another project MikeC is involved w/ Antec: A HTPC

dago · Post by **dago** » Sun Dec 04, 2005 5:21 am

From another topic :

MikeC wrote: BTW, there is another project I am involved in w/ Antec: A HTPC case. enuf said.

You really think that's enough, eh ?

Ok, from your other post, we know it'll be like a standard HiFi component, like the silverstone, and not a cube like the Aria. Chances are high that the HDD will be suspended (no ?), but the rest ? any dates ?

Here's my wishlist (I'm sure others will follow) :
1. External PSU
2. High enough to accomodate "high towers" heatsinks (Scythe, Aerocool, ...)
3. Heatpiping possibilities

It also raise the question of making test of competing products (e.g. mCubed HFX) while consulting for antec ...

waps · Post by **waps** » Sun Dec 04, 2005 5:52 am

I will be happy with enough place for a hdd in a smartdrive/Scythe Silentbox , i think thats someting most HTPC cases misses. (5¼" drive places in stad of 3½")

Maarten

cAPSLOCK · Post by **cAPSLOCK** » Sun Dec 04, 2005 6:43 am

dago wrote: Here's my wishlist (I'm sure others will follow) :
1. External PSU

It all depends on how much gear you have under/around your tv/hifi, but for me the cable mess is incredible, and internal PSU would be preferable, but I see the reason for an external PSU: silence, so how about putting an external PSU inside the PC

dago · Post by **dago** » Sun Dec 04, 2005 7:04 am

cAPSLOCK wrote:
dago wrote: Here's my wishlist (I'm sure others will follow) :
1. External PSU
It all depends on how much gear you have under/around your tv/hifi, but for me the cable mess is incredible, and internal PSU would be preferable,

Indeed, but another advantage of the brick is the ability to put this external source of heat outside of your furniture.

I also obviously have a incredible cable mess, but it's not visible, and I barely touch it once a year.

cAPSLOCK · Post by **cAPSLOCK** » Sun Dec 04, 2005 7:21 am

dago wrote: Indeed, but another advantage of the brick is the ability to put this external source of heat outside of your furniture.

I guess so, in the future, if Intel get's their vision of the digital home, furniture will have to be air conditioned like server racks

Al · Post by Al » Sun Dec 04, 2005 7:47 am

I wonder if your first two wishlist items aren't slightly contradictory? Presumably any case which is tall enough for a tower heatsink will also have bucketloads of space for a PSU - I realise that you might want to separate this for the sake of heat but then you'd be left with an enormous echoing cavern of a case, which doesn't seem terribly sensible to me.

Plus, unless it's a barebones system with a specially designed motherboard (which I doubt), then the PSU would need to have all the standard ATX connectors and voltages available, something which most external power supplies are lacking. I know Zalman was designing an ATX compliant external fanless PSU, but didn't they can it for some reason?

How do you envisage heatpipes being used? Like the mCubed HFX? Could be great, but the HFX is huge...

moritz · Post by **moritz** » Sun Dec 04, 2005 8:36 am

I'd rather have a custom-designed CPU heatsink than the ability to fit arbitrarily sized generic HSFs. A heatsink tailored to the case could hopefully outperform them at a smaller size while remaining silent. And since MikeC is involved, I bet the PSU will get some place where it's seperated from the system - most likely by using a passive external one. (Seperating it while still keeping it inside the case isn't really viable, I think.)

Krazy Kommando · Post by **Krazy Kommando** » Sun Dec 04, 2005 10:11 pm

i think itd be more likely to have a low output fanless internal PSU, suspended HDD's, possibly rubber mountings for the optical drives, plenty of space around CPU, and a 92mm intake and exhaust

-oh, and it'll be black

theyangster · Post by **theyangster** » Sun Dec 04, 2005 10:25 pm

we hope

Schroinx · Post by **Schroinx** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 3:14 am

Krazy Kommando wrote:i think itd be more likely to have a low output fanless internal PSU, suspended HDD's, possibly rubber mountings for the optical drives, plenty of space around CPU, and a 92mm intake and exhaust

-oh, and it'll be black

Yes, and be the size of a fridge

Well, I have been into the subject of HTPC's for a few years now, and one thing I realized is that there is as many whises for the perfect htpc as there is for a standard case, so to conclude something genreally is quite difficult.

