New Quickie Fan Comparison...

Edward Ng · Post by **Edward Ng** » Tue Sep 21, 2004 2:38 pm

I will be doing a small, "quickie," fan comparison soon and posting it right here, since it will take time for Mike to to his real-deal tests on his truckload of samples. I have the following samples to test:

Four Sunon 80mm MagLev fans

Five Enermax (by Globe) 80mm thermal fans

They will be tested against:

Seven Panaflo 80L1A fans, three Chinaflo and four Japanaflo.

How the tests will be done:

All fans will be broken in for a minimum of 48 hours at 12volts. Should you guys request it, I can perform a longer break-in period; it just means a longer delay before the comparison is done and written up.

All testing will be done with no equipment on in the room, at the whee hours of the night/morning, to ensure optimal ambient testing noise level. If I can't hear Sigma One, from any position within the room, before beginning the listening tests (the machine will be shut down during the test), then testing will be postponed.

The only thing on will be my ceiling lamp and the power supply to power the fans. The power supply is a modified PSU for acoustic testing purposes only; there are no fans in this PSU.

Any questions, comments or suggestions?

-Ed

roo · Post by **roo** » Tue Sep 21, 2004 2:51 pm

cool, sounds interesting good luck

tay · Post by **tay** » Tue Sep 21, 2004 6:02 pm

How do you plan on mounting the fans? Might be an interesting consideration when testing. Try it in a case versus not.

Edward Ng · Post by **Edward Ng** » Tue Sep 21, 2004 6:05 pm

Was going to just test them in my hand or sitting on foam; I suppose I can also try mounting them onto the Hyper 6 and testing it that way, sitting on foam.

That sound like a good idea?

Rory B. · Post by **Rory B.** » Wed Sep 22, 2004 11:22 am

come on, pictures!

Edward Ng · Post by **Edward Ng** » Wed Sep 22, 2004 11:37 am

In due time, my friend...

The Globe/Enermax fans aren't even in my hands yet; they are supposed to ship in today, however. Might be waiting for me when I get home.

The MagLevs have been breaking in since last night; will let them go 'til tomorrow night before switching over to the Enermax/Globes for 48 hours.

I also want to run all my Panaflos for a minimum of 48 hours to be sure they're all broken in properly, so don't hold your breath. I could shoot some preliminary photos, though...

burcakb · Post by **burcakb** » Wed Sep 22, 2004 11:54 am

How about supplying some specs to keep us busy

Are those Enermaxs ball bearing mediumflow globes?

If yes, it might be a better idea to compare them to the M1A instead of L1A.

Edward Ng · Post by **Edward Ng** » Wed Sep 22, 2004 12:03 pm

Ordered these.

I'm going to be comparing more on an overall sound signature/characteristics level, rather than straight volume. A fan that makes 30dBA of high frequency squeeling is going to be much more annoying than a fan making 36dBA of low frequency rumble (which may actually be soothing

). Anyway, I don't have an exact measure of sound pressure level even if I wanted; the only real test is for me to move farther away and see how well the sound carries, which I plan to do anyway.

From my listening exploits in the past, 92mm M1A's sound signature is extremely similar to my 92mm L1A's, except for volume (not counting sample variance/consistency-related differences, namely, "sh sh sh sh"). Pitch varies only with speed, and I will also be doing a supplemental test, afterwards, recording the spin speed of each fan at 5, 7 and 12 Volts (I'm assuming the Enermaxes and the Sunons all report spin rate data; they have the third wire).

I don't have any 80mm M1As on me, either.

-Ed

acaurora · Post by **acaurora** » Wed Sep 22, 2004 2:52 pm

ROFL, look at the pic for that fan. It's missing a blade! ROFL...

Didn't really have a great experience with my Enermax 120mm fan with the chrome bling bling grille. It... kinda... well... how should we put this...

SUCKS.

Edward Ng · Post by **Edward Ng** » Wed Sep 22, 2004 4:19 pm

Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you: The RAIF

Redundant Array of Independent Fans

This is only for break-in, of course. There are, from left to right order, three 120mm Globes, four 80mm Sunon MagLev and then five 80mm Enermax thermal fans. The three Globes are stock, and four of the Enermax fans are stock as well. The fifth Enermax has had its thermistor clipped and the remaining leads shorted together. They are all receiving 12volts. The blades don't appear to be moving in the photo just because of the nature of Full-Auto on my camera.

-Ed

jabba · Post by **jabba** » Wed Sep 22, 2004 4:27 pm

Ed ... do you know where one could pick up 92mm Globe made fans, but not Acoustifan?

