Shuttle KPC/K45 PSU

PSUs: The source of DC power for all components in the PC & often a big noise source.

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kvaruni
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Shuttle KPC/K45 PSU

Post by kvaruni » Thu May 15, 2008 4:59 am

I'm looking for some possibilities to silence the PSU of my Shuttle K45. I already silenced the CPU fan through the use of a Zalman FanMate2 and I'm looking at undervolting it. Furthermore, the hard drive is a Seagate 2.5", so quiet is its name :-).

However, I find the noise of the small 4cm fan of the PSU to be annoying. I know that a silent PSU is available for this box, however this is a budget box and I'm not willing to spend another 100$ in order to have a truly silent PC. Would it be possible to simply unplug this fan? Since it is only a 4cm fan, I can not imagine that it has all that much of an effect. However, I'm not sure if it would be advisable to unplug it. Though there is a 8cm case fan, I'm a bit hesitant since I do not want to blow my PSU :-).

Any advice or anyone who has already undertaken such an action?

MikeC
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Post by MikeC » Thu May 15, 2008 6:07 am

Don't stop that fan. You'll kill the PSU in no time.

If you want to make it quieter cheaply, the only thing I can think of is to remove the stock PSU and replace it with an old ATX12V PSU (hopefully you have one lying around) positioned outside the Shuttle with the cables leading in. Yeah, it'd be ugly unless you painted the PSU and did something with the cables, but you could probably run it with the fan at super low speed, slow enough for it to be virtually silent.

Hifriday
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Post by Hifriday » Sat May 24, 2008 12:41 pm

I worked on a K45 recently, and also found the PSU fan loud and whiny. I thought it was bearing noise, but it turned out to be the PSU case resonating from fan vibration (holding the fan firmly eliminates the whine). This may explain why some claim their KPC is pretty quiet while others complain it's too loud, depending how the fan sits. The fan is only attached by a flimsy two screws along one side. Sliding in some rubber grommets and adjusting the screws significantly reduced the whining.

The fan is still loud, but at least the sound is smoother and less annoying. I noticed even with no load, the fan is spinning at pretty high speed and suspect with sufficient case cooling, the PSU fan can be slowed down without too much problem (splicing in a fanmate).

A fan swap is also possible, mine came with a Yate Loon D40SM-12C and has very similar specs to a Sunon KD1204PKVM. The Sunon is rated at 21dBA versus 30dB, and runs relatively quiet for a 40mm fan when undervolted, but not sure if there would be a big difference running near full voltage.

Of course if you're willing to spend an extra $50-60 you can always opt for a completely silent PicoPSU. My system with a E2180, 2GB, 2.5" HDD ran on a 60W brick without any problems. Surprisingly the stock PSU comes very close in efficiency to the Pico setup which is very good.

josephclemente
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Post by josephclemente » Sat May 24, 2008 2:00 pm

I've done some modding to my K45. I will take pictures later and post in the Gallery.

I have replaced the 40mm stock fan with an 80mm fan. The PSU happens to be 80mm wide, so I cut an 80mm circle in the PSU. Then I cut an 80mm circle on the case panel. The fan goes on the case panel and now I am pleased. :D

solah
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Post by solah » Mon Aug 11, 2008 12:50 pm

I hate to resurrect a post, but...

The 40mm fan in my KPC was going out recently and rather than take it apart and ship it out for Shuttle warranty service I replaced the fan with a Sunon from Jab-tech. I run the computer 24/7 primarily as a NAS, but also occasionally have it up for a SOCKS proxy or gameserver. Nothing CPU intensive, really.

Initially I was disappointed with how loud the fan was as it was louder than the stock fan despite being rated quieter. I added a Nexus 92mm to the rear of the case to reduce ambient temperature and re-pinned the fan to run at 5v. So far (5 days) it's running quieter and cooler than it ever has.

The original fan may have been fine running at 5v, but it's soldered directly in the PSU and I never thought to try it. I would definitely recommend installing a 92mm fan if you plan on undervolting the PSU fan. Although the PSU fan doesn't exhaust air from the inside of the case, I would think that reducing the ambient temperature would go a long way in helping keep the PSU cool.

The Sunon I bought:
http://www.jab-tech.com/Sunon-Magnetic- ... -2442.html

And to give you an idea of the power/heat in my machine, I'm running an e2160 (65W TDP?) with a plain jane Seagate 500GB hdd.

zeno
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Post by zeno » Mon Aug 25, 2008 2:52 pm

So I managed to get a K45 with ICE Genie.