However there is three things I believe is true for any htpc: 1st the obvious: It has to be fairly silent. The 2nd is that it has to look as a piece of audio/video gear, so no cheap plastic front bezels. 3rd, price, but you don't get everything for nothing. Quality has it price.

doudou · Post by **doudou** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 6:42 am

Ok, here is my guess:
- full height 'cause there are no satisfactory low profile vid card for a HTPC (HD encoding/decoding)
- external fanless PSU to make it smaller or
- internal PSU (like NEO HE) in a separate DVD/HDD chamber
- room to fit two 5"1/4 drives (one DVD burner and one 3.5"HDD enclosure) (you need 3.5" HDD for price and capacity)
- standard ATX borard as there are very few satisfactory µATX boards (undervolting and underclocking wise) or
- µATX board only if it makes it really smaller (no that's not obvious)
- room for laaaarge CPU HSF, with air duct
- Eventually, room for optional 2.5" HDD rack (just like the Shuttle case) for easy file transfer.

please · Post by **please** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 7:23 am

I'd like to see a single 120mm fan unit with clever ducting. It would use mATX mobos that use mobile CPUs for either passive or low-RPM 80mm fans. I think using 2.5"HDDs with enclosures. Fanless PSU but in the airflow ala P180

Thinking out of the box, what about using proprietary mobo and make one that has a detached CPU connection(like the ASUS CT-479) that can be wired to a separate chamber that is airtight from the rest of the system, but highly ventilated to the outside. Use mobile CPUs and low profile HSF like the LS Cable SHS-X500 heatsink/fan but with fan blowing out and a tight duct around the HSF like the Ducted Zalman 7000CU w/Countercurrent Flow Cooling
or an integrated fanless solution with heatpipes.

Anyone could make their own using the CT-479 and a 478-strand wire harness

Schroinx · Post by **Schroinx** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 1:39 am

As stated there is various requests for a silent HTPC case. Making a case with proprietary mobo is not gonna work, nor making one exclusively for P-M.

If the case had a proprietary mobo, which CPU should it be build for? And then one would have to trash the case with the next upgrade, and then we're not even considering that Antec is not a mobo manufacturer.

The reason is that one of a HTPC's mani advantages is it capability to scale a video signal and apply various filters. This also goes for the audio, as there is several attempts over at avsforum at making Digital Room Correction for 5.1/7.1 systems. Together with the actual decoding of a signal, as DivX/DVD and so on, this is quite CPU intensive tasks. These will gain significantly with dualcore cpus and 64bit. So the issue is a bit more complicated, as the pursuit should be of something where a cpu load of 75-90% will not sund like a jet engine.

Also not many have the possibility to store their mediafiles on a server, so the case must be able to hold a few drives.

I belive that in order to have a decent airflow in the case, a way to go would be to separate the case into 3 channels running from front to back. One zone for the add-in cards/hdds, one for the cpu, and one for psu/hdds, each cooled by a 80/120 fan placed on a wall and drawing in air from holes in the bottom-front. But that would have to be tested.

klankymen · Post by **klankymen** » Sun Dec 11, 2005 4:54 pm

well, i have high hopes of this case, for use as a media pc, with my hopes being something like:

3 or 4 rubber-grommet p180 style hdd mounts

well that's about it. for some reason µATX and more than 2 hdds are pretty much exclusive, so a µATX system like that would be nice.

and of course the usual spcr hopes of a single or dual 120mm fan. and judging by 120mm fan sizes the case would have to be (near) full hight, which is of course good for video cards.

doudou · Post by **doudou** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 3:30 am

Hi there,

A host of new cases will be released by Antec in 2006. Check this site out http://www.matbe.com/articles/lire/272/ ... s-en-2006/
Of particular interest: the Fusion, the HTPC case. See images on [/img]http://forum.overclockersonline.com/ind ... 63986b290c.

I think that's pretty good work: µATX, 3 thermal chambers design, Custom, 80Plus certified PSU etc.

Can't Wait for a review...

doudou · Post by **doudou** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 5:13 am

AMD zone has a hsot of images of all new Antec products in their CES gallery.
Click the link on Antec web site and browse and enjoy !

Hellspawn · Post by **Hellspawn** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 6:28 am

hope it turns out better than the 180 did.

Aris · Post by **Aris** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 7:51 am

hopefully its either micro-atx or mini-itx.

built in dc/dc atx adapter with external passive ac/dc converter would be nice, like alot of the mini-itx cases are like now.

have an option to suspend 1 drive, or hard mount 2. or somthin like that.

slim optical drive bay would be nice to keep the form factor small.

steel panels to keep vibration down.

no fans smaller than 80mm.

doudou · Post by **doudou** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 8:05 am

Aris have you read the last three posts ??

