How to silent my P-III 800MHz ?

raphaelmsx · Post by **raphaelmsx** » Mon Jun 12, 2006 10:20 am

Hi, this is my first message on this forum.

I have this system:

CASETEK CK-151 CASE
ASUS CUV4X MOTHERBOARD
INTEL PENTIUM III 800MHZ CPU
03 512MB PC-133 RAM
SEAGATE ST3120022A 120GB IDE HD
SAMSUNG DVD-RW
DIAMOND STEALTH 2500 PCI VIDEO CARD
02 VOODOO2 SLI PCI 3D VIDEO CARDS
REALTEK 8139 PCI
SOUNDBLASTER AWE-32 ISA

I am planing to do a fanless upgrade to this system and the HD will be on a Nexus Driveaway enclosure to silent and cool down.

Can I use a fanless PSU and fanless CPU cooler without using any case fans?

If so, I was thinking of using the Thermaltake SonicTower CL-P0071 CPU cooler and some fanless PSU like the Antec Phantom 350.

In the product page of SonicTower, the specs donÂ´t list application for socket 370, but itÂ´s compatible with 462/a, so should fit in 370.

So, can it be done without a case fan?

Thanks!

cAPSLOCK · Post by **cAPSLOCK** » Tue Jun 13, 2006 2:25 am

Welcome to SPCR

A sonic tower sounds like a bit of overkill to me, why not try removing the fan on the stock heatsink first? Same for a PSU, just remove the fan. Having some (even minimal) airflow will be much more effective than none, and with a good fan, it won't add much noise (probably less than the noise floor). Have a quick look at my system (scroll down to the bottom), which is slower but, I think you could apply the same principles. At least you have a fighting chance of making a really quiet pc since you have a decent harddrive!

raphaelmsx · Post by **raphaelmsx** » Tue Jun 13, 2006 6:49 am

Hi!

The computer is located 90cm (about 3ft) from my bed, thatÂ´s why I tought of using the sonic tower, even if itÂ´s overkill.

If I had the money, I changed the HD for a Flash Drive...

If you think I really need airflow inside the case, I can add a Papst 8412NGLLE fan, wich is really quiet at 9dB.

So, what do you think?

cAPSLOCK wrote:Welcome to SPCR

A sonic tower sounds like a bit of overkill to me, why not try removing the fan on the stock heatsink first? Same for a PSU, just remove the fan. Having some (even minimal) airflow will be much more effective than none, and with a good fan, it won't add much noise (probably less than the noise floor). Have a quick look at my system (scroll down to the bottom), which is slower but, I think you could apply the same principles. At least you have a fighting chance of making a really quiet pc since you have a decent harddrive!

IsaacKuo · Post by **IsaacKuo** » Tue Jun 13, 2006 7:45 am

I've silenced a number of Pentium III systems, and have had good success with stock heatsinks. However, it's one of those things where you get better at it with experience. Since you're new to quiet computing and this seems to be your "primary" system, it should be okay to splurge on quality hardware.

I don't know for sure whether the Sonic Tower can be used on a Socket 370 CPU. Even if it can, you need to make sure it will physically fit on your motherboard in your computer case. With large tower heatsinks, you always need to check beforehand whether it will physically fit.

As for going completely fanless--that's not a good idea. I've run a PIII550 system fanlessly for a while (components out in open air), but that wasn't my primary system. I didn't care whether I damaged the components.

The most straightforward thing for you to do is to use a quiet fanned PSU like SPCR's favored Seasonics. Without any modifications, the PSU will pull all the hot air out of the case, and will automatically ramp up the fan if things get too hot. This normally isn't the absolute best thing from a silencing perspective, but it's good for reliability and your older cooler PIII processor won't put out so much heat that the PSU fan will ramp up too badly.

Use a fanned PSU, and you don't need a case fan. Use a fanless PSU, and you do need a case fan. The former is less expensive and more straightforward to execute reliably.

Engine · Post by **Engine** » Tue Jun 13, 2006 8:59 am

raphaelmsx wrote:Can I use a fanless PSU and fanless CPU cooler without using any case fans?

Short answer: for your system, no.

Slightly longer answer: yeah, maybe. With the right combination of components, you could theoretically have a completely passively-cooled P3-800 system, but I can't think of a combination of components that would do so without drastically shortening the lifespan of your components, and costing more than the system is worth.

raphaelmsx wrote:If so, I was thinking of using the Thermaltake SonicTower CL-P0071 CPU cooler and some fanless PSU like the Antec Phantom 350.

I don't think the SonicTower will mount to the P3 without serious modification, or more specifically, modification to the mounting hardware itself [not, I mean to say, to the SonicTower]. But, you could always ask them and find out.