The PSU that comes with the K45 is pretty loud so I bought a picoPSU 120.

The mainboard on the K45 however, has 2 power connectors:
ATX1 and ATX2 as you see in the picture.


Anyone know of a way I can make the picoPSU work with this?

zeno
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Post by zeno » Mon Aug 25, 2008 2:52 pm

I wasn't allowed to post an image on my first post

Image

Mats
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Post by Mats » Mon Aug 25, 2008 11:49 pm

Almost all motherboards have two power connectors these days, the smaller one is often called the P4 (from Pentium 4) power connector. This is probably what you need.

zeno
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Post by zeno » Tue Aug 26, 2008 8:21 pm

Thanks Mats,
Just ordered one of those, and I'll post on progress.

Btw, the ICE GENIE is really quiet. It's a shame that their cheap PSU ruins it.

zeno
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Post by zeno » Mon Sep 08, 2008 3:41 am

So my system is completely installed with PicoPSU 120 and the k45 is completely silent.

It's really amazing how silent this thing is. I don't have any db figures to give, but even when it is completely silent in the middle of the night, I can't tell whether it's on or not.

My next problem: making some sort of bracket for the PicoPSU where the original PSU used to be, the one and only PCI slot I have on the K45 is taken up by a wireless card.

mibztec
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undervolt psu fan

Post by mibztec » Thu Sep 11, 2008 8:23 am

solah wrote: The original fan may have been fine running at 5v, but it's soldered directly in the PSU and I never thought to try it. I would definitely recommend installing a 92mm fan if you plan on undervolting the PSU fan. Although the PSU fan doesn't exhaust air from the inside of the case, I would think that reducing the ambient temperature would go a long way in helping keep the PSU cool.
This is my first post in spcr forum and first off I'd like to extend my thanks to those who contributed to this post.

My question goes to solah and other knowledgeable ones. How much can you undervolt the psu fan? I've fiddled with tweaking the psu fan voltage for a while now and wonder if it's safe to keep the fan at 5v. Please advise. Thanks!

.jazz.
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Post by .jazz. » Sun Sep 14, 2008 1:24 am

zeno wrote:So my system is completely installed with PicoPSU 120 and the k45 is completely silent.

It's really amazing how silent this thing is. I don't have any db figures to give, but even when it is completely silent in the middle of the night, I can't tell whether it's on or not.

My next problem: making some sort of bracket for the PicoPSU where the original PSU used to be, the one and only PCI slot I have on the K45 is taken up by a wireless card.
Hi zeno

sounds fantastic what you've done there..

yesterday my k45's PSU started to whine and be very loud so I'm VERY keen on trying out what you've done.

So I'm wondering if you could help do the steps correctly as I haven't tried the picoPSU before;

1. which picoPSU should I by. Would this be the correct one: "PSU-120 Power Kit" as seen here: http://www.mini-box.com/picoPSU-120-pow ... ategory=13

2. about the bracket: I'm not using my slots for anything. Would this then work for me: "PCI Rear Slot Cover for all circular power connectors" as seen here: http://www.mini-box.com/s.nl/it.A/id.43 ... ategory=13

3. what about the 4-pin cable you asked about earlier - is that something I should buy as well .. "yes" i take it ..

Sorry if these questions are somewhat naive !?! ... i'm a beginner to this

/jazz

zeno
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Post by zeno » Thu Sep 18, 2008 10:33 am

.jazz

I have the PicoPSU 120 power kit which includes the brick.

Yes order the bracket you described in the link.

Yes, you also need to 4-pin cable.

If you have a SATA drive, you're done. If you have an IDE drive, then you'll need a Y connector to split the IDE power cable and the p4 power connector.

Good luck. Everything is still going great for me.

.jazz.
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Post by .jazz. » Thu Sep 18, 2008 10:43 am

Thanks Zeno

Now all I need to do is find a European supplier - but at least I know what to go for...

-jazz

.jazz.
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Post by .jazz. » Thu Sep 18, 2008 11:34 am

Hi again -

I found a UK shop to get the things from .. I got an 80 W brick rather than the 60 W brick in the US shop ..

was that a bad or an ok thing to do ?

-jazz

.jazz.
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Post by .jazz. » Mon Sep 22, 2008 10:52 am

update:
I got the stuff today and have it installed.

The internal power-cable for the picoPSU is too short to reach over to the PCI bracket, so I drilled a hole in the backpanel to fit the plug :-)

Things look fine and works out ok!

