Yonah (Dual Dothan) worth waiting for?

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Well, Dothan or Yonah?

DOTHAN! Being single is still fast!!
4
24%
YONAH! Double-D's always good!!!
13
76%
 
Total votes: 17

MikeMcLarenF1
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Yonah (Dual Dothan) worth waiting for?

Post by MikeMcLarenF1 » Fri Oct 28, 2005 9:08 pm

So far Intel tells us that the awaiting dual-core Yonah chip will be based on the current Pentium-M lineup, the Dothan. Supposively this will help achieve higher performance in a category that happen's to be the Dothan's achilles heel: Multimedia applications.

I still don't know what socket the chip will sit on, but I just don't like the idea of the 775 since it just seems like a bad design. The current socket 478 low-profile socket seems like the perfect size for mobile use. The LGA775 just seems too....... bulky. But nevertheless, if it has to come out for 775, so be it.

Does anyone think Intel would ruin it though? Like when Intel introduced the Northwood replacement, the Prescott? Are they going to make changes that will upset the community? Is it worth putting off the single-cored mobile giant for? I have a brand new 750 sitting in its box, waiting for a motherboard to sit on, but now that the Yonahs are coming closer and closer I don't know what I should be using instead.

Stick with the Dothan? Or wait for the Dual?

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Post by frostedflakes » Fri Oct 28, 2005 9:22 pm

I doubt Intel will screw Yonah up, isn't it just two Dothans shrunk to 65nm and stuck together? I don't think there are really any achitectural changes. Maybe a few small tweaks, but nothing major.

Prescott's problem was it's very long pipeline. IIRC it had like 31-stages, compared to 21 for Northwood. This was necessary to increase frequency, but is less efficient than a shorter pipeline. I'm sure to keep Yonah power friendly they will stick with a shorter pipeline, as this seems to be the more efficient design. Keep in mind they aren't going for pure GHz w/Pentium-M, whereas this was the goal for Pentium 4 (they had mentioned early in it's life that it was supposed to scale to 10GHz or something crazy like that).

So yeah, I'd definitely wait for dual core Dothan. Also I think I've read that they're staying with S479.

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Post by MikeMcLarenF1 » Sun Oct 30, 2005 7:34 pm

Actually, I just looked up, yeah, it seems like Yonah still sits onthe original socket, and still seems like low-power consumption. I find interesting that the two cores is on the same die, shares the same bus and L2 cache. This is good, as this is not REALLY a two-core cpu, it's just a more perfect Dothan for multitasking! WOW! I love that. I guess single core dothan for now, and upgrade next year.

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Post by Mats » Mon Oct 31, 2005 12:22 am

AFAIK, Yonah will not work with current PM systems. Not surprising to me, it got higher bus speed for instance.

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Post by MikeMcLarenF1 » Mon Oct 31, 2005 2:29 am

Yeah, noticed, 667fsb.... Mind you, I was planning to swap the whole set of board / cpu / ram at that time anyway. The Dothan should keep me entertained till then.

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Post by Mats » Mon Oct 31, 2005 2:52 am

If I had a Dothan I would certainly wait for Conroe/Merom to show up. Right now it seems like Yonah will be quite shortlived, showing up january 1 2006 and getting replaced by Merom in Q3. I don't get it.
Yonah is supposed to bring new chipsets that will work with Merom too.

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Post by MikeMcLarenF1 » Mon Oct 31, 2005 3:58 am

whats going to be the difference though? The way the 2 cores work together?

The last thing I want them to do is to keep pushing the FSB upwards, consuming more and more power. I thought 533FSB was a good place to cut off for Dothan, and I didn't expect the Yonah to up it that much. Now that it is, I will just say that I don't want to see 800FSB Dothan-descendents.

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Post by Mats » Mon Oct 31, 2005 4:14 am

MikeMcLarenF1 wrote:whats going to be the difference though?
Just wait and see. If you don't like the new Merom you can still buy a Yonah. Aren't you satisfied with your Dothan?

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Post by perplex » Mon Oct 31, 2005 5:34 am

i think Yonah will be excellent. but i'm waiting for Intel's line-up around the time Merom is released :]

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Post by MikeMcLarenF1 » Mon Oct 31, 2005 1:22 pm

The Dothan is great, but its flawed when it comes to processing multimedia, like video encoding and mp3 encoding. The dothan is SCARILY superb in terms of overclocking and gaming capabilities, but unfortunately I do multimedia AS MUCH as I do gaming, therefore I wanted also a Yonah, to kind of fill up the media gap that the Dothan has right now.

I guess waiting for the Merom could serve 2 purposes, one is to see if it's good, and the second is to drop the Yonah's price. I guess I'm gonna be using the dothan for another while then!

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Post by |Romeo| » Mon Oct 31, 2005 3:06 pm

It seems to me that what's needed to go with Dothan is actually a media coprocessor, which it seems to me could be far more efficient than Netburst at doing media tasks. I've often wondered about such a device (in the form of a 3GIO card I would think) but don't know if any with such a broad remit actually exist.

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Post by MikeMcLarenF1 » Mon Oct 31, 2005 3:15 pm

at such a great cost to Intel, I think they'd rather do something simple like increase the overall processing speed of a processor, and realease it as a new chip to sell for more money. I kind of think Intel is like Windows. Every revision requires new components to go with it and it's always just as expensive and we are expected to pay for that. AMD on the other hand is like Linux. We don't pay much for the supporting hardware. We do that only when we hit huge earthshaking changes to the processor.

With every chip revision Intel demands new northbridge standards. AMD uses the same stuff for alot of their cores and THEN switches to the next things.

