'ultimately quiet’ solution - 0dB ||| WORKING!!!

[Leanux]

If you really want to have an ‘ultimately quiet’ solution, then don’t have to worry about Korean Zalman and noise dampeners cause they simply don’t work. I have four disks (440GB) and a few vents (Zalman & Enermax) set at lowest setting, including with the one in the PSU, but it’s still like having a Hoover beside you. I just couldn’t work like that, so I had to buy myself a pile of earplugs.

I felt like a physical worker at a construction site!!!

Seriously, to make a really silent solution is so simple. I just can’t figure it out why people don’t “propagate” it more: you don’t have to have your Hoover next to you – it can be in another room, pantry, basement or heating room!!! Your new NVIDIA and 3+GHz monsters can scare lettuce in your pantry or intimidate firewood while letting your ears rest!!!

You just have to drill a hole in a wall (or if you have a chimney you don’t use it anymore -;>) and/or buy a few 10 meter cables: for VGA/DVI monitor, PS/2 and USB. You have to be careful when buying VGA cable, because are there lots of cables that really suck. The one I have runs seamlessly at 1280x1024 at 100Hz. You make 10m USB with 2 5m cables + 2USB hubs; and done!

The loudest ‘device’ currently residing in my working room is my radiator!!! Am I the only one with an IQ of 145 or is my idea really so insane!

Lean onto Leanux – http://www.leanux.org

[zuperdee]

Uhh, I'd hate to be the one to spoil the party, but I feel it my duty to point out that vacuum cleaner motors are NOT typically rated for continuous use, so unless you've got some way in mind to keep your vacuum motor cool, don't be surprised if it burns out after more than 8 hours of continous use.

[Sooty]

My computer will have to reside in my office. If it’s put in the only other office, it’s going to annoy someone else. Our floor is concrete, but I could put it in the loft, but the mice would chew the cables and I’d have to climb a ladder to switch it on/off, or use the DVD/CD. There’s just no other place for it but my office. Ear-plugs are out of the question, because I’d have to shout at everyone on the phone to “SPEAK UP – I CAN’T HEAR YOU – NO I’M NOT DEAF!!”. But I’m going to use a wireless mouse and keyboard, so I can place the computer 2 metres further away, than otherwise would have been possible.

[sthayashi]

Uhh, I'd hate to be the one to spoil the party, but I feel it my duty to point out that vacuum cleaner motors are NOT typically rated for continuous use, so unless you've got some way in mind to keep your vacuum motor cool, don't be surprised if it burns out after more than 8 hours of continous use.

I'd hate to spoil the party more, but I don't think he's using a vacuum cleaner for any length of time. He's simply comparing his computer to one.

[SometimesWarrior]

Uhh, I'd hate to be the one to spoil the party, but I feel it my duty to point out that vacuum cleaner motors are NOT typically rated for continuous use, so unless you've got some way in mind to keep your vacuum motor cool, don't be surprised if it burns out after more than 8 hours of continous use.

I'd hate to spoil the party more, but I don't think he's using a vacuum cleaner for any length of time. He's simply comparing his computer to one.

I'd hate to be the one that sends the party to burn in hell for eternity, but I think zuperdee was commenting on the need for adequate air circulation in the room holding the computer. Otherwise, it will burn out after a while.

[aphonos]

Am I the only one with an IQ of 145 or is my idea really so insane!

Leanux, Welcome to SPCR!

Maybe you could put your 145 IQ to work using the forum search feature. Searching on both extension and room, I got a hanful of threads where this idea has already been kicked around. It is do-able if you don't mind having your PC in a remote location. And no one has to be in the remote location room with your PC.

Or you can stick around here, read the recommended components and other articles on the main site and soak in the forums and put your 145 IQ to work quieting your machine so that you can have it in the same room with you. But I warn you. It's addictive.

And, IMO, you're wrong about quiet components not working. You do have to get components that are truly quiet and not just marketed/labeled as quiet. Many people here have high-end systems that are whisper quiet or better. Interested in joining us?

