Seasonic PSU in P180: do I need extension kit?

PSUs: The source of DC power for all components in the PC & often a big noise source.

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9000rpm
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Seasonic PSU in P180: do I need extension kit?

Post by 9000rpm » Sat Dec 17, 2005 8:04 am

I just ordered a Seasonic S12-430 PSU and Antec P180 case and I was assured that I don't need an extension kit for the cables on the S12. The fellow told me they build systems all the time using this combo and they use the S12 because its cables ARE definately long enough. But I've read in many places here at SPCR that the S12's cables are too short. Please explain. And is there a downside to the extensions if I do need them?

Thanks.

wundi
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Post by wundi » Sat Dec 17, 2005 12:59 pm

So, are you asking whether you should believe the SPCR community or some funny sales person? What do you think the answer will be? ;)

I take it you have read the P180 review by SPCR's Devon Cooke. Still, have another look at the bottom part of page 3 of the review.

Extensions have also been discussed before, see here.

9000rpm
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Post by 9000rpm » Sun Dec 18, 2005 7:56 am

You're right. I guess I was hoping both were right, that the Seasonic's standard cables had been lengthened. Thanks for the links.

kamina
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Post by kamina » Sun Dec 18, 2005 11:14 am

I have the combo with an Asus A8V motherboard. The psu is upside down, and the cable fairly tight. It still fits.

9000rpm
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Post by 9000rpm » Sun Dec 18, 2005 6:57 pm

kamina wrote:I have the combo with an Asus A8V motherboard. The psu is upside down, and the cable fairly tight. It still fits.
Any implications to running the Seasonic upside down?

kamina
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Post by kamina » Mon Dec 19, 2005 11:29 pm

What do you mean? Atleast it's still alive :D

computergeek22
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Post by computergeek22 » Sat Dec 24, 2005 11:25 am

I have a similar problem. I have a p180 and am planning to get a seasonic s12-500. The motherboard I have chosen is an Asus A8R-MVP which has a 12v auxiliary connector at the top left like the aopen board in the antec p180 review. The Seasonic s12-500 also has the same length as the 430 in the review but the problem is I'm going to be using of the pci card for my x-fi soundcard. As mentioned in the review and from further inspection of the picture of the 12v cable routing it seems that I would not be able to fit my soundcard if I route the cable in the way that was shown in the review. I'm also planning to overclock - quite a bit. How will cable extenders influence my overclocking ability? Is there anyway of not using cable extenders to route the 12v cable to the top left w/o routing it under the graphics card. Any suggestions and help is appreciated.

*EDIT* Are there any other psus that are as quiet and have long cables so that I can safely overclock while keeping a decent quiet system.

McBanjo
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Post by McBanjo » Sat Dec 24, 2005 2:27 pm

OCZ are rather quiet it seems. According to the reviews I've read. Long cables.

XG Magnum is silent and got enought cables but you have to remove or replace the bottomfan then.
http://www.driverheaven.net/reviews/mag ... /index.htm

Personally I'm going for Tagan. 24-30dB, little louder on the min-part compered to seasonic and NeoHE but lower max and 500mm cables (minimum length) should be enought.

Antec got some models recommended on their site about the P180, I assume they have long enought cables. Would be rather stupid otherwise.

Saw in another thread that MikeC noticed a max on -0.1v (I think) with extenders but he doesn't overclock, might impact a little more if you do that

jermaink
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Post by jermaink » Sat Dec 24, 2005 7:08 pm

I'm using a Seasonic S12 600W, and a P180, and I can connect the power cables to the motherboard. I'm using a Asus A8N-SLI, and the ATX 4 pin cable is at the opposite end though the 24 pin was down the side, but I just managed to get it in (fairly tightly, and over a 7800GT).

