM, then you are over budget by $15. Not bad, but you still need a hard drive and a DVD-ROM. If you were to use only 1GB of RAM then you have $86 left in your budget.

For the hard drive I would go with the Samsung Spinpoint, they have a reputation to be the most quiet hard drives you can buy. Unfortunately at Newegg an 80GB model is not listed. You're stuck with $49 for 40GB, or $76 for the 160GB version. It would be smart to go for the 160GB because at less than 2x the price, you get 4x the capacity. You now have $10 left in your budget.

Okay the cheapest DVD-ROM drive is the BenQ DVD Black 1650V, which matches the color the case for $18. You are now $8 overbudget were to only choose 1GB of RAM.

To review, is it possible to build a PC for less than $500? Yes, if you use the cheapest component. No, if you include shipping cost and possible taxes.

Total cost including shipping for the 1GB system is $508 + $43 shipping = $551. Not too bad.

[buck1s]

Great advice. Thanks. I thought that I should do a little more work too, since you guys have put in some time. Tell me what you think of this setup. I noticed that many of the components I picked had been recommended (by stupid) as well.

CPU $162.00 Athlon 64 3200+ Venice

MB $68.00 ASRock 939Dual-SATA2 ATX AMD Motherboard

RAM $77.50 OCZ Value Series 1GB 184-Pin DDR SDRAM Unbuffered DDR 400 (PC 3200)

Case $52.52 Antec SLK3000B (nextwarehouse.com, shipped)

PSU $59.00 SeaSonic S12-330 ATX12V 330W

HD $66.50 Seagate Barracuda 7200.9 ST3808110AS 80GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive

Optical $18.00 BenQ Black 16X DVD-ROM 50X CD-ROM E-IDE/ATAPI DVD-ROM Drive Model 1650V

Graphics $46.00 eVGA 128-A8-N304-LX Geforce FX5200 128MB 64-bit DDR AGP 4X/8X Video Card

Total $549.00

Before shipping on everything but the case which includes shipping.


What would you change? I can definitely incorporate some of stupid's suggestions right off.

I looked at the motherboard suggestion Asus A8N-VM and liked the integrated graphics given I'm not a gamer. Are there any gotchas to watch out for using a micro ATX board? What do you think of the Seagate HD vs the Samsung? Larger capacity for little more money, but what about noise?


Thanks again.

[Elixer]

You're going to want to replace the stock cooler that comes with the cpu. Look at the recommended section, especially at the arctic cooling hsfs. I think you should look around for motherboards a little more, try and find something with integrated video. The only real disadvantage of going for micro atx is less pci/pci-e slots if you need them in the future.

[buck1s]

I really would like to get by with passive cooling on the MB if possible. This machine will not run 24/7. More like 8 hours sporadically, here and there.

[Rusty075]

I like threads that give me an excuse to shop for parts while I'm at work.

Before I read the responses I built myself a shopping cart system at Newegg, and came in at $470, with shipping to VA it totals $513. (guessed the shipping from your IP ). You could probably get <$500 if you shopped around.

After reading the thread, it looks like we're all thinking about the same things.

Here's my list:

A64 3200 Venice: $162
Asus A8V-MX mobo (onboard video, audio, nic. Passive NB): $60
A gig of generic RAM (Rosewill, has worked well for me before): $72
Seagate 7200.9, 80gb (not the quietest, so you should suspend it for a free noise upgrade): $55
Evercase 4252 (probably the best cheap case out there): $35
Lite-ON CD burner: $20
Seasonic SS-300 PSU (plenty of power for this system, fairly quiet): $46
Arctic Cooling Silencer64 HSF: $20

Total: $470 plus shipping.

All told, it's pretty amazing what you can build for <$500 these days.

[frostedflakes]

I'd stay away from Athlon64 -- from the sounds of it you don't need the performance, and Sempron64 will cost half as much. Grab a 2600+. Also, get a motherboard with integrated ATi Xpress 200 or nVidia 6100/6150 graphics instead of the FX5200. 1GB Corsair PC3200 CAS 2.5, it's just as cheap as the off-brand stuff. Should have enough left over for a quality case, PSU, CPU heatsink, HDD, and optical.

[Thunder]

IN WIN IW-Z720T is my case recomendation 37.50 at new egg techonweb has them for cheaper though.
Thread about my findings

[/url=http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewto ... ht=#180143]link[/url]

[stupid]

A m-ATX motherboard will have fewer slots than a typical ATX MB. The ASUS A8N-VM only has 2 PCI slots, but everything is already integrated into the the MB. You don't need to attach a sound card, but there is no RJ-11 port for a telephone modem so you need to install that if you cannot take advantage of the builtin RJ-45 port for cable/DSL service.