[sthayashi]

Uhh, I'd hate to be the one to spoil the party, but I feel it my duty to point out that vacuum cleaner motors are NOT typically rated for continuous use, so unless you've got some way in mind to keep your vacuum motor cool, don't be surprised if it burns out after more than 8 hours of continous use.

I'd hate to spoil the party more, but I don't think he's using a vacuum cleaner for any length of time. He's simply comparing his computer to one.

I'd hate to be the one that sends the party to burn in hell for eternity, but I think zuperdee was commenting on the need for adequate air circulation in the room holding the computer. Otherwise, it will burn out after a while.

If so, then the party has been spoiled on the account of too many metaphors.

Leanux, I think you're missing the point. My computer is absolutely silent when I open a window. I live about 300m from train tracks, a hospital with a helicopter landing pad, and a college apartment building.

My computer is also absolutely inaudible when I put on some loud and heavy music (which is somewhat frequent). In fact, this would probably be the most common response if you mentioned to someone else that their computer was loud.

What you're suggesting is treating the symptoms, and what we do here is attack the problem.

[chylld]

What you're suggesting is treating the symptoms, and what we do here is attack the problem.

Very well said. *nod*

[dago]

1) As cables get longer, signal degradation becomes an issue. I've found this to be especially true with monitor extensions, though it's probably also a problem with keyboard, mouse, and speakers. Having USB distance requires powered hubs/repeaters.

You can use DVI for the video, a powered USB hub is not so expensive, so that's not much a problem.

2) You can't exactly get to any optical/floppy drives conveniently. As someone who has over 850 gigs of data on DVD-Rs, I tend to have to swap those suckers out. And put in new ones to burn.

Use an external optical drive, if you want to keep your actual drives, a board to put 2 IDE drives on firewire or USB is about 50$.

3) My computer looks cool under my desk. It doesn't look cool next to cereal, cat food, or ramen noodles. Maybe someone else can prove me wrong.

Well, having a computer desk without any computer looks even cooler to me

4) Drilling a hole in the wall isn't trivial. Doing it in an apartment is expressly forbidden. Doing it in a condo is dumb for resale value. Doing it in a house is probably quite complicated. Making this hole in the wall look good is even more difficult.

I drilled many holes in houses, apartment, ... and
- it's not complicated (really)
- it doesn't have to be evident
- it's also forbidden to drive above speed limits

So I'd have to vote no for drilling. Besides, quieting computers is a hobby - it's even better than playstation. Winning on the playstation is boring. Quieting the computer gives that feeling of accomplishment. Plus, the playstation isn't a good excuse to buy things like tools or other things with weird names like melamine or sorbothane.

That one is the killing argument, nothing to say.

[SometimesWarrior]

This thread just reminded me that I have a four-inch hole in the wall of my apartment, directly behind my desk! Unfortunately, it goes straight into the bathroom, and I don't exactly relish the thought of waterproofing my PC.

[replay0]

[quote="Leanux"]
The loudest ‘device’ currently residing in my working room is my radiator!!! Am I the only one with an IQ of 145 or is my idea really so insane!
[quote]

It doesn't take a lot of brains to figure something like this out, but it is not the solution most of us want. I'm wililng to put up with tolerable noise coming from my system over the silent idea you present.

[Gurduloo]

I have a friend who did precisely this. He moved his main computer into a back room where it doesn't bother anyone. Then he ran a network cable into his living room and hooked up an old quiet laptop. He uses the laptop to remotely control the PC. He's using Linux though - I'm not sure how well that solution would work with Windows.

[Leanux]

Well, I just wanted to tell you that that there are no major technical issues with my solution, but Dago was faster.

You can use DVI for monitor (though the first 10m VGA cable was really crappy, the second works fine). Use USB2 for external CD/DVD or HDDs.

There should already be some holes in your office/room. How do you get your phone, network, TV, electricity, water into the office?; And sewage out?