Edward Ng · Post by **Edward Ng** » Wed Sep 22, 2004 4:31 pm

Unfortunately, this one at Jab-Tech is the only one I can think of for the time being, and I have not yet had any hands-on experience with one to know how well it works.

-Ed

jabba · Post by **jabba** » Wed Sep 22, 2004 4:34 pm

Edward Ng wrote:Unfortunately, this one at Jab-Tech is the only one I can think of for the time being, and I have not yet had any hands-on experience with one to know how well it works.

Unfortunately 92mm is the odd child in the fan family ... I have a 92mm Enermax fan and it sucks, but I can not be certain it is Globe, and is more than a year old.

Edward Ng · Post by **Edward Ng** » Wed Sep 22, 2004 4:39 pm

Thanks; I'll keep this in mind for future fan sample quests...

jabba · Post by **jabba** » Wed Sep 22, 2004 4:50 pm

The specs on your 80mm Enermax/Globe fans indicate they are the medium speed variety (~2500 RPM Max, 6v-13.8v)

The specs on the 92mm Enermax/Globe fans @ jab-tech indicate they are also the medium speed variety (2500 RPM Max, 6v-13.8v).

I believe however that your 120mm Globe Fans are 2000RPM 6v-13.8v Low Speed Variety. There is a medium speed variety of 120mm Globe Fan.

I can not be certain this Enermax is the low or medium speed variety, but ... it is ~2300RPM which indicates it could be medium speed (2400 RPM):
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDe ... 012&depa=0

Having the medium speed variety and undevolting them down would make them equivalent to the low speed variety, in theory. The question is ... does that simple logic hold at all?

Edit: All the acoustifan 80mm, 92mm and 120mm sold at Siliconacoustics are low speed variety.

Edward Ng · Post by **Edward Ng** » Wed Sep 22, 2004 5:03 pm

Well, let's assume that the theory doesn't hold true, anyway...

If, in my testing, I find these fans to be of satisfactory low noise when undervolted, does it matter all that much? I'm not here so much to look for a cheap AF80CT so much as I am here to find a fan that's as quiet, if not better, than AF80CT, for the price of an 80L1A, or cheaper.

Here's hoping these really cheap Enermax 80s are good when undervolted.

The Sunons also have some hope to them, being a new technology. Luckily, the new technology didn't translate directly to high pricing. If we can find a fan that's as good as an AF80CT, not necessarily identical, but subjectively as good, or maybe better (at least when undervolted), for the price of a Panaflo 80L1A, or cheaper, then we're all better for it, I'd think.

It just so happens that I consider the 80L1A as the benchmark to go by. It is unfortunate that I have only one AF80CT on hand that I can compare to my other 80mm samples. It's true that I have two AF80CTs, but one is relatively permanently acting as the replacement fan in one of my PSUs, and I honestly don't feel like pulling out my PSU, ripping it apart and undoing the (difficult) job of inserting bare leads into the plug to get it out for testing. The other piece acting as exhaust for my silent rig is much easier to get to.

Luckily I have seven 80L1As just sitting here, waiting to be put through their paces against the encumbents.

-Ed

jabba · Post by **jabba** » Wed Sep 22, 2004 5:18 pm

Edward Ng wrote:Well, let's assume that the theory doesn't hold true, anyway...

If, in my testing, I find these fans to be of satisfactory low noise when undervolted, does it matter all that much? I'm not here so much to look for a cheap AF80CT so much as I am here to find a fan that's as quiet, if not better, than AF80CT, for the price of an 80L1A, or cheaper.

Yes ... I have to agree with you on that point. My reason for bringing up medium vs low speed had more to do with vendors and where to buy these fandangled fans you are testing, i.e. "am I buying the right thing?". But I think you're doing a good favor for all of us by comparing all these fans. They are the biggest variable so far for me, at least

.

Tibors · Post by **Tibors** » Wed Sep 22, 2004 8:28 pm

Edward Ng wrote:Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you: The RAIF
[...]

Sorry to be nitpicking. But the way you have put the fans they are blowing in series. So they are not independend

You should have put them in parallel.

Don't take this too serious.

Edward Ng · Post by **Edward Ng** » Wed Sep 22, 2004 8:31 pm

burcakb · Post by **burcakb** » Wed Sep 22, 2004 10:24 pm

I have several sleeve bearing mediumflow globe fans. I love them but can tell you outright that they're not as quiet as an acousti or an L1A. They are, however, very quiet for the flow, the noise is smooth, non bothering and it undervolts very nicely. The blades are nicely balanced, no clicking at any voltage.