In case you want to fill up the case with drives you can attach up to 6 PATA drives, and 2 SATA drives. More than enough for most people. Therefore, it is unlikely you will need to install a PATA or SATA controller card.

Based on what you're going to do with this rig there is no need to add in a PCI card of any kind at all. I have two PCs of my own and the only PCI card I have in both of them is a sound card. One is a gaming/workstation rig, the other is a HTPC.

Also, the integrated video chip generally uses less electricity than a discreet card. This means less heat inside the PC case so it will be easier to keep the PC cool. On top of the the GeForce 6100 is faster than the GeForce 5200. There will also be less obstructions when it comes to airflow.

The only downside to the ASUS A8N-VM, other than just 2 PCI slots, is the LAN is only 100Mbps, not 1Gbps

As for the hard drive, here is a link the compares several drives that should help you make a decision on which one to get based on heat and noise.

[jaganath]

What do you think of the Seagate HD vs the Samsung?

Rusty's right, the seeks especially on the 7200.9 are very poor noisewise and no AAM so nothing you can do about it. However, you are on a budget, so you'd probably have to expect to compromise on some components. However, still go for a Samsung if you can afford it.

I'd stay away from Athlon64 -- from the sounds of it you don't need the performance, and Sempron64 will cost half as much. Grab a 2600+.

But Semprons are socket 754 and he wants socket 939 to upgrade to dual core in the future.

[dougz]

The OP wasn't into gaming so video performance wasn't a priority.

For someone interested in playing MPEG [1,2,4], Real Media, and WMV, would on-board or low-end add-on video be adequate? If not, what would be sufficient?

In other words, does the performance of the video card make a big difference? (In a review cited in another thread, the AOpen Mini PC's 915G appeared to be a significant video playback bottleneck compared to the Mac Mini.)

http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewtopic.php?t=27148
http://www.sfftech.com/showdocs.cfm?aid=714

[jackylman]

Here's how I would build it.

Venice 3000 - $130 shipped zipzoomfly
S12-330 - $59 Newegg
Antec 3000B - $52 shipped nextwarehouse.com
1 GB RAM - ~$70
Biostar T6100 mobo - $75 shipped zipzoomfly
CD-ROM whatever - ~$20 shipped zzf or a CDRW for a few $ more
Zalman 7000AlCu CPU heatsink- $30 shipped zzf
SpinPoint P80 80GB - $70 shipped zzf
-------
~$500 (check my math) with many items already shipped. Add Nexus or Yate Loon fans if needed

You get a modern, powerful setup where the hard disk will be your loudest component (unless you choose a notebook HD).The S12-330 has dual 12V rails and should be quieter than 80mm PSU's.

For the hard disk, how much storage space do you need?

[derekva]

Ignoring the other parts for now (although a Seasonic S12-330 PSU is hard to beat), I'd argue that the best bang-for-the-buck is the AMD Opteron 144 (1.8GHz, 1MB L2 Cache) and the ASRock 939DUAL-SATA2 AGP/PCIe combination. The board is ~ $65.00 and the processor is $159.00 (from mWave). Here's a system quote I made for a co-worker:

MB ASRock 939DUAL-SATA2 $65.00
CPU AMD Opteron 144 / 939 $159.00
RAM Corsair 1GB PC3200 $79.00
Video Sapphire Radeon x700 $94.00
HDD Seagate 160GB SATA $73.00
DVD LITE-ON DVD-ROM $20.00
Audio Onboard 7.1 audio $0.00
NIC Onboard 10/100 NIC $0.00
Case Antec SLK3000B $55.00
PSU Seasonic S12-330 $55.00

This puts you $100.00 over, but would be a good system that would last you for a few years. You could get a cheaper video card (such as a Radeon 9600PRO for $70.00) or a cheaper case, but that wouldn't get you that much.

-Derek

[Aris]

ok. let me take a crack at this. i'll tackle this from another point of view from the standard crowd.

you want complete passive cooling for ultimate silence?
here you go:

MB/CPU: VIA EPIA SP8000 $210 (cpu is passivly cooled)
Case/PSU: Casetronic C138 w/ 90w PSU $153
(you can run this system without the case fan, and the external psu is passive. The case is a small 8x8x4" enclosure)
RAM: 1gb Rosewill ddr400 $75
DVD: Quanta Slimline CDRW/DVD $70
HD: Samsung 2.5" 40gb SATA $86

Total: $594 + shipping

its a bit above what you want to pay, but i think this is the cheepest your gunna get and get completely passive (total silence).

i started by trying to evaluate what you wanted. somthing as fast as your work computer, and somthing completely silent, preferably all passive.

it has 1 pci expansion slot if ever you wanted to add somthin it doesnt have, like mabey wifi.

just wanted to give you a look from a different perspective instead of the same old same old like most people will give you.