The case design is freezed now, and it was shown at CES. Check out the links I gave before and you'll see.
Some of your wishes were not realised though (slim drive, suspension, external PSU). But I think that'll be a good case, though.

Aris · Post by **Aris** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 8:23 am

doudou wrote:Aris have you read the last three posts ??
The case design is freezed now, and it was shown at CES. Check out the links I gave before and you'll see.
Some of your wishes were not realised though (slim drive, suspension, external PSU). But I think that'll be a good case, though.

no i didnt read the whole thread, i didnt even read all of the first post. i dont really care if its been prevue'd or not. i never expected to get everything i wanted, i was just expressing my personal opinions on what i would want out of it.

stupid · Post by **stupid** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 8:39 am

I currently use the Antec Aria for my HTPC and would like to have something similar, but not another Aria. My main gripes with the Aria are the lack of airflow and the proprietary PSU.

What I want for my next HTPC case is the following:

1. m-ATX - Yes, I know a few people have stated they would prefer a full ATX motherboard, but I prefer to keep a small footprint. The drawback would be it isn't very expandable, but I won't need more than 2 PCI slots for a sound card and video capture card.

2. Standard PSU - I suppose my greatest fear with the Aria is if I need to replace the PSU. Since it is proprietary I know it'll cost an arm and leg to replace it. But more imporatantly I want to be able to pick and choose what PSU I want to use. If and when my PSU die I'll simply get a different case, most likely a Silverstone.

3. Better Airflow - I think just having a rear 80mm should be good enough along with the fan in the PSU. I would settle for a 60mm rear fan if the 80mm is too big. But I also want the front to have a meshed openning to allow air to be pulled into the case. The meshed openning should have a panel so that it can be covered for those people who are concerned about noise leaking out. There should be a washable filter that can be removed without openning the case. Consider it like a removeable faceplate that can be easily popped in and out. Think a 3" by 1" openning is more than good enough for air to be drawn in.

4. No Fans Included - I would prefer to purchase my own 60mm or 80mm fan.

5. Laminated Panels - I like the idea of laminated panels in the current Aria. Basically a metal core sandwiched in between plastic. I think using slightly thicker steel instead of aluminum would help muffle some of the noise leakage. Steel will make the case a little heavier, but it shouldn't be too bad. The top panel should also be the laminated steel/plastic as opposed to just a plastic panel in the current case.

6. 2.5" Hard Drive Adaptors - Okay, I admit I may be asking for a bit too much here, but I would like to have an included kit that would allow me to install a notebook hard drive into a 3.5" HD slot. Using notebook hard drives may be a bit expensive and unorthodox for the typical user, but they will cut down on heat and noise. While the HD cage in the Aria can be a minor pain, I like it because I can drop in 3 hard drives.

That's all I can come up with for now.

Post by **Rusty075** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 9:00 am

Stupid, of your list of 6, the new Fusion cases do 4.

1. mATX mobo
2. Standard ATX PSU.
3. Much better airflow
4. It will ship with a pair of the Tri-cool 120mm's.
5. Not laminated, but they are thicker-than-standard steel.
6. Your're on your own there. The drives are decoupled, but you'll need to spring for your own $1.99 2.5-3.5" mounting rails.

mrzed · Post by **mrzed** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 9:39 am

Another plug for mATX HTPC case here. I don't understand all the clamouring for a full ATX setup. All I can find are full ATX models with Full ATX PSU. I am currently putting together a HTPC, and I'm looking at building my own case because nothing out there that I can find meets my needs:

- mATX only
- mATX PSU (so I can use my SS200SFD instead)
- Full height expansion slots
- One each 5.25 and 3.5 external bays
- 80 or 92mm fans
- Looks halfway decent

I cannot for the life of me understand why this should be hard to find. I want the smallest possible case that will take standard components and offer decent cooling.