If you do get a "fanless" power supply, I'd recommend getting one that has a fan, which only turns on when necessary [and has a high turn-on point]. I have a dual P3-1ghz I use for watching video, and its power supply blows out hot air like crazy when the processors are under load, even if only one of them is loaded.

Personally, I'd get a Zalman CNPS3100+ for your CPU, a Nexus 120mm fan to replace the [pretty decent but perhaps not up to your standards] Zalman fan-on-a-bracket, and a reasonably quiet power supply of your choice, like the Seasonic S12-330. [Nexus makes a Socket 370 cooler, too, but I've never heard it, so I can't recommend it.]

With that setup, depending on your case - I'm not familiar with yours - you might be able to get away with no case fans other than the Seasonic's PSU fan, but I'd watch your temps closely for a while to get a sense of how hot you're running at load. I don't know how much heat your various video cards pump out, but that'll be something to watch for, as well.

I'm always conservative with heat, because my machines need to last a while, and perform without error or data loss. If this machine is more-or-less disposable, and the data on it likewise, you can probably get away with being less conservative. I'd start conservative, and prune away fans as you go, until you've reached your ideal heat/volume balance. Or just plug it all in and see if it melts; that works, too.

Or water-cool it, of course. You have many options on the silent front.

raphaelmsx · Post by **raphaelmsx** » Wed Jun 14, 2006 3:03 am

Thanks all you guys for the anwsers, they are very informative!

This is really my primary system, I donÂ´t want to melt it down, so I will follow your tips.

One last think, is there a document anywhere showing all recommended temperatures using various components?

And how to measure the temp inside the case?

Engine · Post by **Engine** » Wed Jun 14, 2006 9:17 am

raphaelmsx wrote:This is really my primary system, I donÂ´t want to melt it down, so I will follow your tips.

Good plan! It's always nice to have a machine you can muck with, trying out new stuff, without worrying about what horrible stuff happens to it - processor failure, drive crash, installation of Linux* - but for your primary machine, particularly one where parts are going to be a little tougher to find, it's usually a good idea to play it safe, check your temps, then push a little further.

raphaelmsx wrote:One last think, is there a document anywhere showing all recommended temperatures using various components?

Not that I know of. I always just look stuff up component-by-component, using google or the manufacturer's website. If you find one, let me know!

raphaelmsx wrote:And how to measure the temp inside the case?

I haven't used the ASUS CUV4X, but I suspect that if you install SpeedFan, you'll be able to read the temps of your case interior, processor, and hard disk [provided the Seagate you have has SMART and the mobo supports it, which I strongly suspect it does]. You almost certainly /won't/ be able to control fan speeds with it, but it's a nice temperature monitor, anyway.

*It was a joke, Isaac! A joke!

Chris Chan · Post by **Chris Chan** » Wed Jun 14, 2006 10:44 am

Oh, and don't use a Nexus Driveaway. It doesn't cool well from posts on the forum. The Seagate you have should be sufficiently quiet to use no drive enclosure. Or, if you can afford it, get a Grow Up Japan Smart Drive 2002 enclosure.

tonyb · Post by **tonyb** » Wed Jan 24, 2007 3:45 pm

I also have a PIII-800, with original Intel CPU heatsink and fan, which is by far the loudest noise source in my system and has been driving me slowly round the bend for years.

I have a few questions:

1. Could I buy a silent replacement fan that it exactly the same size as the old one and keep the old heatsink?

2. Or should I buy a larger silent fan with a fixing bracket like the Zalman CNPS6000 uses and keep the old heatsink?

3. Or should I just buy the Zalman CNPS6000 and fit the new fan and heatsink?

The less fiddling and cost the better. Thanks for any help.

IsaacKuo · Post by **IsaacKuo** » Wed Jan 24, 2007 3:52 pm

The minimum fuss solution is to use the current heat sink, but jury rig an 80mm fan undervolted to 5v to blow air at it. A fan of the same size as the original can't really be quiet at the same time as providing decent airflow.

Not that an 800mhz P3 really requires much cooling...my wife's old PIII-800 used the original heatsink with the fan simply removed, and a very crude duct to force a decent fraction of intake air toward it.

SilentKev · Post by **SilentKev** » Wed Jan 24, 2007 5:21 pm

IsaacKuo wrote:Not that an 800mhz P3 really requires much cooling...my wife's old PIII-800 used the original heatsink with the fan simply removed, and a very crude duct to force a decent fraction of intake air toward it.

similar to what I did:

- replace the PS with a quiet one or at least replace the fan in the PS you have (be sure to discharge it first!)
- remove obstructions to air intake at the case's front panel (no front fan - just a dust filter)
- 90 mm Nexus as a rear case fan with a homemade duct from the fan to an old fanless Zalmann CNPS6000-AlCu HS on the P3. The duct is in the shape of a 90 degree curve and partially surrounds the topmost portion of the HS to ensure airflow is drawn through the HS's fins.

