First impressions: Kingwin KT-424-BK case, Seasonic p/s, etc

Enclosures and acoustic damping to help quiet them.

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brianstretch
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Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2003 5:21 pm
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan, USA

First impressions: Kingwin KT-424-BK case, Seasonic p/s, etc

Post by brianstretch » Fri Dec 05, 2003 9:03 pm

I had planned on buying an Antec P160 but when Newegg upped their ETA by a week I did more searching and stumbled across this case. (Naturally, the P160's arrived sooner than expected.) I already had a Seasonic Super Silencer 400W p/s, AcoustiPack Deluxe, several sets of fan isolators, and Pabst 80mm fan inbound from Silicon Acoustics and everything arrived today.

First, the case: very, very impressive aluminum case. 2mm thick metal, heavier than average, giving the case a very solid feel. Very nice black finish, fits in at home or the office. Lots of clearance for putting Acousti composite on the right side panel. Speed control for the front two 80mm case fans (standard 3-pin fan plugs) that sit behind a washable air filter. The front bezel is aluminum and pops on and off very easily. Slide-out motherboard tray. Rubber grommets for the HD bays. Very slick toolless CD and floppy drive bays (slide one lever to lock the drives in place). All in all, it's better than the Lian-Li case that I used to have (sold it with my old system) and less expensive too.

The bad: the included fans blow chunks. The rear case fan ran at 2700RPM (loud). The front case fans had a noticible rattle, even with the speed control turned all the way down. The fans are mounted with the same type of plastic rivets that Lian-Li cases use. Replacing the rear fan with a PC Power & Cooling Silencer (around 1900RPM IIRC) was simple enough, but getting to the front fans was VERY challenging. I finally succeeded in removing them and replaced the bottom one with the Pabst fan and fan isolators I had presciently ordered. I left the upper fan mount empty (I'm not sure I could get a fan mounted with fan isolators there anyhow; maybe screws with rubber grommets, but it's not worth it for my setup). I put the drives back in, turned the PC on, discovered it made a very big difference noise-wise... and that I'd put the Pabst fan in backwards. :roll: After getting that corrected, the PC still makes too much noise, which I traced to the fan on the BFG GeForceFX 5700 Ultra that is now very noticible compared to the rest of the system. (Great vidcard otherwise, much cleaner analog signal output than the previous nVidia-based cards I've bought. Recommended.)

I'm disappointed with the AcoustiPack foam. I didn't try the case without the foam so I can't make a direct comparison, but I don't think it's making much difference at all. The vidcard fan is very audible; I'll order a Zalman heatpipe cooler next week and hope it fits (I have the small one on the GeForce 440MX in my server, kinda nervous about the size and weight of the big one my FX5700 will requier... well, actually, it doesn't run all that hot, but I'll get the big one anyhow). Maybe after I've dealt with the vidcard fan I'll be able to notice the foam making a difference.

The Pabst fan is very impressive. Glad I bought it.

The Seasonic Super Silencer really does use less power than other PSUs. I have an Athlon 64 3200+ (ASUS K8V, Zalman CNPS7000A-AlCu @ 1600RPM) with two Seagate 7200.7 SATAs (striped). After replacing my PC Power & Cooling Turbo-Cool 510 Active PFC with it (I had this silly idea that the variable-speed fan in the ridiculously powerful 510 would run slow and quiet under the light load I was placing on it; nope, it doesn't work that way) my APC SmartUPS 620 registered a 6-1/2 percentage point drop on its load meter (granted in part because the 510 is a much higher capacity supply; PCP&C's way of defining wattage is VERY conservative). That's huge given that there's also a 19" panel and an Athlon 1700+ plugged into the UPS, and the total load is about 67% (both readings while the Athlon 64 was in Cool & Quiet mode which drops the CPU to 800MHz when idle). It doesn't keep the voltage rails as stable as the PCP&C supply (which is the gold standard of PSUs and priced that way) but it'll do and it's a LOT quieter. I'm tempted to get Seasonic's 300W model for my Athlon 1700+ to replace its Antec True330 as it runs 24x7. (BTW, I reclocked that 1700+ to 7.5x200MHz on an ASUS A7N8X Deluxe; fairly low power consumption and lots of memory bandwidth. Multimonth uptimes running Linux.)

Anyhow, to summarize: great case but needs a LOT of work to quiet. Great power supply. Great Pabst fan. Disappointing foam.

brianstretch
Posts: 15
Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2003 5:21 pm
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan, USA

Post by brianstretch » Fri Dec 05, 2003 9:13 pm

Hmm, I'm not confident about that 6-1/2 percentage point power load difference now. I don't remember whether I had my speakers turned on or off during the readings and that tweaks the readings by a point or two. (Old 2-speaker plus subwoofer.) Regardless, the Seasonic PSU seems to work as advertised.

rtree
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Post by rtree » Fri Dec 05, 2003 9:48 pm

Ah so the stock fans are considered noisy ... heh ... I had no idea what others considered "noisy". I use the stock Kingwin for exhaust, so i was afraid to give a 100% recommendation for the KT-424-BK when someone was asking about it earlier. I really like the case. I used a nibbler to remove the stamped fan grills, but I need to file down the edges. Functional for improving air flow but not pretty. Then again the filter does cover the mangled fan holes.

