Looking for a new PSU - Again [ Quiet up to 400W ]

aSASa · Post by **aSASa** » Thu Jul 02, 2009 6:10 pm

Hi again. I've gone through a few PSUs now and am getting irritated because my 4+ year old Enermax 535W beats them all.

So far:
Zalman 1000W = Whining under anything
Silverstone 700W = Fan is ticking under low load, loud under higher load
Enermax 625W = Vibrating fan
OCZ ModXStream 700W = Whining under 3d games
HX620 = Whining

My quietest so far, without ANY whining or buzzing under any circumstances?

4+ year old Enermax EG565P-VE FMA with 1x90MM + 1x80MM fan

Reasons for replacing: Both fans are old and noisy [ They now "buzz". I know nothing about bearings, but my guess is they are bad? ] and once getting into higher loads they became considerably louder. Its also a value PSU that I don't trust running my computer.

------
Specs:

Inaudible:
4GB ram
Striker II Formula
Q9450 @ 3GHz [ Odd, can't boot computer without OC ]

Sorted from quietest to loudest:
Stacker 830 with 2x 120MM stock fans @ 820RPM
HDT-S1283 + stock fan @ 830RPM
WD6400AAKS Rev. 2 ( Louder than Rev. 0 )
GTX 260 216 ( Clearly audible @ 25%, I thought you guys said this thing was silent

)
Enermax 535W
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Related:
I can currently buy a P182 used, slightly damaged, for $65 shipped. Does this seem like a good deal? I haven't bit yet since it doesn't have a removable tray or sound dampening foam. If I am recommended to buy it, does anyone have recommendations to fix those bad front vents? How about sound dampening foam - is it worth it on a steel case?

Post by **NeilBlanchard** » Thu Jul 02, 2009 6:26 pm

Hi,

What about the Nexus?

aSASa · Post by **aSASa** » Thu Jul 02, 2009 6:39 pm

Thanks for the reply.

Two things:

1- Doesn't that seem a bit too close to my computers load, especially assuming I upgrade it?
2- Who the heck sells this thing in the USA?

lodestar · Post by **lodestar** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 3:50 am

I think you need to go for a passive PSU this time, it will solve all the noise problems.

Post by **NeilBlanchard** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 6:37 am

Hello,

aSASa wrote:Two things:

1- Doesn't that seem a bit too close to my computers load, especially assuming I upgrade it?
2- Who the heck sells this thing in the USA?

Have you put a Kill-A-Watt meter on your system? I very much doubt that it draws as much as you think it does. Even if it it is close to the limit of the Nexus, I'll bet it is still quieter (by far) than any of the units you listed.

Here's one place to get it:

http://www.endpcnoise.com/cgi-bin/e/std ... upply.html

Here's another:

http://www.eastluna.com/hardware/detail ... 3498&id2=b

And another:

http://www.pctoys.com/840556089490.html

Shamgar · Post by **Shamgar** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 9:57 am

As Neil said, the Nexus Value 430 will be the quietest fan-cooled PSU around the 400W mark. It's not as efficient at low loads as the similarly spec'd Corsair VX450, but it will be a lot quieter as the fan in the Nexus will be spinning much slower.

Regarding the P182 you're considering, if you can get it cheap, it's a solid choice. Probably the most popular ATX case on SPCR (although the Solo would give it a good run for its money now). I don't have much hands on experience with the P18x cases, however, I inspected them very closely in store. There's really no desperate need to add dampening foam to the P182 -- the panels and door are already triple layered for dampening. I think the biggest (technical) complaints with the case were a) its somewhat flimsy door which could warp/flex; b) the somewhat restrictive front vents' filter doors; and c) the cumbersone top vent which could cause the fan there to vibrate when it was used. These shortcomings can be remedied with some patience and a little effort, I'm sure. You could just take the vent doors off if you aren't concerned about the appearance of bare metal. The case door serves well for that purpose also.

aSASa · Post by **aSASa** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 1:03 pm

Thanks for replying.

