HD3450 or HD2400pro?

kike_1974 · Post by **kike_1974** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 8:24 am

I'm looking into building a new server PC and I'm looking for a low power system, but it is often used by my wife for some multmedia playing, web surfing, and some office work (and some light gaming with "the sims").

Currently I'm considering a E2160 in a GA-EP35 or GA-P35, and I'd like to complete the system with a low power consumption video card.

I'm considering HD3450 and HD2400pro. I could get them for similar prices (38â‚¬ vs 31â‚¬), so I do not consider the price for my decision.

Taking into account only power consumption/performance, which one do you think is my best option? In case of doubt, lower consumption takes preference over performance for me.

thejamppa · Post by **thejamppa** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 11:06 am

They're most likely similar performancing cards, but HD 3450 has made with smaller processing system and has power play so its consumption should be smaller than HD 2400 pro's although there wouldn't be too much of differences between the two cards.

As you can see, I use HD 3450 in my primary system. I am actually surprised how good it was for the price.

I even can play older games like first serious sam without lag, which was my first initial fear due 64-bit interface but Serious Sam, albeit FPS is old game so that wouldn't brought too much problems.

I do not know how much it affects that my card is sapphire's HD 3450 with Hypermemory ability ( 256mb own DDR2 and up to 1GB in Vista 64-bit with 2GB and upto 512mb memory in 32-bit system or with system Less than 2GB ram )

My choice also was between HD 2400 pro and HD 3450. But newer tech with smaller manufacturing tech and Ati Power Play tipped the scale for HD 3450 in my case.

BillyBuerger · Post by **BillyBuerger** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 11:10 am

I've just picked up both of these cards myself recently. The 2400Pro for some office PCs to get dual monitors for our users. And the 3450 for my HTPC at home. Some reviews I saw seemed to suggest the 3450 uses less power at idle if not load too. Neither seem to get very hot. The 3450 seems much cooler than the nVidia 6200 it replaced. The 2400 is a gigabyte with a bigger heatsink than the sapphire 3450. But I'm thinking of getting an Antec NSK1480 case for my HTPC at some point which is a low profile case. Which the sapphire 3450 is. Although the heat sink may possibly make it a bit too tall.

I'd be happy with either, but think the 3450 was the better choice.

jessekopelman · Post by **jessekopelman** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 12:35 pm

For the type of gaming you're describing, an IGP would be adequate. If you are dead set on buying a MB without an IGP, I'd get the HD3450 as it has a theoretically longer useful life. Its much better HD video acceleration means that it could be better reused if you ever want to build an HTPC. On the other hand, there is the school of thought that these parts are so quickly obsoleted (within a year usually) that you should get the absolute cheapest that will do the job today and not worry about future reuse.

kike_1974 · Post by **kike_1974** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 12:43 pm

An IGP would be enough, but I prefer to go with intel and I don't see many intel boards with IGP and DVI output.

I've seen the asus boards, but they don't seem to have good undervolting options (I've read that you can't set vcore below 1.1V in BIOS).

That is why I'm looking for a discrete card with DVI output. And I think that it will be a bit better for light gaming.

But if you know of some good motherboard with good undervolting options and dvi output then it would be perfect too

jessekopelman · Post by **jessekopelman** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 2:00 pm

kike_1974 wrote:An IGP would be enough, but I prefer to go with intel and I don't see many intel boards with IGP and DVI output.

I've seen the asus boards, but they don't seem to have good undervolting options (I've read that you can't set vcore below 1.1V in BIOS).

That is why I'm looking for a discrete card with DVI output. And I think that it will be a bit better for light gaming.

But if you know of some good motherboard with good undervolting options and dvi output then it would be perfect too

Two options:

1) Buy what is known as an ADD2 or SVDO card. This will go in the PCIe X16 slot and give you a DVI output. They cost about $10-15 on eBay. The only big caveat is that they mysteriously fail to work with certain motherboards.

2) Buy a motherboard with a Nvidia 7100 series IGP. I believe Gigabyte makes one such that has good undervolting options. These MB are also relatively low priced. The only downside is that there are only two RAM slots and no support for dual channel configuration. Given that you are building a low end configuration, I wouldn't think either of those aspects would be a real problem.

I'd also note that unless you are going to use a PicoPSU style setup, the ability to set vCore below 1.1V may be completely useless. Once you get system consumption below 60W DC, you are going to start seeming diminishing returns due to the efficiency curve of your PSU.

Finally, an IGP is not going to save you much over a HD3450 -- maybe 7W at best. Still, it seems unlikely that undervolting beyond what can be accomplished through RMClock or CrystalCPUID on any MB is going to do much better than that either . . . Hard to really argue any particular approach here, as one is beset by diminishing returns all around. I'm just throwing out options.

smilingcrow · Post by **smilingcrow** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 2:13 pm

I under-volted an E2140 in a Gigabyte G33M-S2 and saved 4W at idle; this is comparing BIOS v RMClock.
An Asus HD 2400 Pro 256MB in the same system added 7.5W at idle.
So 48.5W at idle with BIOS/IGP versus 60W for RMClock/HD 2400.

