Rudeness...

Shadowknight · Post by **Shadowknight** » Sun Sep 21, 2003 4:55 am

I just took a look a the OC quiet pc article threads...

What the hell is wrong with some of you?

The article was trying to help people construct a quiet computer, NOT be an indepth review of EVERY product he recommended. It referred to equipment the author had ACTUALLY seen and touched... How many of us recommend others to use particuarl items on the SPCR recommended list... without ever having seen/heard/used them?

When I read the article, I thought it odd that he didn't mention the SPCR site as an influence for much of what he said, but I didn't think anything bad about the author.

Going on a rampage, tearing into the guy for not scientifically testing decibel ratings, using references from Storagereview, and trashing his recommended PSU because he didn't test the efficiency rating... that's just sick.

While I understand quietness is important to many of you, this does NOT justify going into jihad mode over something so minor and stupid and unimportant.

Henrik · Post by **Henrik** » Sun Sep 21, 2003 5:20 am

You're not alone.

Post by **Rusty075** » Sun Sep 21, 2003 5:49 am

No Shadowknight the issue is that someone who brags about being an expert is instead spreading bad information. And then he whines about being criticized for his articles shortcomings.

I don't think anything in that thread has gotten rude. If anything its become a helpful discussion of the PSU requirements of dualie AMD systems.

If someone is going to write articles based on their own personal opinions they need to be prepared for people to disagree.

Things here are actually quite civil. For a real example of rudeness I suggest you read The Knights Who Say Ni visit OCA

Post by **Ralf Hutter** » Sun Sep 21, 2003 6:13 am

Rusty075 wrote:No Shadowknight the issue is that someone who brags about being an expert is instead spreading bad information. And then he whines about being criticized for his articles shortcomings.

I wouldn't call it "bad" information, maybe just not the best information. He is writing for the OC community and their perception of a quiet PC is not the same as ours is. As long as you keep that benchmark in mind it's easier to read his article without criticizing it.

And you noted yourself how bad you felt when people were capping on your /.'d Indesk PC article. You do have to have a thick skin to hang out here on the intrewebnet or you will be doing a lot of whining and crying about how people treat you. He'll have to develop a thicker skin if he wants to get along with more people, but that's easier to say than to do sometimes.

Post by **Rusty075** » Sun Sep 21, 2003 6:25 am

Yeah Ralf, you're right. He's not proporting to be an expert, and his information isn't "bad" I was a bit harsh in my post above.

But.....he is being awfully thin skinned about this. Afterall he came back to revive a thread that been dead for over a month just to complain about being criticized. I had forgottten all about his article until I reread it after he posted. I hate to say he brought it on himself...but.

And I do understand understand how he feels, trust me. You should see some of my pathetic attempts at defending my desk project over in the /. forums. At least cmcquistion has actual knowledge and experience to back up his article, my defenses were basically, "stop being so mean to me!"

That's why I've been trying to help him see this as an opportunity to learn new things and improve from.

wumpus · Post by **wumpus** » Sun Sep 21, 2003 10:14 am

It referred to equipment the author had ACTUALLY seen and touched... How many of us recommend others to use particuarl items on the SPCR recommended list... without ever having seen/heard/used them?

Conversely, the "if I haven't seen it, it doesn't exist" mentality is dangerous. Chris doesn't seem very open minded in this regard, which is unfortunate.

It is much safer to draw concensus from everyone's experience PLUS yours, than it is to presumptiously take your experience and assume that it is universally true all the time.

For example. MikeC acknowledged that a number of people (including myself, unfortunately) have experienced the Seasonic PS fan whine when the fan fails to spin up.. rather than getting all defensive about "it hasn't happened to me and my THREE power supplies I tested!"

Shadowknight · Post by **Shadowknight** » Sun Sep 21, 2003 3:41 pm

Conversely, the "if I haven't seen it, it doesn't exist" mentality is dangerous. Chris doesn't seem very open minded in this regard, which is unfortunate.

Alternatively, he wants to give recommendations for stuff he has seen and ACTUALLY USED. The article DOESN'T claim to be all and end all on silent computing. As it is, I've seen many people fall into the trap of recommending components they've never used (like the Stealth fan series, for example.

It is much safer to draw concensus from everyone's experience PLUS yours, than it is to presumptiously take your experience and assume that it is universally true all the time.

Just because the majority believes something doesn't make it right (e.g., propaganda in WW2).

For example. MikeC acknowledged that a number of people (including myself, unfortunately) have experienced the Seasonic PS fan whine when the fan fails to spin up.. rather than getting all defensive about "it hasn't happened to me and my THREE power supplies I tested!"

Again, he's recommending components he's used.

I think EVERYONE is getting way too bent out of shape over this matter.

wumpus · Post by **wumpus** » Sun Sep 21, 2003 3:56 pm

because the majority believes something doesn't make it right

I'm talking about concrete examples from a number of people, not what they "believe".

When Chris goes on to recommend 500w+ power supplies for dual Athlon systems, he is spreading misinformation in exactly this way-- a lot of people "believe" they need 500w power supplies, when this is in fact not true IN ACTUAL TESTING. They may need quality power supplies, sure, but I've measured the power draw of my dual AMD server at a measly ~130w under load!

Again, he's recommending components he's used.

Which is fine, but you have to be open to the possibility that your experiences, even across three different samples, may not be representative of everyone else's-- just as the Seasonic fan spin-up debacle taught us.

According to Chris, my dual AMD server is an impossibility that he refuses to even acknowledge-- because it doesn't map to anything he's experienced.

Curtis · Post by **Curtis** » Sun Sep 21, 2003 4:22 pm

Why does it matter if he recommends a PSU that is over and above the maximum (theoretical) power usage of a dual athlon box? I don't claim to know your system specs, but whack in a 9800 Pro or 5900 Ultra, cold cathodes, high end audio card, SCSI controller, DVD Writer and you'll probably be pushing more than 130 watts.

If nothing else, it is future proof.

wumpus · Post by **wumpus** » Sun Sep 21, 2003 5:12 pm

A lot of crappy power supplies get labeled "500 watt". It's the focus on a meaningless number, rather than QUALITY, which is at the root of this problem. That's the kind of "propaganda" I don't like to see perpetuated in articles published on overclockers.com ..

al bundy · Post by **al bundy** » Sun Sep 21, 2003 5:46 pm

Shadowknight wrote:...While I understand quietness is important to many of you... something so minor and stupid and unimportant.

Yikes - I hope you're not saying that quietness is minor, stupid and unimportant!

Beyonder · Post by **Beyonder** » Wed Sep 24, 2003 11:54 pm

I dunno. I certainly wouldn't ever attack the writer of an article personally, but in my mind, writing any sort of review or evaluation subjects your material and findings to the criticisms and observations of your peers.

People who don't take criticism well should abstain from writing reviews, in my opinion.

Rudeness...

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