$80+ Shipping seems a bit high for a value oriented PSU.. but I'll consider. Maybe I'll wait until newegg stocks it.

I know how everyone sais UPS are terribly inaccurate, but so far all the times I've checked it load meter, it never went over 20% [ APC 1500VA ]
Right now, with my monitor off, it claims 140 watts. That seems a bit too good to be true [ Especially since that's already factoring in my PSU's low efficiency at that load, it could be around 115W? ] I'll do a load check soon.

Thanks for your help so far everyone

.

If anyone can recommend me a better silent case, PLEASE do so. I really - really want a quiet case. My brother has a Cosmos with foam. It definetely silenced his HDD, and seems that his PSU is inaudible too
[ Cheap Thermaltake! ]. Problem is that his fans are still at 1200RPM, and I can't be sure that its really silenced. I'm sure I could trade with him if I wanted to, since he likes my case more, but his is scratched up and mine is basically new condition. I like my case to not only perform well, but to look good.

Things I'm considering:

P182
P183
CM Sileo
And this Solo is good I hear?

thejamppa · Post by **thejamppa** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 2:57 pm

P182 and Solo are both good. P182 needs bit modding and Solo less. Considering that Solo has built in HDD suspension what P18x do not have, solo is quite strong candidate for any case.

Solo's HDD rack prevent installing larger VGA cards like GTX 260 or HD x2's.

aSASa · Post by **aSASa** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 4:11 pm

Ah, thank you for saying that. Guess it won't work for me then.

I need a case that can carry large GPUs + CPU heatsinks. That seems to disqualify P190's and Solo, possibly Sileo? Not sure I'd even want the Sileo though.

aSASa · Post by **aSASa** » Fri Jul 03, 2009 5:36 pm

Found another deal I can get in on: CM 690 for free + shipping. Hmm?

P182 = $65 Shipped
690 = $30 shipped

Which seems like a better choice, for noise?

Shamgar · Post by **Shamgar** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 5:14 am

US$80 does seem high for a value PSU... that's probably because the Nexus is a European product: the Euro is quite strong against most other currencies, so outside the EU you have to pay a premium for these imports.

Cooler Master 690 is a good alternative to the P18x but they cannot be directly compared. The 690 is a good foundation for a powerful system at an affordable price much less than the Antecs. Because the 690 has multiple fan options (front, side and top), an open mesh front bezel and top, undampened and less substantial panels than the best Antecs, it would take some more work to improve its quietness. The cost saving could be worth it if the money saved could be invested elsewhere in the system.

Sadly, at this time, there are too few alternatives to the "big two" Antec cases for out of the box quiet computing. Other cases are a better deal but they require more work. The Antecs usually cost more because of the features and development that has gone into them, as well as the fact you are paying for the Antec "badge".

dhanson865 · Post by **dhanson865** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 5:53 am

I'm slightly confused are you looking for quiet at 400W actual load or are you looking for quiet with a model number of 400W or higher?

Code: Select all

Model       Output (W)  65      90      150     200     250     300   380/400/430/450 80Plus
        Efficiency                                                    as appropriate
Nexus Value 430         76.5%   80.7%   82.1%   83.7%   82.8%   82.7%   79.7%         None
     Corsair VX450W     79.1%   80.1%   82.6%   84.8%   83.3%   83.0%   81.8%         80Plus
Nightjar ST45NF 450W    77.3%   80.8%   82.6%   87.7%           87.1%   83.3%         Bronze
Enermax Modu82+         80.0%   80.9%   84.3%   85.9%   86.4%   85.4%   83.8%         Bronze
Seasonic M12D 850W      77.8%   81.6%   83.9%   87.5%   87.4%   87.3%   87.9%         Silver

         Noise (dBA@1m)
Nexus Value 430                 11      11      16      18      18      19
Corsair VX450W          noise numbers for this review were preanechoic chamber
Nightjar ST45NF 450W             0         Nightjar ST45NF is fanless    0
Enermax Modu82+                 13      13      14      15      16      26
Seasonic M12D 850W              14      14      14      14      14      24

There is a 750W version of the Seasonic M12D that is a couple of dollars cheaper but even then its an expensive PSU. The plus side is you can expect the fan to not ramp up unless you are pulling several hundred watts.