You can drill a hole into the frame of a window; or if you have a chimney you don't use. If you really can't do it any other way you can put the cables under the carpet and drill a hole in the frame of your door.

Some of you say that you can't put your computer anywhere else, but I still think it's better to put your computer in corridor or a hall that have it right beside you. If you are afraid that someone would tamper with your data you can have your sensitive data either encrypted (EFS in NTFS) and/or put it on an external HDD/compact flash right beside you.

Sooty – you can pull out your earplug (just one!!!) when having phone conversations. At least I do. You can put cable in a metal pipe and your computer in a cage so no rodents could chew them. You said that you’d have to “I’d have to climb a ladder to switch it on/off« but that’s not entirely necessary: you can switch off your computer in Windows and can turn it on by ‘wake on LAN’, ‘wake on ring’ or ‘wake on PCI’ or make a remotely controlled switch. Or you can have a 24/7 server.

Aphonos – don’t think I didn’t try quiet components, but wherever you have mechanical particles, rotation etc. there IS some noise. But they might be quiet, but they are certainly silent. I’ve removed all movable components in my old computer but I could still hear humming of the electricity in my PSU. One cannot silence capacitors, can he? Besides they need to be cooled.

Sthayashi – I think you didn’t get me right. I didn’t advise you to put a Hoover next to you, I merely compared the noise of my Zalman/Enermax/Maxtor liquid bearing/Akasa PC to the noise produced by a vacuum cleaner.

As of the definition of a problem and a symptom: the problem for me is to have a productive work environment because I really can’t bear much noise, especially when I read or study. The symptom is much lower productivity and an unpleasant feeling.

Of course you can run terminal services (Citrix Metaframe) over local network on a low end computer without much noise, but then you can’t watch streaming videos of Mr. Bush (or if you are on the other side of the spectrum – play diabolic games)

I just wanted to share my experience with you because I ‘d like to make your life a little easier for you.

Just by the sheer number of posts one can see that Mr. Radeonman and Mr. aphonos are hardcore ‘SilentPC reviewers’. This tells me two things – yes they are addicted (aphonos said that) and never satisfied. They just never get enough silence and even after more that 1500 posts they are still trying to make it ‘more quiet’ and continue their hunt for computer components that are ‘whisper quiet or better’. Of course they will try to find holes in my reasoning.

Once this solution is applied there would be no need for SilentPCreview, would it?

Lean onto leanux – http://www.leanux.org

[Shadowknight]

No offence, but...

Once this solution is applied there would be no need for SilentPCreview, would it?

People come here because they want to make their computer quieter. Most of them would prefer to have it in the room with them, as closets can having overheating issues. Also, it can be inconvenient to have to lug a big tower out of a closet (or walk downstairs) every time you want to do something with it. If I need to put in a CD-ROM, or want to check something inside my case, it's right there.

Is my computer silent? No, but it's at a whisper level. It would probably be acceptable to professional studios as a DAW. Even with the PSU under load, the sound isn't remotely bad (not going to stop me from getting a fanless PSU later this year though).

You sound unhappy about the noise level of your computer. What type of equipment and fans are you running? What case?

[aphonos]

Aphonos – don’t think I didn’t try quiet components, but wherever you have mechanical particles, rotation etc. there IS some noise. But they might be quiet, but they are certainly silent. I’ve removed all movable components in my old computer but I could still hear humming of the electricity in my PSU. One cannot silence capacitors, can he? Besides they need to be cooled.

What are your current components? Citing Zalman and Enermax, as you did in your first post leads me to think that you may be a victim of dubious marketing--claims of quiet that are not substantiated.

As of the definition of a problem and a symptom: the problem for me is to have a productive work environment because I really can’t bear much noise, especially when I read or study. The symptom is much lower productivity and an unpleasant feeling.

I just wanted to share my experience with you because I ‘d like to make your life a little easier for you.