Aris · Post by **Aris** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 10:12 am

mrzed wrote:I cannot for the life of me understand why this should be hard to find. I want the smallest possible case that will take standard components and offer decent cooling.

ive found that almost every manufacturer fracks up the decent cooling aspect. ive just gotten used to the fact that i have to mod every new case i get for better ventalation.

as far as the "smallest possible case that will take standard components" is concerned. i'm in the same boat. and this is what i'm going with:

Casetronic C138

only difference is i'm getting the black version with the 120w psu. but logicsupply has the best pictures of the actuall enclosure. i'm modding an 80mm fan intake into the front of the case and taking out the crappy 40mm fan in the back.

stupid · Post by **stupid** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 12:02 pm

Aris wrote: as far as the "smallest possible case that will take standard components" is concerned. i'm in the same boat. and this is what i'm going with:

Casetronic C138

only difference is i'm getting the black version with the 120w psu. but logicsupply has the best pictures of the actuall enclosure. i'm modding an 80mm fan intake into the front of the case and taking out the crappy 40mm fan in the back.

Just out of curiosity, what will you do with it? The purpose of my HTPC is purely for multimedia purposes. Okay, I did play Morrowind and Halo on it early last year. Basically I rip my DVDs and convert them to DivX files and also convert my music to OGG files. I also use it to record TV programs. For me I'm looking for a tenuous balance between Power/Silence and not to mention low heat.

The HTPC is hooked up to the TV for my viewing pleasure, and a 5.1 surround sound system for my listening pleasure. Gaming is primarily done on my other rig that will finally be replaced after 3 years of service in the near future.

derekva · Post by **derekva** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 1:51 pm

Until you have to cram all the HTPC crapola into the chassis. I've been doing HTPCs for a while (I was a beta tester for the original version of XP Media Center), and the best case I've found hands-down (that's not in the insanity-level of price) is the OrigenAE x11 http://www.pcalchemy.com/product_info.p ... htpc-cases. It holds a standard ATX board but has a reduced footprint since they turn the standard ATX power supply on its side. It has an 80mm fan (not 92mm or 120mm but we're dealing with a small case) semi-suspended (e.g. grommets like Antec) hard drives, and a 'hi-fi' look, especially if you get the VFD/IR receiver.

If I had scads of money, then I'd most likely go with something like the Hush system (e.g. passive cooling via massive heatsinks), but since I'm a married schlub with two kids and a mortgage, the x11 was more than sufficient.

If Antec could do something similar, but with thicker / damped panels (the x11 is aluminum) a bigger chassis fan and even better drive suspension that looks as good as the x11, I'd give it a second look.

-Derek

Aris · Post by **Aris** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 2:39 pm

stupid wrote:Just out of curiosity, what will you do with it?

it will be my primary gamming rig

Pentium-M 1.73ghz, Geforce 7600 (when its released) 6600gt for now, 2gb ddr2 533mhz ram.

i also value performance and silence above all else, and i believe i'll have a good balance of both with this system. it will only have the 1 80mm fan, which will be a panaflo L1A.

bomba · Post by **bomba** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 9:41 pm

derekva wrote:Until you have to cram all the HTPC crapola into the chassis. I've been doing HTPCs for a while (I was a beta tester for the original version of XP Media Center), and the best case I've found hands-down (that's not in the insanity-level of price) is the OrigenAE x11 http://www.pcalchemy.com/product_info.p ... htpc-cases. It holds a standard ATX board but has a reduced footprint since they turn the standard ATX power supply on its side. It has an 80mm fan (not 92mm or 120mm but we're dealing with a small case) semi-suspended (e.g. grommets like Antec) hard drives, and a 'hi-fi' look, especially if you get the VFD/IR receiver.

If I had scads of money, then I'd most likely go with something like the Hush system (e.g. passive cooling via massive heatsinks), but since I'm a married schlub with two kids and a mortgage, the x11 was more than sufficient.

If Antec could do something similar, but with thicker / damped panels (the x11 is aluminum) a bigger chassis fan and even better drive suspension that looks as good as the x11, I'd give it a second look.

-Derek

I think the X11 is a great HTPC case as well, note that the X11 I received recently is a version 2 with daul 80mm rear fans, rubber grommeted, sideways hard drive cage with a bottom mounted 80mm intake beneath the HDD cage.

goink · Post by **goink** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 6:50 am

Just wondering what size the case is going to be. Too many of the silverstone mATX cases are just as big as normal ATX cases... Hopefully it will be a little bit smaller, at least in depth.

another project MikeC is involved w/ Antec: A HTPC

another project MikeC is involved w/ Antec: A HTPC

Re: another project MikeC is involved w/ Antec: A HTPC

Re: another project MikeC is involved w/ Antec: A HTPC

Re: another project MikeC is involved w/ Antec: A HTPC

mATX is nice...

Re: mATX is nice...

Anyone know approximate size ?