Whats the best material to KEEP DUST OUT?

EvilNick · Post by **EvilNick** » Tue Jun 15, 2004 4:51 am

Hello all!

First off, the articles over here at SPCR are so well written and detailed that I practically read most of what interested me in one day.

So now I've joined the forums!

Anyway, on my casing's intake fans, I'm using dust filters that I made from a material called CheeseCloth. It filters well, but it still lets most small dust through and its hard to handle cause it curls up once you cut if off the main roll.

So I'm wondering, what's the best material to use to keep dust out? I don't mind if airflow is impeded abit cause I don't mind 2-5°C higher temps if it means I don't have to clean my case anymore.

Would http://www.mmm.com/sg/filtrete.html work well? It's an aircon filter electrostatically charged to attract dust. Dunno if it will cause ESD probs tho.

I also saw some fine hard cloth mesh material, but hard cloth doesn't strike me as something that is capable of catching dust particles even though the mesh holes are tiny.

So what do you guys suggest?

*Sorry if my first post is really long.

*

Post by **Ralf Hutter** » Tue Jun 15, 2004 5:04 am

Howdy Evil, welcome to SPCR!!!

I'd search for posts by "Bluefront". He's the resident SPCR dust expert. He runs some pretty hardcore filtering in his systems.

Search for "bluefront AND filter" and you'll get some nice hits.

EvilNick · Post by **EvilNick** » Tue Jun 15, 2004 5:57 am

After reading through some of bluefront's posts, the basic idea seems to be to use filter material of the paper kind like this.

http://f2.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/yellow ... m=a9e7.jpg

But I rarely see this type of crinkly filter material around my place. Ace Hardware is the only real hardware shop around me. What should I ask my local hardware store for? What is this type of filter typically used for?

munichkid · Post by **munichkid** » Tue Jun 15, 2004 6:04 am

If memory serves me correctly, it is a floor register filter. It is used in homes for the floor vents that allow the air conditioning and heat into the room. It looks as if he cut out the bottom of the case and made a chamber for it.

PhilgB · Post by **PhilgB** » Tue Jun 15, 2004 6:15 am

I recently had to visit the hospital and had to wear a mask because the person had pneumonia. When it was not on, it was flat but Im not sure how restrictive it is. It would be easy to attach to the front of a case. Ill try and find a pic.

Post by **Rusty075** » Tue Jun 15, 2004 6:43 am

Automobile air filters are another choice. Usually more expensive, but may be more widely available.

Don't worry, Bluefront will be along here anytime....

mg1394 · Post by **mg1394** » Tue Jun 15, 2004 7:19 am

EvilNick wrote:.... Ace Hardware is the only real hardware shop around me. What should I ask my local hardware store for?

Here's a suggestion - go to www.acehardware.com, and do a search on "air filters" and you will get about 50 choices, many of which will provide material that will work just fine for your needs. How many of their products are available in Asia - ???

The suggestions of automobile air filter material or breathing masks are also good ones for material.

Remember, the better the filter, the more often it needs cleaned/replaced, and the more damage it will cause to your machine if you allow it to get clogged.

EvilNick · Post by **EvilNick** » Tue Jun 15, 2004 7:36 am

I just did a search for air filters on the Ace site and noticed that the crinkly kind of filter that bluefront used in the picture I referred to up there is commonly referred to as a furnace/AC filter.

Well, in Malaysia, no one uses furnaces in the up to 37°C tropical weather, so maybe that's why I don't see any stock here.

But the price is pretty nuts too, US$70 or so???

I might go with that 3M Filtrete AC filter, its the flat kind, but looks pretty good too and its more affordable.

Lemme wait for bluefront to gimme some tips.

Bluefront · Post by **Bluefront** » Tue Jun 15, 2004 3:53 pm

Well EvilNick, I'm certain you can find good pleated paper air-filters where you live. That setup you linked to, is my latest Black Knight computer, complete with the best air-filtration system in any of my computers. It's easy to make, if you can find the plastic register vent.

The vent is mounted in a cut-out hole in the bottom of your case, which is raised off the floor with castors or feet. You can use any filter material, but the paper pleated type is best. That one you see in the photos is from a Nissan Maxima 2002...in-cabin filter.

The vent is 4"x12" and the PSU and rear case fans simply suck air through the filter. I have one 92mm fan you see (the angled fan) which also sucks through this filter and blows into the case. It works...no dust.

EvilNick · Post by **EvilNick** » Wed Jun 16, 2004 1:11 am

Pleated paper air filter is what it is? Maybe I'll go back to Ace and take a better look around the place. I doubt I can get one from a car.