I got some panaflo L1A's and a NB32J passive chipset cooler on their way. I really hope the NB32J will fit next to the SLK900U ... otherwise I guess I'll have to find some other use for it.

ColdFlame
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Post by ColdFlame » Fri Dec 05, 2003 11:00 pm

This case has only one rear 80mm fan, isn't this like a serious problem???
I thought you must have either 1 120mm or 2 80mm.
I mean it is not the end of the world but it is very hard to make such case silent.
Am I wrong? 8)

bondiablo
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Location: Milwaukee, WI

Post by bondiablo » Fri Dec 05, 2003 11:10 pm

I just got this exact same case to replace a Lian Li PC-61 a couple weeks ago and it's one of the best things I bought. I didn't bother listening to the included fans though. First thing I did was cut off all 3 fan grills and install 3 Panaflo L1As with EAR isolators. You're right getting that 2nd fan in place on the front was a pain until I thought to put a little lubricant on the last 2 isolators I couldn't reach, then the fan popped right on. I used mineral oil because that's what I had lying around but anything that would lubricate it just long enough to pop the fan on and then dry out would have worked, probably water or even spit. ;) I also had some EAR grommets sitting here that didn't fit in my last case so I tried them in place of the rubber. At first I thought they fit but they weren't quite as thick and when I installed the hard drive I noticed a slight gap left between the drive and the grommets so I went back to the rubber. Best thing I did was piece together a splitter/extension cable from a left over fan, pin adapter and splice connectors so I could connect all 3 case fans to the front fan controller. Now I can maintain positive pressure to keep dust to a minimum even with the fans turned down. On low all 3 case fans are dead silent but they don't move much air so I'm keeping them on medium. No clue what voltage that translates too, I wrote an email to Kingwin to ask about the fan controller but they haven't replied yet. I was planning on putting up a more complete account of my FINALLY successful quiet system maybe even a couple pictures though not sure there's really anything interesting to see and my camera sucks but this seemed like a good time/place to post about the case.

bondiablo
Posts: 155
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Location: Milwaukee, WI

Post by bondiablo » Wed Dec 10, 2003 3:11 am

I got a reply from Kingwin today about the fan controller.

>From 5.5 V to 11.3V

brianstretch
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Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2003 5:21 pm
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan, USA

Post by brianstretch » Thu Dec 11, 2003 7:00 pm

Thanks for the tip on working with those fan isolators bondiablo. I bet a little soapy water would work too.

I put the Zalman ZM80C-HP heatpipe cooler on my GeForceFX 5700 Ultra video card and... it works, but after a round of UT2003 the GPU core temp is north of 70C (used Arctic Silver 3 of course, the heatsinks get quite warm so the heatpipe is working). Next time I buy toys I'll add the Zalman cooling fan option to the order.

Getting rid of the vidcard fan took care of the last really annoying noise source. The PC still makes noise, it's not whisper quiet, but it's probably as good as I'm going to do for a high-end PC until AMD ships their 90nm Athlon 64's in 2H2004 (supposed to be much lower power consumption, unlike Intel's upcoming Prescott "Blast Furnace Edition"). I've got Zalman CNPS7000A-AlCu fan at 1960 RPM, the single Pabst front fan cranked all the way up (slower wasn't appreciably quieter), the rear Silencer case fan, and the Seasonic power supply's fan (which runs very slowly while the Athlon 64 is in Cool and Quiet mode and the exhaust is barely warm, VERY impressive). I don't think the foam makes much difference, if any, on those fans (except the CPU fan, maybe), the ZM80C-HP dealt with the last major internal noise source, and while the water-based adhesive used by the Acoustipack does cut down on outgassing it doesn't eliminate it. I would speculate that the Kingwin case's 2mm thick aluminum and excellent metalwork are enough to eliminate case resonance as a significant problem. It's too bad Kingwin didn't make a 120mm rear fan port... a single 120mm front fan rather than two 80's would probably be better too. Still, overall, GREAT case. I've swapped in a black Pioneer DVD burner, Samsung floppy, and Microsoft Multimedia keyboard and optical mouse (black version of the Intellimouse Optical, Newegg sells the mouse and keyboard pair together in OEM packaging for cheap), which looks very slick.

About the only thing left to do that I can think of is cut out the stamped fan grills... and that would require removing stuff from the case, bleah. This will do for now.

Ralf Hutter
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Post by Ralf Hutter » Fri Dec 12, 2003 4:22 am

brianstretch wrote:Thanks for the tip on working with those fan isolators bondiablo. I bet a little soapy water would work too.
Soapy water works great. I like it because it dries and leaves no oily residue inside your case. I'd also be worried that the oil on the rubber isolators would break down the rubber after a while.

pdf27
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Post by pdf27 » Fri Dec 12, 2003 6:18 am

The same case is also sold as the Beantech Igloo 4 (in the UK at least).

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