Strange PSU buzzing tied to HDD!?

PSUs: The source of DC power for all components in the PC & often a big noise source.

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PenDragon
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Antec PSU buzzing with hard drives???

Post by PenDragon » Sat Dec 23, 2006 9:37 am

For those of you using the original Antec SU-380 power supply- is anybody else having a problem with the power supply buzzing when you hook up a hard drive to it?

I was happy with the noise level of my system with just the motherboard and case fans hooked up. But the moment I hooked up a hard drive, the power supply started to make a consistent buzzing noise. I RMA'ed the power supply and just got a new one in, and the new one ALSO makes the same buzzing noise only when a hard drive is hooked up. I've tried three different hard drives (including a brand-new Seagate SATA laptop hard drive) and the buzzing noise remains no matter what hard drive I have hooked up. I also tried a different Antec power supply (SmartPower 2.0 350Watt) and there was no buzzing at all. Problem is, the ATX12V 4-pin cable isn't long enough to fit in the case :(.

So, is anybody else having this problem that I"m having with 2 of the same model line of power supplies? Any suggestions on a fix? I'm about to go out and buy a Seasonic, but I hate to spend the extra money, especially at this, the most happy and poor time of the year.

Thanks!
-Douglas

Felger Carbon
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Post by Felger Carbon » Sat Dec 23, 2006 11:01 am

Let me try some long-distance troubleshooting. First, are you absolutely certain the noise is coming from the PSU and not from the HDD shaking the case sheet metal? A quick check involves temporarily removing the HDD from its normal mounting and placing it on a folded scarf or some soft foam.

Second, apply some random personal damping. Put your hand on various sections of the case sheet metal, esp. near the PSU and the HDD. Does the noise level drop noticably at any one position?

Can you remove the two sides and top, and run long enough to see if the noise is still present?

Finally, while the top and sides are removed, can you lift the PSU up so that it doesn't contact the case sheet metal while running... and still making noise.

If you reach this last step, and your system is still making noise, then the PSU is almost certainly the culprit. But until you complete the last step, the possibility exists that your PSU is fine and the problem is elsewhere. Good luck, and have a Merry! :D

PenDragon
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Post by PenDragon » Sun Dec 24, 2006 10:46 am

Hi Felger,

Thanks for your suggestions. I have hooked up a different Antec PSU (the SP2.0 350 Watt), and the noise was not present, so I am absolutely certain that the noise is specific to the two SU-380 PSUs that I have tried. I know that the noise occurs specifically when hooking a hard drive up because the noise is much less present when hard drives are not hooked up. What I mean to say is that when a hard drive is hooked up to the PSU, the noise is present greater than 80% of the time, and when a hard drive is not hooked up, the noise is present maybe 5% of the time, cutting in and out.

I have tried three different hard drives (all Seagates, a 160GB SATA, A 300GB EIDE, and an 80GB 2.5" SATA), and the noise is present with 1, 2, or 3 of them hooked up in any combination, so it is not hard drive specific.

Any other suggestions or commiseration?

MikeC
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Post by MikeC » Sun Dec 24, 2006 11:31 am

Does changing the load to the PSU have any effect -- ie, if the CPU or vidcard is pushed -- or does the buzzing remain steady as long as a HDD is attached? If the latter, then there's not much you can do but another RMA, I guess. BTW, I don't recall hearing anything like this in the couple of SU380s I've tried.

jaganath
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Post by jaganath » Sun Dec 24, 2006 11:38 am

Power supply buzzing is just one of those things, there doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to it, certain configurations of components seem to cause it but the exact configuration differs from PSU to PSU. Another RMA probably won't help, just get the cheapest S12 you can find.

PenDragon
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Post by PenDragon » Tue Dec 26, 2006 6:00 pm

Thanks for your replies, Mike and Jaga.

Mike, the buzzing noise is pretty consistent regardless of load. The computer is idle right now and I hear the sound. But if you twisted my arm, I'd venture to say that is probably a bit more consistent during load (for example- without a hard drive hooked up, upon initial power-up, the noise occurs and then dissipates).