[Erssa]

Here's how I would build it.

Venice 3000 - $130 shipped zipzoomfly
S12-330 - $59 Newegg
Antec 3000B - $52 shipped nextwarehouse.com
1 GB RAM - ~$70
Biostar T6100 mobo - $75 shipped zipzoomfly
CD-ROM whatever - ~$20 shipped zzf or a CDRW for a few $ more
Zalman 7000AlCu CPU heatsink- $30 shipped zzf
SpinPoint P80 80GB - $70 shipped zzf
-------
~$500 (check my math) with many items already shipped. Add Nexus or Yate Loon fans if needed

I like this build the best so far, but since these forums are focused on silencing I'd skip the 3000B and go for P150. It's only 30$ more then 3000b and that s12 combined. It would be a bit quieter.

Nobody has suggested it yet, but a VERY viable budget solution is Intel celeron D

Mobo: Gigabyte GA-8I945GMF Socket T (LGA 775) Intel 945G, vga, 1gb lan, HD audio, sata2, firewire, all passiveREADY FOR DUAL CORE 99$
Cpu: Intel Celeron D 336 (2.8ghz) 90$ + Zalman 7000AlCu CPU heatsink $30
Memory: BUFFALO 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 533 (PC2 4200) Unbuffered Dual Channel Kit System 110$ (ddr2 is so cheap nowadays.)
Optical: BenQ Beige E-IDE/ATAPI DVD-ROM Drive Model 1650V - Retail 17.99$
HD: Seagate Barracuda 7200.9 80GB IDE Ultra ATA100 - OEM 53.50$
Case: Antec Performance One P150 139$

Total 541$ + shipping

With your requirements intel based system really whips amd . Lets face it: cpu, mobo and 2gb memory for less then 300$. Try doing that with s939 system. I overdid the budget with 41$, but this is also the cheapest 2gb system so far.

Possible savings:
- 15$ by getting 2.53 celeron instead of 2.8
- 30$ by buying 3000b + s12 330w
- 55$ if you decide 1gb of ram is enough.
- 10$ by getting a bit cheaper cooler or 30$ if you just go with the stock cooler and use speedfan to control the rpm of the stock fan

That way you could get the the total price down to even 410$ + shipping. All these prices are from newegg, you could probably save some $, if you look for cheaper products from other places...

I hope you liked my suggestion. After all it is the best so far.

[Elixer]

Bah! Celorons are no where near matching the semprons. Definitely look at the Socket 754 semprons. Here's my choice:

Socket 754 MB + Sempron processor $100-150 (Get MB with onboard video)
1 GB Ram $75
Samsung hard drive $60-100
Antec 3000B Case $50
Seasonic S12 330W $50
CD/DVD drive something $20-50
Arctic Cooling HSF $15-20

You could probably push this system under $400 with a little shopping. As you said you aren't looking to game. This system will be very quiet and easy to keep cool. Personally I would wouldn't worry about dual core right now. If you decide you want to go for a dual core in two years you'd still want to get a new motherboard even if you had a S939 one due to the new processors, sockets etc in the future.

btw- Erssa the 3000B costs $45 shipped from amazon (well it used to). The P150 ships for ~$150. That's why the 3000B is a good choice in this case; it is an excellent case for its price.

[theyangster]

if you're going for a seasonic, try refurbs
google it, the link from seasonic doesn't work

but members have successfully bought tornados
mshan bought one
http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewto ... efurbished
about 35 shipped shave 15-25 off

that's all I can add

[Beyonder]

Bah! Celorons are no where near matching the semprons.

While this used to be the case, it's no longer true:

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/di ... on_10.html

The Celeron D has really bridged the gap by incorporating a larger L2 cache and 533 mhz frontside bus. That being said, I would still get the Sempron 2400+ because it's the cheapest processor and probably has better thermal characteristics than the Celeron, which is based around the prescott core.

[CA_Steve]

If you are using a Mac at work and want to use Timbuktu, etc...

Why not just get a Mac Mini and call it a day? $500 for the lower grade and then add more RAM...call it $600. It will be faster than your work machine, quiet, use the same s/w, and no need to assemble anything.