But if your system whines with the Corsair HX620W and OCZ ModXstream 700W have you considered using a different UPS or some sort of line conditioner to see if the input is causing it?

The other possibility is one of your components even the motherboard is causing the squeal even if the noise comes from the PSU it could be what is being pulled by a component makes the PSU work hard to convert to a specific load.

Also of note is that in July or August you should be able to buy an 80Plus Gold rated PSU made by Seasonic.

http://techreport.com/discussions.x/17025

The firm's new X-Series power supply series include 650W and 750W models, both of which have 80 Plus Gold certification.

...
...
...

Thanks to that design, Seasonic says the cooling fan inside an X-Series PSU just won't switch on until the unit reaches a 20% load. Now, the company also told us temperature will determine the fan speed, so the fan may not turn off in a particularly cramped or poorly ventilated system. Still, Seasonic designed the X-Series to be entirely passively cooled in a regular PC at sub-20% loads. And that's without massive heatsinks poking out the back.

Shamgar · Post by **Shamgar** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 6:21 am

Okay, after reading the OP's topic again, I think he is meaning that his system will draw up to 400W at load! That throws a spanner in the works of our recommendations

.

[ Quiet up to 400W ]

The culprits for the high power consumption would be a combination of an overclocked quadcore CPU, a power hungry gamers' motherboard and the graphics card at 3D load. I'm not an expert number cruncher, so I can't say what the system will draw.

If the main problem is whining, and I think it is judging from the first post, maybe the graphics card or motherboard is to blame instead? If they are, swapping out a dozen PSUs will not likely help.

aSASa · Post by **aSASa** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 3:57 pm

@ Shamgar: Thank you for your help. I guess I'll go for the P182 if I do indeed decide to buy a case. I don't really feel like modding.. I have no experience.

@ Dhanson865: 400W actual load. I know, I know - NO WAY YOU'LL GO THAT high, and I understand that. Its just I like the headroom, and I don't want the fan in the PSU going over 800RPM under any circumstances.

As for the UPS, the only PSU that has been used with and without a UPS is the one I'm on now, the old, dying one. I just got it in the last month or so. It had no effect on this PSU.

I don't expect much from Seasonic either, as I've looked up tons of there PSUs and all of them have complaints on squealing. It seems that my machine just doesn't like 99% of them.

@ Shamgar: Yep

. I figure I'll load around 250-300 at most, but again, I like headroom. I could ask to test my brother's PSU on mine... or do it when hes gone

.

Thanks for your help so far guys!

If I can't find a PSU without the problem, and ideas on FIXING the problem? I've read hot glue, electrical tape, some other sort of fabric.. or something... not sure what it was. But, I'd like something I could apply, and if it didn't work, remove - and still return for a refund [ No opening the PSU, able to apply through fan grills.

dhanson865 · Post by **dhanson865** » Sat Jul 04, 2009 4:50 pm

aSASa wrote:I don't expect much from Seasonic either, as I've looked up tons of there PSUs and all of them have complaints on squealing.

The ones I mentioned have not been seen in the wild yet. No one could possibly have one to complain about.

I'm not saying they'll specifically address your issues but I am saying past performance is no indication of future results.

aSASa · Post by **aSASa** » Sun Jul 05, 2009 11:24 am

Alright, well, I'll wait an see how they are.

I'd prefer a noisier fan than whining or buzzing though, so I don't have my hopes up.

aSASa · Post by **aSASa** » Tue Jul 07, 2009 4:01 pm

Well now I can get a HX850 for $142+ tax. Is this even worth trying? I mean.. it has a higher fan starting speed.. but.. thats tempting.

I guess its not all too much better than the $150 AR I got on the ZM850, but this has no rebates

fyleow · Post by **fyleow** » Fri Jul 10, 2009 12:20 pm

aSASa wrote:Well now I can get a HX850 for $142+ tax. Is this even worth trying? I mean.. it has a higher fan starting speed.. but.. thats tempting.

