Fortron 120 mm or modding?

pingo · Post by **pingo** » Sun May 25, 2003 11:59 pm

Sorry for my poor english. First post here, after some time lurking getting very good suggestions for silencing my system.
I'm in trouble for silencing my PSU. Possible solutions.
- Replace with the Fortron 300W FSP 300-60PN with 120 mm fan. But the only place selling the non PF version in Europe is noisecontrol.de, that's very expensive (Compared with the US price) and does not carry the 300W version.
- Mod my actual PSU for passive cooling like this http://www.silentpcreview.com/modules.p ... =80&page=1
- Mod my actual PSU replacing the 80 mm fan with a panaflo, cut the grill, and thermal control of the fan.
- Mod my actual PSU to look like the Fortron, with a 120 mm papst, cutting the original internal heatsinks to make space for the fan, thermal control of the fan, and drill the rear PSU box.

thanks.

halcyon · Post by **halcyon** » Mon May 26, 2003 6:43 am

That Codegen PSU mod looks dangerous, even if you know what you are doing

I'm not sure what kind of testing the PSU would pass after that mod, so personally I wouldn't risk it, but the choice is yours of course.

The 60PN (non-PFC) should not be sold in EU as it's not allowed. Are you sure noisecontrol is selling the non PFC version?

What PSU are you currently running with?

My ideal EU approved mod would be (if I could find the parts in EU!) Seasonic SS350-FS (the most efficient/silent active pfc PSU to begin with) modified with a Panaflo M1A (enough to cool it at high load, but still almost L1A quiet at low voltage) or a Fenshen Hypro bearing fan (should be even more silent at 7+ volts than the Panaflo).

However, I have been unable to find these parts for sale in EU. Well, the Seasonic 300/400W is available at yourland micro (FR) and Kool 'n Quiet (UK), but the rest of the pieces are missing.

regards,
Halcyon

pingo · Post by **pingo** » Mon May 26, 2003 7:55 am

[quote="halcyon"]That Codegen PSU mod looks dangerous, even if you know what you are doing

Thanks for your answer. I know it's dangerous, in fact I think I'm going to keep the fan in my PSU.

[snip]

The 60PN (non-PFC) should not be sold in EU as it's not allowed. Are you sure noisecontrol is selling the non PFC version?

This is the cut and paste from noisecontrol.de:

350W FSP 350-60PN
- passives PFC
- 350 Watt
- P4 kompatibel
Yate Loon Lüfter D12BM-12. (12cm)
- Max 1700 U/Min
- 21-29 db(A)

Maybe you are right!

What PSU are you currently running with?

A generic one. don't even remember the name now. And actually I'm not at my main pc.

[snip]

thanks for your advice about PSU.

regards.

Guillaume · Post by **Guillaume** » Tue Jun 03, 2003 1:49 am

Have you tried french resellers ? You can have a look on www.rue-hardware.com, on that page http://www.rue-hardware.com/prix/liste/116/.

Ciao,

Guillaume

Kostik · Post by **Kostik** » Tue Jun 03, 2003 2:11 am

Guillaume : They won't sell the non-PF version. As Halcyon said, PFC is mandatory in the EU. I bought my FSP 300-60PN from materiel.net, thinking it was the non-PF version ; it wasn't. Same thing goes for noisecontrol.de. I'll probably replace mine as soon as yourland.fr has the 350w Seasonic.

Pingu : If I were you, I would buy one of the PSUs from the recommended list and mod it with a panaflo, assuming you can find panaflos in Italia.

pingo · Post by **pingo** » Tue Jun 03, 2003 3:01 am

Thanks for advice guys!
I'll take a look at french resellers, I don't think they ship to Italy (yourland does not).

I can't find panaflo in Italy. The cheapest way to get panaflo here I think is order from www.siliconacoustics.com (USA)

Cheaper than order from http://www.theoverclockingstore.co.uk/ (UK)

regards

kork · Post by **kork** » Tue Jun 03, 2003 3:28 am

pingo wrote:I can't find panaflo in Italy. The cheapest way to get panaflo here I think is order from www.siliconacoustics.com (USA)

You might want to check out Dorothy's offerings here. I have bought from her once and found her service to be top-notch.

Yomat · Post by **Yomat** » Tue Jun 03, 2003 3:58 am

Noisecontrol.de has two models. The plain somewhat noisy PPFC variant. And one they mod themselves with a Papst fan and their own verified thermal regulation circuit. So it is probably as silent or moreso than the non-PFC variant. Only problem is the price.

pingo · Post by **pingo** » Tue Jun 03, 2003 4:41 am

kork. Thank you for the link to Dorothy's offerings.

Yomat. I think the noisecontrol.de fortron PSU with papst fan is really great. But the price is a really BIG problem!!!

regards

Shuriken · Post by **Shuriken** » Tue Jun 03, 2003 6:16 am

Why not buy the PF version and replace the fan with a Papst one?