If the 430W's cables are as long as the 500W & 600W, it should be fine. If they're any shorter than there may be a problem.

computergeek22
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Post by computergeek22 » Sun Dec 25, 2005 11:13 am

Jermaink, I understand that but I also am going to be using one pci slot for my X-Fi soundcard. How will that affect the wiring? I might just wait for the Antec Smartpower 2.0 500w as right now that seems the best bet because it will most likely perform as well as the sp-450(which is pretty quiet). In conjunction, it is also one of the "recommended" psus for the p180 on the antec site.

teknerd
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Post by teknerd » Sun Dec 25, 2005 11:36 am

i would recommend going with the smartpower II 500W. I have no problem reaching the connectors on by a8n-sli premium (and i am using one of the pci slots.
With the bottom chamber setup it also stays really quiet in my p180 (even at full load with an x2 4200+ and a 6600gt). The outer fan has yet to turn on and i cannot hear the inner fan over the nexus on my xp-120, the d12sl case fan or the vf-700 (all of which are on a zalman mfc-1 and kept near the minimum setting).
[img]http://tinyurl.com/rqlff[/img]
[size=75]Main Rig: X2-4200+ | XP-120 | A8N-SLI Premium | 2GB RAM | XFX 6600GT w/VF700 | 74GB Raptor & 320GB 3200JD | P180 | SmartPower II 500W | 2x Dell 1704FPV (Digital)
Media Center: Athlon XP-M 2500+ @ 2.2GHz | ALX800 w/92mm Panaflo | 1GB RAM | 40GB WD | SLK3000B | Modulated, Fan-Swapped 380S PSU
[/size]

computergeek22
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Post by computergeek22 » Sun Dec 25, 2005 1:44 pm

Yeah, teknerd, I guess the SP-500 is a good choice. It's cheaper too. However, on many of the Newegg reviews there have been issues with the SP-500 having "poor regulation with the 5v and the 3.3 running a bit low" (don't get me wrong I usually don't go by newegg reviews but still....) Have you noticed anything similar? I've got a little while so I'll wait for SPCR to review the SP-500 because it's in the upcoming reviews thread.

Also the SP-500 is modular. Is there a loss of performance with modular psus? Thanks for all the help, guys.

Merry Christmas BTW.

teknerd
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Post by teknerd » Sun Dec 25, 2005 1:58 pm

i've found newegg reviews to be very questionable. Those comments are likely from people using software (like mbm5) which is notoriously inaccurate at measuring voltage.
I have not had a single issue with my system and it has been running stable (running 2 instances of Folding at Home 24/7, recording tv, encoding video, and various other tasks) for the last 3 weeks straight (no restarts) with no problems.
There is a very slight loss with modular psu's because of the resistante introduced by the connection point, but it is usually un-measurable and even when measurable, neglible. You have nothing to worry about.
I actually like the convenience of them because i was able to build a custom power lead very easily that powers my opticals, fan controller and EZ-Plug (the molex on the mb) with one long chain, thereby reducing my cable clutter.
[img]http://tinyurl.com/rqlff[/img]
[size=75]Main Rig: X2-4200+ | XP-120 | A8N-SLI Premium | 2GB RAM | XFX 6600GT w/VF700 | 74GB Raptor & 320GB 3200JD | P180 | SmartPower II 500W | 2x Dell 1704FPV (Digital)
Media Center: Athlon XP-M 2500+ @ 2.2GHz | ALX800 w/92mm Panaflo | 1GB RAM | 40GB WD | SLK3000B | Modulated, Fan-Swapped 380S PSU
[/size]

computergeek22
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Post by computergeek22 » Sun Dec 25, 2005 2:25 pm

Hey teknerd, do you have any drives in the lower drive bay in the p180. If so how many and what are your temps in the lower bay. I have a single raptor 74gb HD that i'm going to put in the lower drive bay. I think it should be pretty cool and that way the fan of the SP-500 won't get a chance to ramp up that much. Yeah, the modular sounds nice considering the P180 is a PITA for cable management. 8)


BTW, any p180 front door issues yet?

