fanless or at least very quiet PC

[jaganath]

Efficiency? Is this website called EPCR? Efficiency Personal Computer Review or is this all about Silence? I thought the priority was #1 silence above all things.

With PSU's, usually efficiency and silence are closely intertwined; higher efficiency = less heat = slower fans = less noise.

PS. your post would have been a lot more concise without the sarcasm and sniping. Why not just say "I have the Nexus, and it works great!".

[MikeC]

Read: Nexus has updated their PSU's

That's if you believe connectors are the only things that need to be changed in order for a PSU to be "updated". AFAIK, the guts of the models are the same.

Efficiency? Is this website called EPCR? Efficiency Personal Computer Review or is this all about Silence?

Power efficiency is quickly becoming a primary goal for the entire PC industry. Quoting directly from the front page: Silent PC Review is dedicated to reviews, news and information about quiet, low noise, and/or silent computers and components as well as their energy efficiency and thermal performance. Efficiency has been a prime performance criteria for PSU reviews here for years. We've certainly been measuring it all along. It is also a standard industry spec: Intel's current ATX12V spec recommends 80% efficiency at typical load.

Finally, it should be obvious that I don't recommend these PSUs not because they won't work, but because there are better choices.

Perhaps this will soothe your raised hackles, eckre.

[paapaa]

Efficiency? Is this website called EPCR? Efficiency Personal Computer Review or is this all about Silence? I thought the priority was #1 silence above all things. As long as my computer works, and it works perfect, flawlessly and entirely stable with the latest hardware, and is very very very quiet, I'm sorry but I don't care a rats-arse about a 10% efficiency loss in a PSU vs some other brand which costs twice as much. It would take years to pay for itself, if you're whining about electricity costs.

Are you trying to troll?

Efficiency is very important because basically all the input power is eventually turned into heat. Higher efficiency means:

- less generated heat in PSU -> less noise from PSU fan(s)
- less heat into case (as PSU air/heat is not 100% isolated) -> less noise from CPU/case fans -> less heat feedback into PSU again -> etc..
- less heat into case -> HDs last longer
- less power consumption -> environmental issues, electric bill issues

And with P180 you can put a more efficient (like Seasonic S12) PSU into a well isolated section. This isolation (fresh intake air) reduces the fan noise even more. It is, however, true that Nexus costs slightly less. With more money you get quieter computer.

Just compare the SPCR reviews of S12-430 and Nexus 4090. Seasonic is quieter in all load levels. S12 also has better efficiency in all load levels.

[eckre]

Bottom Line:

The guy wanted a "silent "not quiet" system" - his words. I can understand. I have well over $10,000 in stereo equiptment, I love my music and when I listen to it, I want to hear the music, not some computer grinding or whirling away.

You go build a P180 SYSTEM (stock; with no case dampening) and a S12-430. for roughly the same cost. ($case 120 AR, PSU $80 + S&H = ~$220)

The build the identical SYSTEM in a stock Nexus case with 400 watt PSU. (170 + S&H)

You're telling me the P180/S12-430 SYSTEM is going to be quieter?

We don't buy power supplies and turn them on and listen, we buy them and put them into a CASE, parts that make a SYSTEM. Compare systems to systems, not parts to parts. Measure the noise levels of a PSU in a P180 and SYSTEM a Nexus SYSTEM. I bet the dampening makes it even quieter still. And we're dealing with things less than 17dB. How quiet is quiet -eh? The noise of a PSU isn't an issue. It's the rest of the parts.

I've had a P180 and silent Zalman PSU SYSTEM, and I'm telling you, the nexus SYSTEM wins hands down all the way. You got a CPU fan, case fan (maybe), PSU, VC fan (maybe), Northbridge fan (maybe) and HDD that make a system. It's in that case dampening, I'm just saying it's a bargin case, it works with the latest hardware, it's cheap and quiet. I don't see why people snub their nose at it, dig into the white papers, charts and graphs, instead of listening with their ears.

[a soggy waffle]

getting WD drive now
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6822135106

[IsaacKuo]

How quiet is quiet -eh? The noise of a PSU isn't an issue. It's the rest of the parts.

It's not so unusual on SPCR for the PSU to be the ONLY noisemaker in the system.

You got a CPU fan, case fan (maybe), PSU, VC fan (maybe), Northbridge fan (maybe) and HDD that make a system.

Here on SPCR, it's more like:

You've got a CPU fan (maybe), case fan (probably), PSU fan (probably), and HDD.

Video card fan? Rarely, and only on high performance gaming rigs. Northbridge fan? Never! You'll see the occasional Northbridge fan on a newbie rig, but it's the first thing to go.