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Post by pony-tail » Thu Nov 03, 2005 7:22 pm

Too late !
I have already changed over to an athlon X2 3800+
And I do not see myself going back to a new Intel
anytime soon - but if they do not screw it up this
time it looks to be a VERY good idea -time will tell

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Post by ~El~Jefe~ » Mon Nov 07, 2005 10:15 am

you have a dothan...

the dothan with an overclock keeps up with most fx series processors for games. and, it doesnt get hot, and doesnt require a lot of wattage.

the boards cost a lot, the heat sink and fans seem to not be great for them, etc. but, if I had one, I would keep it for a year easy from now. UNLESS:

you havea 1.6 dothan. then out I would chuck it. 2.13 ghz dothan right now I feel is the best chip on the market.

2.0 dual core amd i guess is fine as well. shrugs :D

odd choice for someone who spent so much on a dothan and a board. youd think they would get a 4200?

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Post by MikeMcLarenF1 » Mon Nov 07, 2005 1:26 pm

~El~Jefe~ wrote: 2.0 dual core amd i guess is fine as well. shrugs :D

odd choice for someone who spent so much on a dothan and a board. youd think they would get a 4200?
Yeaaaa the thing is I spent a little under $300 CAD for this little 750 fella and I have setup info to turn it into a 3.3Ghz monsta. I think that beats the stock FX55, rated at more than $1.4K. I'm settling with a CT-479 I purchased from here (THANKS SPCR) and a ASUS P4P800-E-Dlx board I'm grabbing off eBay. I'm saving a hair under a thousand even w/o taking into account of the motherboard required for the FX, that is also up par with ASUS's quality. As for the X2, well, if it weren't so expensive and if I didnt get my Dothan for such a great deal, I might have concidered it.

I guess I'll wait anyways. I just realized, my P4 2.0's multimedia capability is still well... acceptable for now. And seems like the Dothan can only be better, even if it isn't good, but as long as its better than the P4 I have it will do for now.

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Post by Mats » Mon Nov 07, 2005 1:48 pm

Opteron is a better alternative than FX if you want lower cost, and easier to compare to PM.

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Post by MikeMcLarenF1 » Mon Nov 07, 2005 2:09 pm

Mats wrote:Opteron is a better alternative than FX if you want lower cost, and easier to compare to PM.
Sweet.... what's the best price comparison for that?

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Post by Mats » Tue Nov 08, 2005 12:02 am


MikeMcLarenF1
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Post by MikeMcLarenF1 » Tue Nov 08, 2005 12:11 am

what would you say the 1.86G P-M750 is comparable to?

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Post by Mats » Tue Nov 08, 2005 12:43 am

I have absolutely no idea. In games, PM is a bit faster clock for clock (at least compared to single core), and runs cooler. Opteron overclocks better and cost less, and it got the famous memory controller and is superior at scientifical calculations. It also got 64 bit extensions that I still don't care about, and it's available as dual core.

When i'm looking at a PM 750 for $241 and a Opteron 165 for $278 the choice is easy. I'd go for the Opteron just because it got so much more, and the only downside is that it runs hotter. Since it's single versus dual core they're not comparable though. PM is more like the very best of old school (Athlon XP, P3) CPU's, before they started adding technologies like hyperthreading, dual core, integrated memory controller, 64-bit, HTT. This doesn't make PM a bad processor, but it's still from a different generation.

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Post by MikeMcLarenF1 » Tue Nov 08, 2005 12:46 am

lol for me its kinda diff cuz I got my brand new 750 for a bit under $170 USD..... yea it works, I tried using it in my IBM lol. I guess I can't really compare like wholesale price vs retail price. haha

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Post by EvoFire » Tue Nov 08, 2005 11:32 pm

Dude, not being a fan boy and all, but the current chipset for the P-M isn't gonna last and you are gonna have to replace the whole lot once you upgrade. While the AMD is gonna stay on one northbridge. I think that NF4 is gonna stay for awhile considering some people are still using NF3 chipsets.

Either ways, A64 X2 on socket 939 is the best right now. Its way easier to implement than a Dothan, none of that ghettoness of a adapter. Also free to change for whatever cooler you want.

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Post by MikeMcLarenF1 » Tue Nov 08, 2005 11:35 pm

LoL, well my CT479 and the M750 is already HERE. And I basically spent $220 getting that set. That's a really good price already (I think) and I'm not about to give that up to spend an even greater amount on a X2 right now.

I know the whole set needs to be swapped, I pointed it out earlier. That just means I'm getting a 2nd computer when the Yonah comes out. Although, the comp might NOT be a Yonah. It'll depend on the c/p ratio of the market at the time. If more promising chips rival the Yonah, then, screw it! After getting the new comp, I'll pass the Dothan to my cousin or something.

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Post by EvoFire » Wed Nov 09, 2005 6:15 pm

pass it to me, lol

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Post by MikeMcLarenF1 » Wed Nov 09, 2005 9:18 pm

LoL

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Post by ~El~Jefe~ » Wed Nov 09, 2005 9:21 pm

the 750 can be overclocked up to 2.4 without heating up the house.

and when it is, it is an insane gamer chip.

Really, PM is the best chip out there, it just was crushed by intel because it didnt want to lose face with its moronic oem and system builders and corporations as it pushed p EE and the 500 series. which suck.

the 2.13 ghz Dothan I feel is the best chip made currently. it's an all arounder that doesnt use a lot of heat, yet can oc to pass fx57 in a game. on air. with less wattage.

too bad intel didnt charge so much for it. board makers might have jumped on it.

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Post by MikeMcLarenF1 » Wed Nov 09, 2005 9:25 pm

I would've really liked to see further development of this board, as this chip is so... well, good at what it's made for. The MSI 915GM FA-4 seems to be my board of choice, if I was to stick only with the Dothan. It's just that every single board out there with the exception of ASUS is expensive.

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