teknerd
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Post by teknerd » Sun Dec 25, 2005 2:38 pm

both my raptor and my 3200jd are in the lower chamber they both run at about 35 degrees most of the time with no fan in the lower chamber.

and yah cable management can be kind of a pain, but its definatly doable. there are a number of crevices you can use to hid cables in.

as far as front door issues: i had a little bit of bulge but that was fixed by locking the door for a day or two.
[img]http://tinyurl.com/rqlff[/img]
[size=75]Main Rig: X2-4200+ | XP-120 | A8N-SLI Premium | 2GB RAM | XFX 6600GT w/VF700 | 74GB Raptor & 320GB 3200JD | P180 | SmartPower II 500W | 2x Dell 1704FPV (Digital)
Media Center: Athlon XP-M 2500+ @ 2.2GHz | ALX800 w/92mm Panaflo | 1GB RAM | 40GB WD | SLK3000B | Modulated, Fan-Swapped 380S PSU
[/size]

jermaink
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Post by jermaink » Sun Dec 25, 2005 5:51 pm

computergeek22 wrote:Jermaink, I understand that but I also am going to be using one pci slot for my X-Fi soundcard. How will that affect the wiring? I might just wait for the Antec Smartpower 2.0 500w as right now that seems the best bet because it will most likely perform as well as the sp-450(which is pretty quiet). In conjunction, it is also one of the "recommended" psus for the p180 on the antec site.
I'm using an X-Fi as well.

computergeek22
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Post by computergeek22 » Mon Dec 26, 2005 10:47 am

This may be asking a bit too much jermaink, but could you post a pic of how you did it. I might just be able to get an s12. All is not lost!!!

jermaink
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Post by jermaink » Mon Dec 26, 2005 10:46 pm

Yeah, I can take a pic. I'll be taking one of the front door I got when my retailer managed to get me a replacement from the distributer (had a 7 mm warp in the centre).

Mathelo
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Aux 12 volt cable behind mobo

Post by Mathelo » Tue Dec 27, 2005 1:51 pm

I have an OCZ PS in a P180 case with an ASUS A8N-SLI Deluxe. I suspect the cables are about the same length for this power supply.

No problem for the ATX. No excess but it works. The trick for the Aux cable is to run it behind and over the mobo. You'll need to drill a hole in the floor / divider of the case near the outside edge but it works perfectly. Only issue would be trying to remove the power supply. Would require at least loosing up the mobo.

L

jermaink
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Post by jermaink » Wed Dec 28, 2005 8:21 pm

Here're the pics of getting the 4 pin cable to an Asus A8N-SLI Premium in a P180, with a Seasonic S12 600W, over a 7800GT with an AC Silencer and an X-Fi.

http://www.freewebs.com/jermaink/IMG_4315.jpg

http://www.freewebs.com/jermaink/IMG_4314.jpg

computergeek22
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Post by computergeek22 » Wed Dec 28, 2005 8:30 pm

I'm assuming there weren't any bent ninja heatsink pins. Wow! I'm planning on getting a ninja and if ur seasonic worked I guess a 500w one should as well. Seems like a tight fit but the important part is that it fits even with the vga cooler and the x-fi. I think it should be the same kind of fit for even a vf-700 zalman vga cooler so I guess that it's do-able w/a seasonic. Thanks jermaink once again for taking the time to post pics and your advice. It's greatly appreciated. 8)

9000rpm
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Post by 9000rpm » Wed Dec 28, 2005 9:02 pm

I had my new system assembled for me. I pick it up tomorrow but it is built had they had no problem with the Seasonic in the P180. The OCZ 2GB PC3200 Platinum Edition memory, on the other hand, was defective and held me up getting my system on time.

nivek7
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Post by nivek7 » Wed Dec 28, 2005 9:57 pm

Has anyone tried the S12 500/600 with the DFI Lanparty UT Ultra-D Motherboard? Also, do you guys think that it is worth it to pay another 25CAD to upgrade from the 500 to 600?

edit: also, if I decide to use a generic 24-pin extension, will this degrade power "quality"?