I guess its not all too much better than the $150 AR I got on the ZM850, but this has no rebates

Why do you want to spend $150 on a PSU when you can spend <$100 for the Nexus which would fit your power needs and is the quietest active PSU tested?

The 55nm GTX 260 draws ~100 watts full load, you'll have plenty of extra wattage with the Nexus.

aSASa · Post by **aSASa** » Fri Jul 10, 2009 3:35 pm

The reason would be being a well known + respected brand, higher wattage, trusted reseller, modular.

Hmm, I see someone brought up the "Nexus 430 vs Rosewill 430" and it does appear that they are very similar. I can get the 630W for just $70, and I have a coupon code, so I save even more.. hmm? Reviewers [ which of course, I take with a grain of salt ] do say its very quiet, but many have DOAs.

Post by **CA_Steve** » Fri Jul 10, 2009 4:18 pm

Corsair CMPSU-550VX for $66 after $20 MIR

aSASa · Post by **aSASa** » Fri Jul 10, 2009 4:33 pm

Thanks, but, comparing that to the Nexus.. 11DBA minimum + 19DBA max vs 22DBA minimum + 50DBA max... theres really no way I could buy it.

DAve_M · Post by **DAve_M** » Sat Jul 18, 2009 6:17 am

Take a look at the silvertone 450w fanless model.

http://www.kustompcs.co.uk/acatalog/info_1711.html

Nexus Value PSU seems like the best fan cooled PSU for your needs. Do you know your PC's power usage? It's probably no more than 200w under load? Maybe even the 350w fanless PSU like the silvertone one will do.

Edit: I take that back, I thought the GTX 260 was only single aux power connector like the GTS 250. Still, I wonder if a 350w PSU could do the job.

doveman · Post by **doveman** » Sat Jul 18, 2009 8:46 am

+1 for the Nexus (from someone who owns one and loves it).

aSASa · Post by **aSASa** » Sat Jul 18, 2009 11:33 am

Don't have a Kill-A-Watt, but my RS1500VA APC UPS claims [ Furmark + Prime95 ] that its using ( With monitor off ) 320W max. [ Usually 290-305 ]

Seems reasonable?

EDIT: Forgot I had my router plugged in and a fan [that was off]. So -15W?

danimal · Post by **danimal** » Sat Jul 18, 2009 11:49 am

aSASa wrote:Don't have a Kill-A-Watt, but my RS1500VA APC UPS claims [ Furmark + Prime95 ] that its using ( With monitor off ) 320W max. [ Usually 290-305 ]

furmark and prime95 running at the same time only adds 30w at the most??

Lockheed · Post by **Lockheed** » Sat Jul 18, 2009 2:47 pm

Post removed

aSASa · Post by **aSASa** » Sat Jul 18, 2009 2:57 pm

@ Danimal: Sorry worded it bad. I meant the usual max is 290-305, but there were some spikes of 320W.

@ Lockheed: And Channel Well is typically louder, correct?

Lockheed · Post by **Lockheed** » Sat Jul 18, 2009 3:05 pm

Post removed

DAve_M · Post by **DAve_M** » Sat Jul 18, 2009 3:36 pm

VX450 is very good. I have one. Needs a fan swap to be silent, but I got mine about 4 meters away and behind a door so I can't hear it.

aSASa · Post by **aSASa** » Sat Jul 18, 2009 8:29 pm

@ Lockheed. Yeah, I know the 520 + 620 are supposed to be very good, but the 1000W starts at a higher fan speed.

I was hoping Anandtech [ Or SPCR, of course ] would review the HX850, because I would actually have an idea on how loud it is, then.. but, so far, neither have.

@ DAve_M: I suppose a fan replacement couldn't be that hard.. but I really don't want to risk screwing up and ruining the warranty. There must be another way - ? [ Fans on the exhaust, maybe? ]

Thanks again!