Just by the sheer number of posts one can see that Mr. Radeonman and Mr. aphonos are hardcore ‘SilentPC reviewers’. This tells me two things – yes they are addicted (aphonos said that) and never satisfied. They just never get enough silence and even after more that 1500 posts they are still trying to make it ‘more quiet’ and continue their hunt for computer components that are ‘whisper quiet or better’. Of course they will try to find holes in my reasoning.

1. Yup, it's a hobby/addiction.
2. A lot of my posts have nothing to do with my computer, but are a result of helping newcomers to quiet their PCs.
3. You make it sound like the quest for quiet is a bad thing. Is there something wrong with trying to find quieter solutions?
4. Already said your idea works if you want to go that route. You're obviously happy with the results (for which I'm glad ), but that doesn't mean your idea is universally applicable or desirable.
5. re: a quiet work environment. Me, too! That's what brought me here in the first place. If you check my sig you'll see that my machine is plenty powerful enough for the work that I do--no gaming. It sits on the floor at the end of my desk and in the middle-of-the-night quiet of my home the very soft electrical whistle/hum of my monitor makes more noise than my PC (and my monitor is quieter than a Panaflo 80mm L1A 21dBA fan at 12V running in free air)--and your remote solution doesn't deal with quieting my monitor

Once this solution is applied there would be no need for SilentPCreview, would it?

Your assertion is a bit arrogant IMO, though probably made with playful intentions. Perhaps that comes as a byproduct of a high IQ. Your statement assumes, among other things, that everyone has the space and means to move their noisy PC to a remote location. Not so for dorm rooms, many office situations, bedroom PCs, or some HTPCs setups to make a short list. Imagine the cabling nightmare it would be for most offices to put all their noisy PCs in remote locations and run DVI, PS/2, power on/off, and USB cables all over the place. While there are no insurmountable technical issues with your idea, there are rather severe logistical issues that must be circumvented to make you idea the universal solution. So perhaps there is a niche for SPCR after all.

Dang, Shadownight posted faster, but I worked so hard to write this, I'll leave the stuff that repeats what he said.

[sthayashi]

Sthayashi – I think you didn’t get me right. I didn’t advise you to put a Hoover next to you, I merely compared the noise of my Zalman/Enermax/Maxtor liquid bearing/Akasa PC to the noise produced by a vacuum cleaner.

As of the definition of a problem and a symptom: the problem for me is to have a productive work environment because I really can’t bear much noise, especially when I read or study. The symptom is much lower productivity and an unpleasant feeling.

I'm just going to ignore the vacuum cleaner references, because I thought I was correcting someone who misunderstood you.

The biggest point that everyone here is trying to make is that simply moving the computer to another room is not always a viable option. Machine 2 in my sig can be heard throughout my relatively small apartment. It sits in my dining room because it acts as my router and that's where the only phone line is. There's already a mess of cables in that general area and moving that machine, though possible, will simply create a bigger mess of cables.

Machine 3 in my sig sits near the TV in my living room because it acts as my HTPC. I can move it to many places around that area, but the best out-of-the-way locations are too far to be feasible and I would have cables running everywhere (and getting a long optical S/PDIF cable is prohibitively expensive).

In short, moving a PC is certainly a good way of making sure you don't hear it, but it's not very effective for people who have no place to move it TO.

I'll end this by telling what one of my friends did a few years ago. He was annoyed by his loud computer as well. So he did the exact same thing that you did. He bought a number of really long cables and put the computer in his closet. That worked very well until summer came. When summer DID come, he found that his computer kept overheating and that he was forced to pull it out of the closet if he wanted to continue using it.

Moral: Moving your computer to a quieter location is not always an option for the rest of us.

Still, I'm glad that you're happy with your setup. I think that is the ultimate goal beyond SPCR, to be happy with your finished work.

[MikeC]

Once this solution is applied there would be no need for SilentPCreview, would it?