Thanks

computergeek22
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Post by computergeek22 » Wed Dec 28, 2005 10:11 pm

Hey nivek I believe the dfi has the aux 12v power connector on the right mid portion of the mobo so that shouldn't be an issue. BTW the dfi has a noisy Northbridge cooler if you want a quiet machine that's going to be a hindrance. Unless you want to mod to SLI capable motherboard, the Asus A8R-MVP might be a good solution. It seems your planning to overclock and IF Asus can fix some of the little issues with this mobo (A8R) then this mobo should be a nice overclocking board. It has, however, only been released in the last few weeks so don't expect a fix so soon. BTW, the DFIs northbridge gets in the way of the gfx card so you can't replace it with a passive heatsink without some bending of a passive heatsink.

nivek7
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Post by nivek7 » Wed Dec 28, 2005 10:16 pm

Yeah, you're right, I'm planning on overclocking. I've already bought the board, so I guess I'll be using the DFI. Your help is really appreciated.

computergeek22
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Post by computergeek22 » Wed Dec 28, 2005 10:29 pm

No problem. With regard to the DFi it's an awesome o/cing board. Now that you've bought it anyway, I suggest getting one of the zalman heatsinks for the northbridge and bending them up. (Do a search on this on these forums to find a thread illustrating this.) You'll also probably need some good airflow or a fan blowing air over the heatsink because the Northbridges on NF4s run hot. Good luck w/ the overclocking! 8)

computergeek22
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Post by computergeek22 » Wed Dec 28, 2005 10:32 pm

Look on DFI Street ( search on google). They have an in-depth thread regarding Athlon 64 overclocking which is really helpful and includes a list of programs that you'll need to overclock as well.

jermaink
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Post by jermaink » Thu Dec 29, 2005 1:28 am

nivek7 wrote:Has anyone tried the S12 500/600 with the DFI Lanparty UT Ultra-D Motherboard? Also, do you guys think that it is worth it to pay another 25CAD to upgrade from the 500 to 600?

edit: also, if I decide to use a generic 24-pin extension, will this degrade power "quality"?

Thanks
I'd recommend a bit of caution about using a Seasonic S12 and a recent DFI Nforce 4 motherboard. The motherboard has been known not to work (and my Seasonic didn't work with my Ultra-D, something possibly to do with the 5.0sb line) so there's only a 50-50 chance of it working. Some people experence no problems, while others just can't boot. But if you're in the US, Seasonic will apparently replace the PSU for you (until you get one that works I guess).

Anyway, it's something you'll want to ask your retailer about before purchasing.

nivek7
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Post by nivek7 » Thu Dec 29, 2005 9:34 am

Thanks for the warning, I guess I'll see if it works when my CPU arrives. Do you know if Seasonic in Canada will replace it?

Thanks

computergeek22
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Post by computergeek22 » Thu Dec 29, 2005 5:45 pm

After seeing the pics by Jermaink(thanks once again man!) and comparing the SPCR review of the SP-450 and Seasonic, I've decided to go with the SP-500. It's not only modular but is nicer to my budget :lol: . The only way I'll probably go over or reach 200w is when doing some heavy multitasking or gaming; in both conditions I'll probably be listening to music with my headphones or have my speakers loud enough to overpower the sound of the psu when playing games. In the end price was the deciding factor, and that's the same for you, nivek in your purchase. The Seasonic is a good deal of lot more expensive than the antec mentioned but it's all about how much more or less (in my case) your willing to spend. I decided to save the 80 or so bucks from going with the sp-500 to invest in some good nexus 120 fans to replace the noisy tricools in the p180. You have to decide yourself what components will allow you to have the quietest pc. BTW, what case are you planning to use? I suppose the P180 as you are posting in this thread.

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