However the K45 is still noisy so I'm hoping that the ICE cooler - Shuttles CPU cooler - will be out for sale soon!

spacecadet610
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Post by spacecadet610 » Tue Oct 07, 2008 8:02 pm

I purchased the picopsu-120 for use with my shuttle k45. it works great but i have an issue i can't figure out.

When i turn off my computer now, my cpu fan (intel fan) runs continuously although the computer is off. When i switch back to the native power supply, the cpu fan turns off as it should.

I can't figure out what would be different with the picopsu that might cause this. any suggestions?

jeffehobbs
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Now the KPC shuts down

Post by jeffehobbs » Sun Oct 19, 2008 8:46 am

I replaced the loud and annoying KPC PSU with a pico PSU -- which works great -- however, now when the CPU really gets going the machine shuts down. Could someone recommend a small and quiet (and ideally, easy to install) way to draw the air out of the back of the KPC? I think that's all that's required here.

Thanks!

Garbanzo
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Post by Garbanzo » Wed Oct 22, 2008 9:39 am

jeffehobbs,

Now I don't know which CPU cooler you're running but in my setup I can fit a 92mm fan in the back of the case without any problems.

I didn't spend any time looking for a good silent 92mm fan, but used a Zalman I already had and undervolted to 5v to make it quiet. However, mine still shuts down sporadically when the case is closed up so I have to try it at 12v.

You probably need a strong but silent 92mm fan.

My current setup is a bit different as I put in an Intel DG45FC board with a E7200 CPU in the K45 case. However, in my main desktop a PicoPSU 120w powers my E6850 on a Intel DG45ID and has been running stable 24/7 for a week now. It's a Silverstone SG01 case so I do have more room for a decent airflow.

Which AC Adapter are you using? If you use the 60w, maybe that's part of the problem. I run both my machines with Dell Y2515 200w AC adapters ($25 ea on Ebay). See threads here in SPCR forums for modding the connector. Try with a fan first though, it can only help.

As for finding a 92mm fan, I recommend Jab-Tech or Sidewinder Computers for good prices, nice selection and very importantly fair shipping cost if you need few things. Look for a fan with the highest CFM at the lowest DBa (I usually try to avoid anything over 21dba but that does limit the CFM).

If you go with Sidewinder I can also recommend the rubber/silicone fan rivets they have. Low price, nice soft rubber and works great with my 92mm fan. I bought the dualhead ones so can't comment on the regular ones.

Strid
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Post by Strid » Wed Oct 22, 2008 12:10 pm

spacecadet610 wrote:I purchased the picopsu-120 for use with my shuttle k45. it works great but i have an issue i can't figure out.

When i turn off my computer now, my cpu fan (intel fan) runs continuously although the computer is off. When i switch back to the native power supply, the cpu fan turns off as it should.

I can't figure out what would be different with the picopsu that might cause this. any suggestions?
How is the fan connected? IIRC, (someone please correct me if I'm mistaken!) the PicoPSU just passes 12V straight through from the power brick. So if your fan runs off the 12V line, it'll still be hooked up, even if the motherboard is powered down. Try and use a motherboard fan header or the 5V line on the PicoPSU.

dmarcum99
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Post by dmarcum99 » Wed Jan 14, 2009 1:57 pm

Hi everybody.

I made an account so I could post my results on my 45 sound issues.

1st thing I did when I was unable to tolerate the noise was to replace the stock 3-pin Intel cooler with an inexpensive 4-pin cooler. As long as you bought a lower RPM fan, then you can go into the bios settings and set your fan adjustments. I'm running a celeron 430 for my WHS box, so cooling wasn't going to be an issue. This may be where some go wrong in their attempts. Either they are using a CPU which is "compatible", yet produces so much heat that the fan has to work overtime to remove it. Or, in some instances, the bios may be set-up wrong and when the CPU "gets going"...it's temps rises above the warning levels and shuts the PC down. I'd look at the bios and make sure you have the temp settings according to the CPU you have in it. Lastly, even though the CPU may be compatible, remember the PSU is rated for only 100 watts. If you have 2 HD's and a separate video card, you may be exceeding what the PSU can handle.

2nd, I removed the 40mm fan out of the PSU and soldered in a SCYTHE Mini Kaze. It's a direct replacement, but you have to cut/solder the wires to connect it. It's only 14db....I cannot hear it at all!!