Considering how annoying the noise is to me, I've decided to take your advice jaga, and I ordered a Seasonic S12 380 today (not the cheapest, but after reading the review of the 330 here, I figured I'd go for the supposedly quieter model). Waiting another few weeks for another Antec RMA may be cheaper, but it also may ultimately be fruitless, and I'd like to save my sanity, since the machine is in the living room after all.

I guess I can't complain too much, since it may very well be the nicest HTPC case you can buy for under $100, even without a PSU. But if not for that noise, I would have found it quiet enough and saved the $67.

-Douglas

Tigerwoodkhorns
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Post by Tigerwoodkhorns » Tue Jan 02, 2007 11:09 pm

I just put my computer together using this case and I am havinf two different problems.

1) I am having the buzzing sound from the power supply as described above. FWIW, I measured my outlet at 122.6 volts.

2) My motherboard, an ECS P4M800-M7 is lisyed as a Socket 775. I bought a Zalman CNPS7700-ALCU and it is way too big for the case. My motherboard looks like the one in teh article. Can I use the Zalman 7000 ALCU? The Intel fan is way too noisey.

Thanks,

Chris

Tigerwoodkhorns
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Post by Tigerwoodkhorns » Wed Jan 03, 2007 9:54 am

MikeC wrote:Does changing the load to the PSU have any effect -- ie, if the CPU or vidcard is pushed -- or does the buzzing remain steady as long as a HDD is attached? If the latter, then there's not much you can do but another RMA, I guess. BTW, I don't recall hearing anything like this in the couple of SU380s I've tried.
Mike,

My power supply's buzzing stops when I put a load on it. It does not seem to take much os a load to make it go away. What can I do to fix it?

Also, will the Zalman CNSP7000-ALCu work with my Socket 775 motherboard (Elitegroup P4M800-M7). Or is there another CPU cooler that you can recommned? Mine is really noisey.

Thanks,

Chris

PenDragon
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buzzing noise continues

Post by PenDragon » Wed Jan 03, 2007 9:13 pm

OK, I got the Seasonic in, hooked it up to my computer, and it's making the EXACT SAME BUZZING NOISE that the two Antec's made! AARRGGHHH!!! At this point, I'm completely lost.

I've had plenty of time to get specific with my troubleshooting now, and here's the deal. The buzzing noise is emitted very briefly on startup every time. Beyond that, the buzzing noise seems to be exactly consistent with hard drive activity.

I know, I know, you're thinking "hey dummy, it's your hard drive", but it's not. I promise. The noise is definitely coming from the power supply- I have no doubt in my mind. Plus, the noise is consistent no matter what combination of three different hard drives I have hooked up. The hard drive is not making the noise, but the noise appears to be occuring within the power supply due to hard drive activity.

I have tried killing the LED's, thinking they were buzzing (especially since the noise occured every time the HDD access LED lit up)- no dice.

I have tried with a barebones configuration of just motherboard, CPU, memory and 1 HDD, and no fans- no dice.

I tried a different power cord plugged into a different outlet, thinking about interference- no dice.

I then started pulling power plugs to everything, one at a time, since the buzzing noise does occur briefly on start-up. The initial buzzing didn't occur when I pulled the ATX12V (4-pin) cord, but then the system won't boot up either, so that doesn't help...

I've got an Abit NF-M2 Nview mobo, 1GB DDR2-800 OCZ Platinum memory, an Athlon 3500+ AM2 processor, and those are the only parts that are consistent here. I'm starting to look at the motherboard as a possible culprit, but why would the motherboard cause the PSU to buzz during HDD access?!?!?

Any other suggestions would be MUCH APPRECIATED, and sorry for the long post. I'm at the end of my rope here- my computer is absolutely unacceptable with the buzzing as it drives me crazy, but I can't even begin to afford scrapping it and starting over with different parts...

Mods- if you feel like you need to move the post at this point, I understand, but if you could PM me with where it was moved to, I'd appreciate it.