Good luck.

Post by **NeilBlanchard** » Wed Jan 24, 2007 7:57 pm

Welcome to SPCR, Tony!

I think option #2 has the most promise.

Nick Geraedts · Post by **Nick Geraedts** » Thu Jan 25, 2007 5:39 pm

I've got a PIII 700 that's running passively cooled right now. I've upgraded the stock cooler to a CNPS3100+, which sits right next to the TriCool fan on low. It's running SETI@Home 24/7 and the temperatures never go above 40C. That's also with a passively cooled 128MB Ti4200 video card.

The biggest improvement on the noise of the system was replacing the 40GB Seagate I had in there (one of those old "whiners") with a 100GB Fujitsu notebook drive.

All of this is running in an Antec SLK2650B case with the stock PSU. These systems don't draw that much power, so the PSU fan never ramps up. I've never taken a volume meter to it, but you definitely have to hold your breath to hear it.

Fanless - don't do it. It's just not worth it. Grab yourself a Scythe S-Flex or Nexus and run them on a reduced speed (using a FanMate or the like) and you'll be fine.

Shukuteki · Post by **Shukuteki** » Thu Jan 25, 2007 7:39 pm

My PC i use at work for image editing (not heavy duty mind you) is a 933mhz PIII. Right now I have some cheap PSU and a 120mm thermaltake fan at 5v suspended over the mobo. The fan on the PSU is right over the stock heatsink, and the air from the 120mm fan flows over the heatsink and into the PSU. Works quite well.

tonyb · Post by **tonyb** » Sun Jan 28, 2007 2:49 pm

Thanks for all the replies.

I went for option 2 and bought a Zalman ZM-F1 fan with inline resistor + BR123 bracket from www.quietpc.com. The bits arrived yesterday and what an amazing difference they make! Now the din has gone, I wonder how long it will be before my quiet Seasonic PSU starts to annoy me?

Thanks again to everyone at spcr.

ronrem · Post by **ronrem** » Sun Jan 28, 2007 9:37 pm

Consider that the cost of a Sempron 2800 and basic mobo is about $100...which is the cheapest fanless PSU---I'd just go that route. Otherwise you are talking about putting a Heatsink + Psu on a system that these days goes for beer money at yard sales. The Sempy runs way cool,put a Ninja on it,have one low rpm 120 mm case fan....cheap quiet and about 4-5 times more potent than your current set up.

Cheap option....make a bracket for a 120 mm fan you can aim where needed.

Don't waste $ on the halfway plan.

aristide1 · Post by **aristide1** » Mon Jan 29, 2007 5:59 pm

Haha, I have an overclocked PIII 600 running at 800. I just couldn't stand the fan. I left the stock heatsink on the thing and used plastic tie wraps to attach an 80mm NMB fan. Its fine and still running, for now.

tonyb · Post by **tonyb** » Sat Dec 01, 2007 9:53 am

I need absolute silence now, so I'm thinking about buying a picoPSU-80 and 80W power brick for my minimal PIII-800 system.

I've measured the AC power input to the existing PSU and the highest I've seen is 75W for about a second during CD burning. Average CD burn power is about 60W. Burning is a rare event and I could load files onto the RAM drive to avoid HDD access, if necessary. Normal "do-nothing" power is 37-38W.

Is the picoPSU-80 likely to work OK?

Or would it be safer to go for a picoPSU-120 + 80W brick?

autoboy · Post by **autoboy** » Sat Dec 01, 2007 1:16 pm

I think the hardest part for newbies to understand is that fans don't always = noise. The high quality slow moving fans recommended on this site are always practically inaudible under most circumstances, and one or two big slow fans in your system, is a HUGE difference over passive cooling. For an older system like yours, the best route is to strap a quiet 80 or 92mm fan onto the stock heatsink, replace the PSU fan (or buy a new quiet psu), get a notebook harddrive (also improves performance over the older drives in older systems), and cut out the fan grills and case restrictions. This is the cheapest and easiest way to quiet computing on relic hardware.

autoboy · Post by **autoboy** » Sat Dec 01, 2007 1:19 pm

Pico PSUs are not recommended for older hardware because their +5V rails are incredibly weak. Unlike new processors that pull their power from the stronger 12V rail on the Pico, older systems pull their power from the 5V rail.

tonyb · Post by **tonyb** » Sat Dec 01, 2007 2:31 pm

autoboy wrote:Pico PSUs are not recommended for older hardware because their +5V rails are incredibly weak. Unlike new processors that pull their power from the stronger 12V rail on the Pico, older systems pull their power from the 5V rail.

The manufacturer says the picoPSU can power P3 processors:
http://www.mini-box.com/s.nl/it.A/id.41 ... ategory=13

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