I'd expect a bump in speed, a drop in price, and/or the Intel platform announcements for it this week at MacWorld Expo.

[Erssa]

Bah! Celorons are no where near matching the semprons. Definitely look at the Socket 754 semprons. Here's my choice:

Socket 754 MB + Sempron processor $100-150 (Get MB with onboard video)
1 GB Ram $75
Samsung hard drive $60-100
Antec 3000B Case $50
Seasonic S12 330W $50
CD/DVD drive something $20-50
Arctic Cooling HSF $15-20

You could probably push this system under $400 with a little shopping. As you said you aren't looking to game. This system will be very quiet and easy to keep cool. Personally I would wouldn't worry about dual core right now. If you decide you want to go for a dual core in two years you'd still want to get a new motherboard even if you had a S939 one due to the new processors, sockets etc in the future.

btw- Erssa the 3000B costs $45 shipped from amazon (well it used to). The P150 ships for ~$150. That's why the 3000B is a good choice in this case; it is an excellent case for its price.

First of all you need to go check www.xbitlabs.com and www.anandtech.com to get your facts straigth about Celeron D performance. It hold ups just fine compared to semprons. So claiming they are "nowhere near match" is an unnecessary over exaggeration, for example Celeron D wins sempron in every encoding benchmark. Price wise there ain't much difference, except that ddr2 is much cheaper then ddr. Especially for the 2x1gb kits. Sure sempron makes for great budget rig, but not good enough to give up the possibility of simple processor switch for dual core upgrade. In 2 year AMDs upcoming socket AM2 is still going to be high end stuff, just like s939 still is after 1,5 years after its release. Who knows, maybe Intel will have the better processor in 2 years. But I do know that getting 2gb ddr2 memory today for 110$ is an good investment, no matter wich processor you choose or upgrade the motherboard in the future or not. Windows Vista is just around the corner and I would expect that it will like the extra memory. Sure after 2 years he could just get a cheap s939 motherboard and x2 3800+, but I will be more a lot more expensive then just getting a Celeron D now and going for pentium D upgrade.

Btw even if 3000b has been 45$ in amazon.com it doensn't mean it is 45$ anymore. Sure going 3000b would be a bit cheaper, but I dare say that the modular, quiet 430W NEO HE, the vinyl damped sides and HD suspension in P150 are worth the extra money. In the end it is up for the OPs preferences. Judging from the date of post he has probably bought his budget rig by now, so in the end it makes no difference.

CA_Steve: Mac mini was my first thought aswell, but even with 512mb I think it would lack in memory.

[CA_Steve]

Errsa,

Base Mac Mini has 512MB. That's why I said get the $499 version and add $100 of RAM.

[jaganath]

Who knows, maybe Intel will have the better processor in 2 years.

Surprisingly, that may very well be the case:

Conroe, which will be a dual-core CPU, is expected to be released in the 4th quarter of 2006 or the 1st quarter of 2007. Merom, Conroe and Woodcrest (the server version of this CPU), will all feature 'next generation micro-architecture', which will combine many characteristics from both Pentium M architecture (P6 architecture, low-power design, etc) and NetBurst. Conroe is expected to have a 65 W TDP, and will also have 2 or 4 MB of L2 shared cache.

Pentium D

I do know that getting 2gb ddr2 memory today for 110$ is an good investment, no matter wich processor you choose or upgrade the motherboard in the future or not.

It is, as long as your board actually accepts DDR2 memory. For many (most?) people this is not the case. It is more expensive to upgrade to a DDR2 mobo and buy 2GB of DDR2 RAM than it is to simply buy 2GB of DDR RAM for your existing mobo.

Windows Vista is just around the corner and I would expect that it will like the extra memory.

Why would anyone with an ounce of common sense purchase Windows Vista (a.ka. Big Media-Controlled Sock Puppet OS)?

The Vista Lockdown

Sure after 2 years he could just get a cheap s939 motherboard and x2 3800+, but I will be more a lot more expensive then just getting a Celeron D now and going for pentium D upgrade.

Pentium D's run a lot hotter than the X2's. This is undesirable from a silencing point of view.

the modular, quiet 430W NEO HE, the vinyl damped sides and HD suspension in P150 are worth the extra money.

Yeah, IF the NeoHE works with your motherboard. That's a big if.

[Erssa]

I was under the impression that base model has 256mb, also mac mini has only 1 memoryslot. I doubt you can get 1gb memory for 100$.