[MikeC]

And we're dealing with things less than 17dB. How quiet is quiet -eh? The noise of a PSU isn't an issue. It's the rest of the parts.

The noise of a PSU very much an issue, and none of them are 17 dBA@1m. Certainly not the Nexus PSUs in actual use in real systems, marketing claims notwithstanding. Assuming a quiet HDD is reasonably dealt with, and the CPU is cooled with a hefty HS & very quiet fan, PSU fan ramp-up under load or higher ambient temp is the primary variable noise source in a quiet PC.

I doubt that damping material in the Breeze actually makes it measure much lower SPL. It might smooth out the noise subjectively by filtering out some of the higher frequencies, but the dBA drop is maybe a dBA or two at best. This is based on experimentation with many systems and cases with a variety of different damping materials.

In the end, all this is quibbling. If the system is not going to be worked hard or used in hot weather, chances are few of the PSUs in our recommended lists are going get noisy, in almost any case. Buyer votes with his $, achieves some level of "consumer satisfaction", sticks vociferously to own experience. We're all like that, right?

[a soggy waffle]

getting WD drive now
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6822135106

also, doesnt the p180 case look a little too open, look at all these holes for noise to escape from the back, not to mention the front as well


but, lets say i did get the p180 case, then its $130 for the case, $100 for the SeaSonic S12-430, and $13 for a nexus case fan (dont use the other two in case)
thats $243
and an optional $83 for AcoustiPack Deluxe v2 Noise Dampening Material if you think its worth it

this is not out of the question im just saying, will the difference be worth $100-$200?

[MikeC]

Well, I repeat myself: The P180 is overkill for the system you're planning. Among Antec cases, the P150 (or Solo) is just about ideal. I see newegg has it for $140 (w/NeoHE 430 PSU) but it can be found for as low as $123.

Since we're talking about getting a machine down to "silent" levels.....

Don't bother with damping materials until after you have built it. One of the things we find is that damping materials applied to an already very quiet system sometimes hurts the overall perceived noise. What happens is that the residual hum from HDDs and fan bearings is more masked by the broadband whoosh of even very low airflow. Apply damping, and some of this broadband noise diminishes and its masking effect fades. This tends to make the sound more tonal -- ie, the particular hum / buzz of individual bearings becomes more audible. If you record it and examine the waveform, the overall noise level is often lower, but the spikes are more visible. These spikes are usually fairly low in frequency -- certainly well below 500Hz. There's really no way to "damp" them out, as such materials are ineffective at low frequencies. (It's thickness, density and decoupling that matters in blocking noise at the lower frequencies.)

This is true of some of the systems we have in the lab, as well as my main system -- I've learned over the years to prefer a barely audible ffffffffffff over a quieter buzz (sort of like monitor hum) that can come from a damping-applied system.

All this is moot if your enviroment is not extremely quiet.

[stromgald]

getting WD drive now
also, doesnt the p180 case look a little too open, look at all these holes for noise to escape from the back, not to mention the front as well

Well, one way to think about it is not to focus on the noise but on the heat generated. Noise in a computer come from either components (hard drives, DVD-drives, and possibly solenoid coil whine) or cooling components (fans). By closing up a case, you can reduce the noise escaping, but you also keep the heat in. All computers will generate heat. If it gets too hot, your fans will have to spin faster to get the air out of the small hole that is made for that purpose. Fan noise is the loudest and most prominent noise for modern computers. With more holes, heat can escape more easily, and you can use slower moving fans to do the job. Or if it is open enough up top, you can just let normal convection (hot air rises, cold air falls) to take away some of the heat, but that usually only works with a large case and extremely low power systems (you'll have to sacrifice performance).

With a P150/SOLO case, you should be able to get fan noise down low enough so that hard drive/optical drive noise and possibly coil whine (not likely with new components) are the most prominent sounds from your system. To eliminate those and all fan noise to get a truly 'silent' system takes alot of work and money that most people don't want spend. That's usually the cutoff for what we like to recommend.

[a soggy waffle]

okay, heres a possible idea:
FSP Group (Fortron Source) ZEN FSP300-60GNF-R ATX 12V Version 2.0 300W Power Supply 100 - 240V - Retail - $99 after $30 MIR
Antec Solo Black/Silver Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - Retail - $90
nexus case fan - $13
thats a $203 option

[MikeC]

okay, heres a possible idea:
FSP Group (Fortron Source) ZEN FSP300-60GNF-R ATX 12V Version 2.0 300W Power Supply 100 - 240V - Retail - $99 after $30 MIR
Antec Solo Black/Silver Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - Retail - $90
nexus case fan - $13
thats a $203 option

With your modest heat components, it'll probably work well! Check our review of the Zen for comments about what it does to case airflow, though. It probably needs some thinking through and/or experimentation.