Kostik · Post by **Kostik** » Tue Jun 03, 2003 7:06 am

Shuriken : Both the controler used in the PF version and in noisecontrol's version are linear, and the one used in the non-PF version is non-linear (from what I gathered). Just replacing the fan with a Papst won't prevent it from speeding-up very quickly, even at relatively low temperatures.

Shuriken · Post by **Shuriken** » Tue Jun 03, 2003 7:42 am

I haven't heart mine spinning up yet. I am using it for 3 weeks now.

pingo · Post by **pingo** » Tue Jun 03, 2003 9:21 am

Shuriken. Where did you get your fortron?

halcyon · Post by **halcyon** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 1:31 am

The fan in my Fortron FSP-300-60PN(PF) is already silent as it is (for the CFM it moves). So it has very little rotational noise except the air movement noise.

The trouble is that even though it's a standard 25mm height fan finding a more silent replacement (at 12Volts) is not easy.

Papst doesn't have such a model (not noisy at 12V). The problem with the PFC version of this PSU is that it control 12V to the fan pretty fast after start up, so you need a fan that is silent at 12V not only at 5V.

regards,
Halcyon

EDIT: corrected the height of the fan (it is 25mm).

Yomat · Post by **Yomat** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 6:10 pm

Halcyon: There has been some activity in the forums about PFC recently. I think yourself wrote that passive PFC would generate more heat and would that lead to the PF model to need more cooling? Then it wouldent help with a nonlinear thermistor either. It might even be so that it has to be a linear because the PFC makes a linear heat curve where the non-PFC does not.

Making a sum here of opinions:

* Someone said that PFC makes the size of the internals of the PSU larger, thus harder to cool.

* passive PFC generates more heat than others.

* MikeC said that PFC has nothing to do with noise level of PSU.

* MikeC also said that non-PFC variant was budget and therefore had a sleave bearing fan. Does not explain the differende in thermistor though. Non-linear is about the same price as a linear.

You have any idea 'how much' hotter a passive PFC will be compared to a non-PFC or an active PFC?

halcyon · Post by **halcyon** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 9:54 pm

Yomat,

good points. I will perhaps try to modify my Seasonic to fit a 120mm intake/exhaust fan at the bottom, because it's APFC and has a nicer fan voltage controller.

It's a lot of work though for my cutting skills/equipment.

regards,
Halcyon

Post by **MikeC** » Wed Jun 04, 2003 11:12 pm

halcyon wrote:I will perhaps try to modify my Seasonic to fit a 120mm intake/exhaust fan at the bottom, because it's APFC and has a nicer fan voltage controller.

What for!? If you plan on any Seasonic modding, cutting the fan grill away & replacing the fan with a quieter one is about all you should consider. There is no way a 120mm fan will fit inside the PSU, as the heatsinks are too tall. If a 120mm fan is on the outside, it will interfere with lots of stuff. You are asking for trouble, IMO.

If you are looking to improve the cooling in the system, just add a quiet exhaust fan on the back panel. And maybe do a duct mod (using anything from cardboard to foam) to take fresh outside air via the top CD bay directly into the PSU intake. This keeps the PSU cooling on a compeletly separate path from the rest of the case. It works; the Panaflo 80Ls in the Seasonics in my systems NEVER speed up, yet the PSU exhaust air temp varies little -- only with general room temp.

Uwackme · Post by **Uwackme** » Thu Jun 05, 2003 1:06 am

I took a Nexus PS, moved the guts into a Fortron body and then put the 120mm fan on the OUTSIDE of its hole instead of the INSIDE. Since the Nexus heatsinks are HUGE and no room was left inside for the fan. I used the Fortron temp circuit, just screwed it onto the Nexus heatsink and powered the fan.

PS is cool and very quiet. In any of the good cases... SLK3700/Sonata/D8000/LX-6A19 there is plenty of room below the PS for the fan (now protruding from the PS case). So I have 120mm intake and 2 120mm exhaust fans all running slow at low voltage. I can now hear my mouse SQUEEK again.

Yomat · Post by **Yomat** » Thu Jun 05, 2003 11:05 pm

halcyon: Ah. Dont take my words so seriously.

All those 'opinions' are not verified to any lengths. And if there is one thing in the machine that one should avoid to modify too much, its probably the PSU. This for saftety of both you, your surroundings and the rest of the machine.

Uwackme: Hehe. Cool! But sounds a 'little' bit overkill to do that. Was it a PFC Fortron? I thought myself that it might be useful to put the fan outside though. If there is room for it. This way I can vibration dampen it. Someone said it was a tight fit in there so grommets might not be possible inside the case. And by doing this you might reduce some of the fan noise by distancing items from its air-path. Dont know about the cooling however. Should be the same.

Uwackme · Post by **Uwackme** » Thu Jun 05, 2003 11:09 pm

Yep a PFC real quiet unit, and I too want to put the isolators on... my next thing to do... order isolators. I got melamine from McMaster and didnt realize they had the isolators...DOH!

Fortron 120 mm or modding?

Fortron 120 mm or modding?

PS mod