[Erssa]

I do know that getting 2gb ddr2 memory today for 110$ is an good investment, no matter wich processor you choose or upgrade the motherboard in the future or not.

It is, as long as your board actually accepts DDR2 memory. For many (most?) people this is not the case. It is more expensive to upgrade to a DDR2 mobo and buy 2GB of DDR2 RAM than it is to simply buy 2GB of DDR RAM for your existing mobo.

I was referring to this case where OP is building a system from scratch. I know that DDR still has it's market.

Windows Vista is just around the corner and I would expect that it will like the extra memory.

Why would anyone with an ounce of common sense purchase Windows Vista (a.ka. Big Media-Controlled Sock Puppet OS)?

Why do peole buy Macs? There are lots of good reasons, safety being one of them. Personally I love the looks of Vista. http://www.winsupersite.com/vista/ My choise of Vista links.

Sure after 2 years he could just get a cheap s939 motherboard and x2 3800+, but I will be more a lot more expensive then just getting a Celeron D now and going for pentium D upgrade.

Pentium D's run a lot hotter than the X2's. This is undesirable from a silencing point of view.

Undesirable, but hardly nothing that couldn't be handled. I have x2 3800+, I have no reason to bias to Intel.

the modular, quiet 430W NEO HE, the vinyl damped sides and HD suspension in P150 are worth the extra money.

Yeah, IF the NeoHE works with your motherboard. That's a big if.

Imo it is not. Only NEO HE problems I have heard have been with asus boards. I doubt it would have any problems with my choise of Gigabyte board, even if it had, antec would replace the power supply until you get a working one (latest patch). I am sure Antec Rep can back this up...

[Beyonder]

Why would anyone with an ounce of common sense purchase Windows Vista (a.ka. Big Media-Controlled Sock Puppet OS)?

At the risk of hijacking the thread (if we're going to continue this, I suggest a new thread in the OT section--this is, after all, about a sub-$500 PC, not the pluses and minuses of a very contriversial OS manufacturer), I don't agree with this at all. I think this is a really popular sentiment about MSFT to have, and I really don't think they're nearly as bad of a company as some people seem to insinuate.

I'll run Vista (and develop for it) when it arrives, given that the rest of the working world will also be making the transition. Also, I've been working with it and it's actually really, really nice--seriously, give it a chance before shooting it down. That being said, I also run a linux box. I like both of them.

[derekva]

Who knows, maybe Intel will have the better processor in 2 years.

Surprisingly, that may very well be the case:

Conroe, which will be a dual-core CPU, is expected to be released in the 4th quarter of 2006 or the 1st quarter of 2007. Merom, Conroe and Woodcrest (the server version of this CPU), will all feature 'next generation micro-architecture', which will combine many characteristics from both Pentium M architecture (P6 architecture, low-power design, etc) and NetBurst. Conroe is expected to have a 65 W TDP, and will also have 2 or 4 MB of L2 shared cache.

Pentium D

Unfortunately, until Intel pulls its head out and does a better job of memory management (e.g. putting the memory controller on die a la AMD), they aren't going to be as competitive. Keep in mind that the AMD processors that are competing against the latest and greatest Intel processors are the previous generation of processors. Who knows what will happen with the AM2 processors on 65nm?

I realize this conversation is strictly around desktop processors, but in the multi-processor server world (e.g. 4-way and greater), Intel is having its ass handed to it by AMD (to the point where Dell may be considering offering an AMD-based server!).

Lord knows I've been a die-hard Intel user for the past 15 years or so (my first system was an i386-25DX), but I've finally jumped ship to AMD. It is just no contest. Can Intel recover? Probably. Will they still dominate as they have over the last 20 years? Most likely not.

However, after going back and re-reading what buck1s is asking for in a system (silent but not super-speedy), I'm changing my original suggestion a few posts back from AMD to a VIA mini-ITX system (e.g. an Eden 13000). You can go to http://www.mini-itx.com for lots of juicy information on this form factor.

-Derek

[jaganath]

I'm changing my original suggestion a few posts back from AMD to a VIA mini-ITX system (e.g. an Eden 13000).

I am probably being overly picky here, but there is no Eden 13000. There is the SP13000, which has a C3 CPU, and the SP8000E (E for Eden), which has an Eden CPU. Also, the SP13000 has a (probably noisy) CPU fan, while the SP8000E does not. The problem with the VIA boards is that they tend to be expensive (here in the UK), slow and lack upgradeability. I reckon it wouldn't be too hard to build an AMD system which would outperform even the best VIA offering with equivalent dB levels.