[stromgald]

okay, heres a possible idea:
FSP Group (Fortron Source) ZEN FSP300-60GNF-R ATX 12V Version 2.0 300W Power Supply 100 - 240V - Retail - $99 after $30 MIR
Antec Solo Black/Silver Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - Retail - $90
nexus case fan - $13
thats a $203 option

That could work, although it would be a bit toasty inside the case. I think you should consider getting 3 Nexus case fans, one intake, one exhaust and one on the CPU. You should read the review on the Fortron Zen if you haven't already. To save money, you could just undervolt a few Yate Loon D12SL fans ($4). They're the same as Nexus fans, but Nexus tweaked the electronics slightly (about the same as hooking a Zalman fanmate ~$3-4 to it). Going fanless on any desktop processor is difficult and risky even with almost 1 kg of alumimum fins strapped to the processor. Personally, I'd recommend getting a P150. It has a quiet 430W Antec PSU and you get the good airflow of a P150/SOLO case.

I'm not sure why you keep pushing for a fanless solution. Nexus fans are inaudible in most situations and very quiet even in the silence of a recording studio. If you truly want a fanless system, get a notebook setup (processor and hard drive) and put them in a regular desktop box with the biggest heatsinks you can find. Then, you might be able to cool it with just one Nexus fan.

[a soggy waffle]

also is 300w gonna be enough for stock e660 and 7600 gt?

[stromgald]

With your modest heat components, it'll probably work well! Check our review of the Zen for comments about what it does to case airflow, though. It probably needs some thinking through and/or experimentation.

Doh, MikeC beat me to it.

And yes 300W is enough for a 7600GT. Most computers with 1 graphics card rarely draw even 200W.

[a soggy waffle]

and is the nexus the quietest 120mm out there, theres a fan on newegg thats 37 cfm @ 20 dba (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6835129241) but i know how they lie about those kinda things

also, regarding airflow, if i do it like this, will enough airflow get to the PSU?


or if i did it like this the PSU would get more airflow but it wont really have anything to get rid of it with

i assume the fist way is better but idk
(i kno you like my pics that i made myself)

[stromgald]

Yeah I wouldn't trust the noise and cfm numbers much. However, 950rpm is fairly slow for the stock speed on a fan. Check in the SPCR recommended fans. They also have recordings you can listen to so you can judge for yourself.

The first way will actually draw air through the PSU from the outside in. They found this out in the Fortron Zen review here. The only worry I have is that the hot exhaust air will rise and get sucked into the PSU again and again. Maybe a piece of cardboard dividing it could help. I would consider a Nexus fan as a front intake to keep the hard drives cool, but it might not be necessary.

[a soggy waffle]

ill try that cardboard thats a good idea

also, i might put the tricool that comes with the case in front at 5v or something

and ill stick with the nexus i was just wondering (you guys should test those fans if you havent already, im curious if that many fins help)

here i have compiled new list, sorry if a lot of this is getting redundent

Antec Solo Black/Silver Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - Retail - $90
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6811129018

FSP Group (Fortron Source) ZEN FSP300-60GNF-R ATX 12V Version 2.0 300W Power Supply 100 - 240V - Retail - $99 after $30 MIR
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6817104902

THERMALRIGHT Ultra-120 CPU Cooling Heatsink - Retail - $47
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6835109125

[2x] 120mm Nexus Quiet Case Fan - $26, for heatsink, case
http://www.endpcnoise.com/cgi-bin/e/std ... 120mm.html

ASUS P5B Socket T (LGA 775) Intel P965 Express ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail - $160
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6813131030

Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 Conroe 1066MHz FSB 4M shared L2 Cache LGA 775 Processor - Retail - should be around $420
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6819115003

GIGABYTE GV-NX76T256D-RH Geforce 7600GT 256MB 128-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16 Silent Pipe II, Lead Free Video Card - Retail - $170
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6814125025

CORSAIR XMS2 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM Unbuffered DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit System Memory - Retail - $178 after MIR
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6820145590

Western Digital Caviar SE WD800JD 80GB 7200 RPM 8MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM - $44
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6822135106

SONY Black 16X DVD+R 8X DVD+RW 8X DVD+R DL 16X DVD-R 6X DVD-RW 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-R 24X CD-RW 48X CD-ROM 2M Cache IDE DVD Burner - OEM - $30
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6827131031

subtotal= $1264