MikeC
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Post by MikeC » Wed Jan 03, 2007 11:03 pm

So then the obvious question is whether there is buzzing w/o a HDD? In other words, boot up with no HDD connected.

Also, do you have any other system you can try running any of these PSUs and HDDs on?

And do you have any HDD other than Seagate that you can try? I recall the Seagate Barracuda IV -- the original "silent" HDD -- causing buzzing problems with some PSUs. This is going back 4-5 years.

jaganath
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Post by jaganath » Thu Jan 04, 2007 3:53 am

OK, I got the Seasonic in, hooked it up to my computer, and it's making the EXACT SAME BUZZING NOISE that the two Antec's made! AARRGGHHH!!!
D'oh, I'm sorry, I didn't see that one coming at all. :cry:

If worst comes to worst, we can open up the PSU and cover the offending coil(s) with hot glue, but that is a last resort.

PenDragon
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Post by PenDragon » Fri Jan 05, 2007 10:24 am

Without the hard drive(s) plugged in, the PSU makes the same buzzing noise for less than a second on first boot-up, but then does not make the noise at all, indefinitely. With the hard drive(s) plugged in, the PSU makes the buzzing noise right at initial boot up again, then stays silent until Windows starts loading, and then the the PSU starts buzzing again. So, to answer your question Mike, it makes the buzzing w/o the hard drive hooked up just on initial power up, but otherwise not at all.

I have tested two of the three hard drives on other systems, and not had any buzzing problems. I will try hooking up one of the power supplies to another computer tonight and see if I still get the buzzing.

The problem with hooking up a non-Seagate hard drive to the offending computer is that the buzzing won't start until Windows loads, which won't happen, since I don't have a non-Seagate with this computer's image, and I don't want to re-image a deployed hard drive. However, I will hook up one of the buzzing power supplies in two other computers- one with a Seagate hard drive and one with a WD hard drive, and see if there is a difference.

Mike and jaga- I had one other thought with the Seasonic. The review of the NSK-2400 states that the PSU is quite possibly Seasonic-sourced. Maybe that's why both the SU-380 and S12-380 are having the same problem? Maybe they have the same offending parts in them???

-Douglas

vg30et
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Post by vg30et » Fri Jan 05, 2007 5:06 pm

I had a similar buzzing issue with my seasonic s12-380w and went through 3 RMA's before it was resolved. What finally did the trick was a S12-430W.

PenDragon
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Testing results

Post by PenDragon » Sun Jan 07, 2007 12:04 pm

Since my Antec SU380 was just sitting on the floor after the Seasonic installation, I decided to use that for testing. I hooked it up in two computers.

Computer 1: Socket A system, 20-pin power, no ATX12v. Seagate HDD.
Result- no buzzing

Computer 2: Socket 939 system, 24-pin power, ATX12v, Seagate and WD HDD.
Result- no buzzing

So, one of the power suppplies that is buzzing in my media center PC does not buzz in two other PCs.

Please note that the problem is not the outlet, because I still get the buzzing from my media center even in a different room. However, obviously SOMETHING with my Media Center PC is causing this buzzing... And I have run it bare-bones (PSU, motherboard, CPU, 1 stick of RAM, 1 HDD, no fans)

thoughts?

jaganath
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Post by jaganath » Sun Jan 07, 2007 1:16 pm

I have run it bare-bones (PSU, motherboard, CPU, 1 stick of RAM, 1 HDD, no fans)
These new results point to the motherboard being the culprit, don't they? RAM cannot cause buzzing, CPU can but this would be from VRM coils not PSU, and you have tested the HDD in another PC with no buzzing?

PenDragon
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Post by PenDragon » Sun Jan 07, 2007 6:10 pm

These new results point to the motherboard being the culprit, don't they? RAM cannot cause buzzing, CPU can but this would be from VRM coils not PSU, and you have tested the HDD in another PC with no buzzing?[/quote]

Yes, I have tested one of the hard drives in another PC with no buzzing.
I tend to agree that the most likely culprit at this point is the motherboard, since I'm not getting the buzz in other computers.