It's true, if everyone accepted and applied this solution. But as you can see from the above responses, chances are it is a viable solution for only a small percentage of PC users.

The other simple fact is the quieter computers are becoming mainstream, and there is an increasing need for consumer advocate resources and "watchdogs" to separate false claims about noise performance from true, to do the comparison shopping most consumer don't have the time or resources to do for themselves.

[Shadowknight]

I have NO CLUE what the poll is... Treyf? Kosher? What's the question? More importantly, what are the answers supposed to be?

[trodas]

Well well well, moving the computer out is solution, of course, but only for someone, who don't using CDs/DVDs regulary, not to menton backups and Zips for smaler data transfer, etc.
Not a solution for me, however i want say that making hole for the few cables is not a problem. Ever seen this?
- i make a intake hole with this toy into my case in less that minute and this thing should (according to the manufactorer ) dril even to better HSS steel ...well, i did not tried that, but i hear that most USA buildings are just made from wood (how crappy and cheap ---i can't imagine not having thick, solid walls brom bricks! ... ) so making a hole like this - and a pretty nice looking one - can be easy.

Finding acceptable USB2 DVD burner not Not to mention even the USB2 can't get infinitely long. The VGA signal degradation must be a problem, can be partly solved with the DVI, but i fear that there are limits too...

...and top of this, no-one mentioned audio cables! It's entierly impossible then to use the computer for any audio output at all, because the AC3 signal quality degradation over such distance and with many interferences from other cables will suffer hard

About "huming" PSU capacitors - they are defective, replace them. Mine fanless PSU/machine does NOT generate even SLIGHT noise humming

[lm]

Well i did exactly that with my server machine, and for a while i even had my desktop machine being totally diskless, running linux.
Now, if i had any place in this apartment where i could put my 2 computers elsewhere than where their noise would be annoying i would do it. Let's see... Bedroom? No. Living room? No. Kitchen? No space. Wc? Bad idea... Balcony? No, it's outside. Hall? Too far and no space.

[lm]

...and top of this, no-one mentioned audio cables! It's entierly impossible then to use the computer for any audio output at all, because the AC3 signal quality degradation over such distance and with many interferences from other cables will suffer hard

Digital audio i/o will solve this for you. It also will remove the noise that you cannot avoid if you use analog audio output from the computer, the noise generated inside the computer itself. If the audio signal is taken to the amplifier in digital form, the quality can drop only there and speakers and their cables.

[sthayashi]

...and top of this, no-one mentioned audio cables! It's entierly impossible then to use the computer for any audio output at all, because the AC3 signal quality degradation over such distance and with many interferences from other cables will suffer hard

Digital audio i/o will solve this for you. It also will remove the noise that you cannot avoid if you use analog audio output from the computer, the noise generated inside the computer itself. If the audio signal is taken to the amplifier in digital form, the quality can drop only there and speakers and their cables.

I agree. As I mentioned before, optical S/PDIF is prohibitively expensive in long lengths. However, coax S/PDIF can probably be done with great length easily.
And if you're really concerned, you can also get a USB/Firewire Soundcard. They're semi-expensive (not much more than normal high end soundcards), but they can go just as far as your other devices, AND they typically use high-quality DACs and other components, so the quality of the sound will be superb.

[trodas]

Im and sthayashi - good point I forget about it, hell.. Well, there is some issues with some driers and enforcing S/PDIF output, however this is a option
Using external hi-quality DAC is always highly recomended into all audiophiles - sadly i can't afford that, nor buy in Europe... [/b]

[sthayashi]

Well, there is some issues with some driers and enforcing S/PDIF output, however this is a option
Using external hi-quality DAC is always highly recomended into all audiophiles - sadly i can't afford that, nor buy in Europe... [/b]

Well, I can't help you with being able to afford one, but the M-Audio Audiophile USB is available in the Czech Republic at http://www.disk.cz/. If I needed a new USB audio device, I would probably get this.