In all, the two changes I made was a world of difference in the noise section. Now the loudest in my setup is the HD churning away. I highly suggest going to the Scythe Mini Kaze 40mm fan to get rid of the whinny fan sound. Shuttle should have known better.....cutting costs and sacrificing build quality is a no-no when this was touted as a silent, workstation type item.

nurb
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Post by nurb » Fri Feb 06, 2009 7:27 am

Thanks for the info on the SCYTHE Mini Kaze, dmarcum99, that really helped. I also installed the Ice Genie and am VERY happy with how quiet the system is now.

doveman
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Post by doveman » Sat Feb 07, 2009 1:22 am

Strid wrote:How is the fan connected? IIRC, (someone please correct me if I'm mistaken!) the PicoPSU just passes 12V straight through from the power brick. So if your fan runs off the 12V line, it'll still be hooked up, even if the motherboard is powered down.
I highly doubt the Pico keeps supplying 12v when the PC is shut down as that would leave the hard drives spinning as well.

josephclemente
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Post by josephclemente » Sat Feb 07, 2009 1:51 pm

nurb wrote:I also installed the Ice Genie and am VERY happy with how quiet the system is now.
Where did you find the Ice Genie? Was the price reasonable?

MyCatsNameIsBernie
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Scythe Mini Kaze in Shuttle K45 PSU 10 or 20mm thick?

Post by MyCatsNameIsBernie » Wed Mar 04, 2009 6:35 pm

Hi I just built a K45 with Celeron 430 and am new to this forum.

I started with Intel's stock cooler and 92mm Antec 3-speed fan (set to low). Everything stayed real cool, but the Intel cooler was LOUD! So loud I didn't couldn't hear the PSU fan :-)

Next I got the ICE Genie from getashuttle. That was a huge improvement. However, now I can hear the PSU fan :-(

I want to replace the PSU fan with a Scythe Mini Kaze as mentioned earlier in this thread, but I see 2 different models: 10 mm or 20 mm thick. Which is the correct one to use in the Shuttle PSU?

Thanks for the help!

josephclemente
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Re: Scythe Mini Kaze in Shuttle K45 PSU 10 or 20mm thick?

Post by josephclemente » Thu Mar 05, 2009 6:30 pm

20mm thick is the correct one.

Alfiegerner
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Post by Alfiegerner » Sun Jun 07, 2009 8:12 pm

Mats wrote:Almost all motherboards have two power connectors these days, the smaller one is often called the P4 (from Pentium 4) power connector. This is probably what you need.
(link removed due to post count and forum rules).

Sorry for resurrecting this old post. I'm getting a picoPSU 120 to help silence my K45. As noted above it doesn't come with an atx1 power connector. My problem is that I can't find one of these adapters in NZ. Without wanting to sound daft, do I need one or will it work from the 20 pin atx1 connector?

If I do need one, could any one point me in the right direction of how to make one myself? (or even better tell me where to get one in NZ :P).

MyCatsNameIsBernie
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Post by MyCatsNameIsBernie » Sat Mar 13, 2010 1:02 pm

I've had my K45 for a little over a year. My K45 is loaded with 2 1TB WD Caviar Green drives, 1 GB RAM, Celeron 430, and ICE Genie.

The PSU noise bothered me, but it wasn't loud enough to motivate me to fix it. However, the original PSU literally went up in smoke right after the 1yr warranty expired, so I had to do something.

I had done some measurements with a Kill-A-Watt using the original PSU, and found the power consumption peaked at 70 watts for a few seconds during start-up, and then dropped to 45-50 watts during normal operation.

So I got a PicoPSU 90 with an 80W brick. It's working great, and it is wonderful to finally have a nearly-silent K45. I chose the PicoPSU 90 because it wass the only model that included the 4-pin power connector. I cut a piece of scrap metal to patch the hole where the old PSU used to be, to ensure proper airflow. I drilled a hole in the patch to mount the PicoPSU's 12V power connector.

My Kill-A-Watt shows the K45 power consumption using the PicoPSU/brick is almost identical to that of the original Shuttle PSU.

Thanks to everyone who contribued to this thread for the great info!

Trav1s
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Post by Trav1s » Sat Mar 13, 2010 2:24 pm

MyCatsnameisBernie, where did you purchase those parts?

Crim
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Post by Crim » Sat Mar 13, 2010 2:45 pm

MikeC wrote:Don't stop that fan. You'll kill the PSU in no time.
I removed the fan in mine along with the PSU's side panel and I haven't had any issues with it. The PSU doesn't get all that hot either in this configuration.

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