Note: I have an ADD2 DVI card for sale and it works fine in Gigabyte G33 chipsets boards; Iâ€™ve tried two. Send me a PM if you're interested.

Lensman · Post by **Lensman** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 7:43 pm

The new Intel G35 chipset got delayed a few months, but motherboards using that chipset should start appearing in-channel very soon. Here's a review of an Asus G35 based MB.

I dunno what your timeline is and whether you're interested in Blu-Ray playback, but the next generation G45 boards are supposed to decode the various Blu-Ray codecs using the IGP. The G35 board uses the CPU heavily, I think. If you are interested in offloading the CPU for this decoding, you might also take a look at RS780 based motherboards for AMD CPUs.

jessekopelman · Post by **jessekopelman** » Fri Feb 29, 2008 4:01 pm

smilingcrow wrote:I under-volted an E2140 in a Gigabyte G33M-S2 and saved 4W at idle; this is comparing BIOS v RMClock.
An Asus HD 2400 Pro 256MB in the same system added 7.5W at idle.
So 48.5W at idle with BIOS/IGP versus 60W for RMClock/HD 2400.

But what PSU did you use? Something tells me it was a low peak wattage 80+ or a PicoPSU type, for those kind of results.

ntavlas · Post by **ntavlas** » Fri Feb 29, 2008 5:43 pm

And Athlon BE on an RS780 sounds like a good idea. Both cpu`s are good, but the amd chipset is the better suited for your needs.
The biggest power savings will come from the pico psu, if it`s not possible, the lowest rated seasonic available could be the next option.

smilingcrow · Post by **smilingcrow** » Sat Mar 01, 2008 12:15 am

jessekopelman wrote:
smilingcrow wrote:I under-volted an E2140 in a Gigabyte G33M-S2 and saved 4W at idle; this is comparing BIOS v RMClock.
An Asus HD 2400 Pro 256MB in the same system added 7.5W at idle.
So 48.5W at idle with BIOS/IGP versus 60W for RMClock/HD 2400.
But what PSU did you use? Something tells me it was a low peak wattage 80+ or a PicoPSU type, for those kind of results.

It was using a Silverstone ST30NF (300W Fanless) which isnâ€™t particularly efficient at low loads. A PicoPSU manages much lower; Iâ€™ve compared the two just not on that particular system.

kike_1974 · Post by **kike_1974** » Tue Mar 04, 2008 12:48 pm

Lensman wrote:The new Intel G35 chipset got delayed a few months, but motherboards using that chipset should start appearing in-channel very soon. Here's a review of an Asus G35 based MB.

I dunno what your timeline is and whether you're interested in Blu-Ray playback, but the next generation G45 boards are supposed to decode the various Blu-Ray codecs using the IGP. The G35 board uses the CPU heavily, I think. If you are interested in offloading the CPU for this decoding, you might also take a look at RS780 based motherboards for AMD CPUs.

But do G35 chipset based boards have DVI output?

The main drawback of intel boards is that they don't usually include DVI output, and I don't like to depend on addon cards.

I find more AMD based boards with this feature. But this time I prefer to go with intel for personal reasons.

I'm not in a hurry to get this system, as I have temporary solved a small problem with the system it is going to replace. But I'd like to upgrade it anyway.

By the way, the old system is an Asus A8n-VM CSM with an X2 4200+ toledo, which is a source of continuous problems. I know it is not an outdated system, but I hate this system... I've spent too many hours solving problems. It is not worth it.

jessekopelman · Post by **jessekopelman** » Tue Mar 04, 2008 1:43 pm

kike_1974 wrote: But do G35 chipset based boards have DVI output?

The only G35 board with wide availability that I know of is the Asus P5E-VM HDMI. As the name would indicate, this board actually has an HDMI output (and a D-Sub, but no vanilla DVI). Happily, it comes with a HDMI to DVI adapter. The GMA X3500 IGP is by far the most powerful Intel has ever offered and is somewhat competitive with Nvidia 70xx/71xx and AMD RS690, but not really with the Nvidia 8200/8300 and AMD RS780. This board is relatively expensive (albeit feature packed), so if one is patient and desirous of running an Intel CPU, it might be best to wait a few months and see what the Nvidia 8300 boards look like. There should also be more choices of G35 by then too. Of course, there should also be boards based on Intel's G4x chipset (with the GMA X4500), before the end of the year . . .

kike_1974 · Post by **kike_1974** » Wed Mar 05, 2008 5:45 am

My XFX 7900GT in my gaming rig died and now it is in the RMA process. It is still under warranty, but the replacement or repaired card will not arrive here in at least 2 months...

Now I'm gonna buy a graphics card to use it temporarily in my gaming system, and later on it will go to the server system when I upgrade it. So I'm not so interested in IGPs anymore and I'm going to buy a low end graphics card to kill two birds with one stone.

So back on topic... 2400pro or HD3450?