[Gooserider]

Shadowknight:
I have NO CLUE what the poll is... Treyf? Kosher? What's the question? More importantly, what are the answers supposed to be?

It's a 'Jewish thing' Kosher means in compliance with a certain set of rules on what is and isn't considered 'good' to eat. (I'm Goyim, so don't ask me for details...) 'Treyf' is for those more tasty foods that aren't so 'good' by the Kosher rules, stuff like Lobster, Cheeseburgers, and Pork etc.... . If you keep kosher, you must go through life being deprived of such tasty items.

Presumably in the case of this question, judging from the context, 'kosher' would mean that you think moving the PC is a good idea, and 'treyf' would mean that you think it isn't.

Gooserider
(PS - no offense to any Jewish SPCR folks is intended by my somewhat tongue in cheek summary of 'Kosher')

[al bundy]

[...(I'm Goyim, so don't ask me for details...)

Gooserider, FYI, here's a link about that disparaging term goyim.

Some jewish friends of mine recently told me they refuse to even use that old yiddish word goy (plural goyim) anymore, saying that it is often (but not always) used as a racist and condescending reference to non-jews. Among other connotations, the word can mean "non-human" or "cattle". In fact, some jewish groups have advocated total abandonment of the term, saying that it is the jewish equivalent of the word "nigger" and should be treated as such.

Instead they choose to use the word "gentile", which used to translate as "heathen", but in non-jewish society it is actually etymologically related to the words "gentle" and "genteel"...

[trodas]

Back to topic a little

sthayashi - good catch Thanks, however i have no itention to use anything like this, because my PC is almost fanless and almost silent, so
But what's this thing are for anyway, i don't see any AC3 output i can pull into my subwoofer AC3 input???

Do they existing subwoofers with S/PDIF inputs anyway? ...to get rid of the damned inducted noise in my cables from my Audigy...

[sthayashi]

sthayashi - good catch Thanks, however i have no itention to use anything like this, because my PC is almost fanless and almost silent, so
But what's this thing are for anyway, i don't see any AC3 output i can pull into my subwoofer AC3 input???

Do they existing subwoofers with S/PDIF inputs anyway? ...to get rid of the damned inducted noise in my cables from my Audigy...

No, to the best of my knowledge, no subwoofer has a S/PDIF input, unless there was a receiver built-into it. What you'll want is shielded cables. However, I don't think that's your problem. One of the problems is that EMI and RF interference can play havoc on a Soundcard's DAC. Those things are pretty sensitive.

The theory behind USB and Firewire Audio is that you offload the Digital to Analog conversion outside your computer and away from the power supply and fans.

I have two setups with subwoofers. The first is my Home Theater, where Machine 3 in my Sig has a S/PDIF optical cable connected to an A/V receiver. The A/V receiver then uses its internal DACs to decode the signal and send the proper information to each speaker including a dedicated line for the Subwoofer.

The second setup is my office. With that setup, I have a USB audio device (Stereo-Link) running a stereo RCA line to an integrated amplifier. The Stereo-Link is where the digital to analog conversion takes place. The integrated amplifier simply amplifys the sound coming in and sends it out to the speakers. There is no dedicated subwoofer output. So I have my subwoofer take the speaker input and extract all the bass frequencies, and pass through everything that's left. This is called a crossover, I believe.

The M-Audio Audiophile USB has an S/PDIF line for those who prefer to use S/PDIF for their recording studio/mixers (I actually had one for a while). For the consumer end of things, you may prefer the M-Audio Sonica Theater, which has more of the things you're probably familiar with.

[al bundy]

No, to the best of my knowledge, no subwoofer has a S/PDIF input, ...

The subwoofer in my sig (MegaWorks THX 2.1 250D speakerset) has an RCA S/PDIF input, with true 24-bit/96kHz built-in DACs and a nice 99dB signal-to-noise ratio (which is quite good for multimedia desktop speakers). However, it is also a 2.1 system - so AC3 tracks would of course only be able to playback in 2.1 sound...