I've come across several ball bearing versions of globes though (different sizes so this may not be a general rule) and I was shocked to find them so very noisy with lots of vibration.

I'm out hunting for more sleeve globe Ms. These fans were used in the very popular AOpen H600 case. AOpen switched to Yate Loons now and I'm trying to convince old owners to give up their fans for noisier replacements. If I can find some, I'll send one so you can do a sleeve vs ball bearing comparison.

Edward Ng · Post by **Edward Ng** » Wed Sep 22, 2004 10:44 pm

Thanks!

The unfortunate thing is, even if we figured out a difference between the ball and sleeve bearing models, can we effectively locate the specific model we desire?

Unfortunately, as it is, the Sunon MagLevs are on the difficult side to find (I had to order my samples from a store in Canada; not particularly far, but just not a place I normally look). The Enermaxes I picked were straight from NewEgg, and really cheap, so that's a good thing. If they don't perform well, at least I didn't invest too much into it to begin with.

-Ed

tay · Post by **tay** » Thu Sep 23, 2004 7:45 am

Ed, I like the idea of hardmounting on a HS (as you suggested upthread) rather than a case even better. Most people figure out soft mounts for cases very easily but HS soft mounting is a bit of a chore. Sounds like a good idea to me since it might tell you more about the noise characteristics. Good luck!

Edward Ng · Post by **Edward Ng** » Thu Sep 23, 2004 9:02 am

I also happen to consider the Hyper 6 to be an almost worst-case scenario. The thing is known for bringing out the worst in fan vibration-related noise.

wim · Post by **wim** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 11:33 pm

..was this project orphaned?

frankgehry · Post by **frankgehry** » Fri Feb 04, 2005 12:44 am

Ed,

Are you going to make recordings? What exactly is the testing procedure? Will you use the same recording equipment that mike uses or will this be a more subjective evaluation without complicated test equipment. It would be nice if you could define some subjective decriptive terms other that this fan sucks. Do you have a clear fan so you can put to rest the idea that clear fans sound worse than black or orange fans. I believe mike can hear a difference and maybe someone can after your hearing is acute enough to sort out the buzzing and wind noise.

Anyway, I think you should develop a rather simple testing method that can be repeated by spcr members. That way members can send in sound files. You would need to have some kind of reference sound like a tone generator as a reference or maybe just an L1. I'm sure you are familiar with the sound library at www.sidewindercomputers.com.
The Listening Room. Right now there are a lot of sound files scattered throughout the site, but they need to be in one place like they are in the listening room. You could do that for power supplies too. I don't know how we would actually make the recordings, but all the sounds need to be in one place. The Listening Room is fantastic, but its out of date. Spcr should have something like that. I don't think you really need the all the detail that mike puts into the reviews to have something worthwhile. - FG

EDIT: Oh. I thought this was a new thread. If anyone would be interested in making a library of fan and psu sounds to be included in an easily accessible library keep this thread going and add your ideas.

Edward Ng · Post by **Edward Ng** » Fri Feb 04, 2005 3:04 am

wim: Yes, unfortunately I can no longer pull off a test of this sort, due to the time schedule and constraints of my new job--the hours of the day when ambient level is under 20dBA are not within reach for me except Friday and Saturday nights and this project requires multiple consecutive nights in a row for me to manage proper listening test comparisons. If I test one fan Saturday night and then don't test the next fan until the following Friday night, by that time the memory of the previous fan's signature is no longer sufficiently fresh in my mind for me to be 100% positive of direct comparison if the fans are very close in acoustic performance.

frankgehry: Sorry, even if I did plan to do it, the best I could do is subjective comparisons. I don't have the level of recording equipment as Mike does, or even an anemometer to measure air flow of the fans. This thread was started long ago when I had much more spare time.

-Ed

wim · Post by **wim** » Sat Feb 05, 2005 3:06 am

ah well, shame, this sounded like it would be interesting
just as an anecdotal note, how were those magnetic bearings anyway..anything worth a mention?

Edward Ng · Post by **Edward Ng** » Sat Feb 05, 2005 6:48 am

wim wrote:ah well, shame, this sounded like it would be interesting
just as an anecdotal note, how were those magnetic bearings anyway..anything worth a mention?

Actually, part of the reason why I so willingly dumped this test all together was because in preliminary listening, none of the fans were as good as Panaflo L1A, anyway.

In that case, I didn't feel a need to go into gory details.

-Ed

New Quickie Fan Comparison...

New Quickie Fan Comparison...

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