Unfortunately, this is a production Media Center PC, and a motherboard return would call for up to a few weeks of downtime (just suggesting the possibility to my wife- who loves her "tivo"- made her tense up. But, like I said, I do tend to agree with you because the motherboard is the only logical choice.

I guess the question at this point is- is my exact motherboard sample the culprit, or is this a problem with the entire Abit NF-M2 Nview line? I guess I'll call Abit and see what they think. It may take awhile to get their tech support to make the connection between a PSU buzzing during HDD access and a bad mobo though :) Maybe I won't mention that HDD access part...

Anyway, I think a few weeks of downtime is certainly worth my sanity, so I'll let you guys know what I come up with.

If anybody else has any other thoughts before I take down my production machine, I'm all ears.

Thanks!
Douglas

john103
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Post by john103 » Mon Jan 08, 2007 11:04 pm

I purchased ANTEC NSK4400 case with SU380 few days ago.
And I am experiencing the exact same problem as you described here.
(PSU making noise when HD is connected.)
I have ASUS M2N-E motherboard so I do not think it's your motherboard.
Have you tried replacing the fan in SU380?
That's what I am trying to do right now. :?

Just little bit of my HW specs:
WD 250GB SATA2
512 DDR2
ASUS M2N-E

Mine sounds like soft whistling.

I hope we can find solution here.

jaganath
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Post by jaganath » Tue Jan 09, 2007 4:35 am

Have you tried replacing the fan in SU380?
That's what I am trying to do right now
First of all stop the fan (with a pencil or bit of plastic) and see if it is really the fan making the noise. You don't want to void your warranty unnecessarily.

PenDragon
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Post by PenDragon » Wed Jan 10, 2007 2:57 pm

Hi guys. Jaga, I stopped the fan like you specified on the Seasonic- that definitely was not the source of the buzzing noise.

John- good luck with your problem. I think I am going to try the motherboard replacement route because the buzzing PSU's don't buzz when hooked up to other computers. Have you tried that with your PSU? I'm thinking that either it's a bad mobo for me or some sort of incompatibility. I'm hoping it's a bad mobo, since incompatibility would mean I'd have to buy yet another new part :(

Anyway, the good news with the Abit return is that they offer a cross-ship option. They charge me $157, send me the new motherboard, then I send the old one back when I get the new motherboard in, and once they receive the old motherboard, they cut me a check for $150. I think not having the machine be down is certainly worth $7.

john103
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Post by john103 » Thu Jan 11, 2007 1:50 pm

Let me know how that goes man.
I'll just wait and see how yours go. :)
Just some advice;
If you change your power management. to home/office instead of minimal(?) management. that psu noise should go down quite a bit.
You won't be able to use AMD's cool&quite feature but it's worth disabling that and get the quiter system.

PenDragon
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Post by PenDragon » Fri Jan 12, 2007 8:08 pm

RMA process is in process...
that is to say that I have requested a "cross-ship RMA", and a Paypal account, since that is required for a "cross-ship RMA".

Flintz
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Post by Flintz » Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:25 pm

Count me in. I have a HX520W and I get the buzzing sound aswell, but only under load, in idle mode the psu is perfectly silent.
I was just playing Oblivion and the strange thing is that the buzzing seems to vary: When I open my inventory the buzzing occurs, in normal game it occurs but changes its sound somehow slighty and when resting is the funniest: The hours I am resting are counted down, when want to rest 10 hours in the game I get 10 times a short buzzing sound, one for every hour that is counted down in the menu...very strange, I know :)

I don't want to RMA my unit because the buzzing is not very loud and annoying but of course I would be interested in a solution.

I will probably trying to increase the load on my system (overclocking CPU and GPU) to see if this buzzing is connected to a certain load-state...

Flintz
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Post by Flintz » Thu Jan 18, 2007 10:34 am

I did a few tests here and I have found out that at least at my system the buzzing is connected to the graphics card. I am 99% sure that the sound comes from the PSU but it only occurs whenever I start any 3D application/game. It doesn't occur when putting only the cpu under load or the hdd. Overclocking didn't change anything although I am not sure how much additional load in idle mode the overclocking produced...

Still a very strange behaviour.

Oh and I also tested whether the sound is connected to the PSU temperature, doesn't seem so, it's probably a little louder when the PSU is warm but also there whith a cold PSU.

pendragn32
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Post by pendragn32 » Thu Jan 18, 2007 4:26 pm

It's interesting that you mention the buzzing occuring during inventory sweeps and a countdown in Oblivion, Flintz. I recently noticed that if I scroll through the menus in MCE, I get a quick buzz for every menu item that shoots past- sounds pretty similar. I get the same buzzing though whether I'm using onboard graphics or my Geforce 7600GS...

On another note, the replacement mobo is projected to come in next Tuesday or Wednesday. I am SO looking forward to yanking everything out, and then putting everything back in, and carefully mounting the Thermalright SI-97 again :roll:

andyb
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Post by andyb » Thu Jan 18, 2007 5:12 pm

Disconnect the RJ45 network cable from your motherboard, I bet you an imaginary £1 that you wont hear any buzzing.


Andy

Flintz
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Post by Flintz » Fri Jan 19, 2007 4:19 am

@andyb: At least with my system you lost your imaginary money ;D but you gave me an idea I will try when I get back home: Disabling all onboard devices and unplugging all unnecessary USB cords and network cords

@pendragn32: Very interesting, its good to hear that my problem is not only connected to my system. Which PSU do you use? What I find particular interesting is that for you it doesn't matter if onboard or real video card, because the difference in power consumption should be a good deal. And also because I suspected that the buzzing comes from one of the PCIe rails...

BTW, I recorded my buzzing you can hear it here: http://flintz.no-ip.org/netzteil.mp3
The change in pitch you will notice is somehow connected to the different menus in Oblivion, I have no real explaination for this behaviour though...

Flintz
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Post by Flintz » Fri Jan 19, 2007 4:19 am

@andyb: At least with my system you lost your imaginary money ;D but you gave me an idea I will try when I get back home: Disabling all onboard devices and unplugging all unnecessary USB cords and network cords

@pendragn32: Very interesting, its good to hear that my problem is not only connected to my system. Which PSU do you use? What I find particular interesting is that for you it doesn't matter if onboard or real video card, because the difference in power consumption should be a good deal. And also because I suspected that the buzzing comes from one of the PCIe rails...

BTW, I recorded my buzzing you can hear it here: http://flintz.no-ip.org/netzteil.mp3
The change in pitch you will notice is somehow connected to the different menus in Oblivion, I have no real explaination for this behaviour though...

PenDragon
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Post by PenDragon » Mon Jan 22, 2007 8:42 pm

Flintz- I've tried a Seasonic S12-380, an Antec SU-380, and an Antec SP2.0 350 (which didn't buzz, but which suffers from prohibitively short cables).

Andy, I still get the buzzing with the network cable unplugged. Out of curiosity, what was your logic behind the suggestion?

I should be getting the new mobo in tomorrow or Wednesday...

Poodle
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Post by Poodle » Mon Jan 22, 2007 11:42 pm

I've got the same noise with a Asus 945, E6600, 7900gt powered by the Seasonic M12 700W.


I'm getting an Intel BX2 with quad core cpu and a Corsair hx620 today and I will do some testing during the week to rule out what component is the bad apple.

PenDragon
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Post by PenDragon » Tue Jan 23, 2007 6:25 pm

Well, I just installed the new motherboard. And I just got off the phone with #$&@# MS, since they made me re-activate my legitimate copy of MCE 05. AND..........the buzzing is just as bad as it's ever been.

So, I've got a buzzing that occurs in the power supply during hard drive access, and the hard drive, the power supply, and the motherboard are all not at fault. That leaves......absolutely nothing, as far as I know. :(

I guess I give up- I've put way too much time and money into this, and to no avail. I'll be looking for some PSU cable extenders so I can get the Antec SP2.0 350w to reach, since it doesn't buzz at least. I know it's just a bandage, but the wound refuses to heal, even with a full motherboard transplant.

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