Any ideas on where else I can try looking for this type of filter if I can't find any at Ace?

Bluefront · Post by **Bluefront** » Wed Jun 16, 2004 2:55 am

Furnace filters in the USA, hi-filtration types, are commonly made of this type of pleated material (it's sort-of like paper, somewhat fuzzy). And they are cheap here......maybe $3-$12 for a big 20"x20" unit. That size would have to be cut up to fit.

You could also use a standard automotive air filter (flat rectangle size), available at auto parts stores......also cheap. You might be able to use an auto-filter without the plastic vent. Find a filter small enough.....cut a square hole, drop in the filter. Rubber seals around the edges of the paper filter, would seal it against the bottom of the case.

There are numerous ways to do this.....limited only by your imagination.

halcyon · Post by **halcyon** » Wed Jun 16, 2004 3:43 am

One material that you might consider also are called microfibers.

You can get vacuum cleaner dustbags made out of microfiber materials and they are very durable and filtter very small particles.

The trouble is that you need quite a lot of air flow, if you want to push air through the vacuum cleaner bags. So a thinner bag of the same material would be better.

EvilNick · Post by **EvilNick** » Wed Jun 16, 2004 3:47 am

OK btw, I'm going to just use this filter material over my front and side intakes, not on the bottom of the case like you.
I'll go try and look for the pleated paper kind.

Btw, what do you think of the aircon filter I mentioned in my first post? It's similar material to the pleated paper, but its flat, not crinkly.

Krash · Post by **Krash** » Wed Jun 16, 2004 1:30 pm

try pantyhose

Bluefront · Post by **Bluefront** » Wed Jun 16, 2004 3:39 pm

Heh....You want an air-filter right? Not women's underwear. I gave up trying to fit a decent filter right in front of a fan....just not enough surface area available to work well. The bottom of the case is the only area big enough to do the job right. Check out the filter setup in my cookie jar computer.

EvilNick · Post by **EvilNick** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 12:33 am

Hrm but I don't wanna make a big hole in the bottom of my case.

I'm just wondering whether that Filtret aircon filter material (the flat one, not pleated) is good enough to catch dust?

My main purpose is to keep dust out, I don't mind if airflow is blocked a little.

Bluefront · Post by **Bluefront** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 2:51 am

EvilNick....I don't know about that particular filter, but if it says "filtrate", a 3M brand name, it's probably good. The problem is surface area. If you put a flat piece over your fan, you will cut down the airflow quite a bit....maybe 50% or more. Then you'll find that filter will clog quickly, further reducing airflow. That's why pleated filters are so much better....more surface area.

Of course it's up to you. But for me, filtering is important, particularly at low noise levels, with little maintenance.....

EvilNick · Post by **EvilNick** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 9:39 am

Yeah it's 3M Filtrete, but I can only find the flat kind here, not the pleated kind.
I intend to make my intake fans suck air through it rather than blow through it. Anyway, thanks for ur tips.

The thing about the Xaser case I'm using is that theres a slot in the bottom of the front bezel where I can just slide my homemade filter frame up and in front of the intake fans. So anytime I wanna clean it, I just pop it out, vacumn and dust it abit and its back in clean.

jinu117 · Post by **jinu117** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 12:48 pm

Reason for plated... since filters are restrictive in nature, introducing more surface area helps... used to be car nutz... :p
There are some cheap car airfilters available at local auto store anyway.

Blasted me... just saw bluefront already replied same thing :p

DanceMan · Post by **DanceMan** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 2:10 pm

I'm quite surprised to see several people say automotive filters were cheap. I would have expected the opposite.
Regarding furnace filters: The material is not all the same. They are sold in various efficiencies relating to how small the particles they will filter. Cost increases with efficiency. If you're feeling adventurous, I would buy the largest furnace filter available at a reasonable price, cut the material to the size desired and make your own frame for it. The frame is just folded cardboard with the material glued to it.

esn · Post by **esn** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 3:04 pm

Hi Bluefront,

Bluefront wrote:The problem is surface area. If you put a flat piece over your fan, you will cut down the airflow quite a bit....maybe 50% or more. Then you'll find that filter will clog quickly, further reducing airflow. That's why pleated filters are so much better....more surface area.

Of course it's up to you. But for me, filtering is important, particularly at low noise levels, with little maintenance.....

Being from a 4-stroke dirt bike background, I've always been partial to K&N filters. Have you ever considered using them?

-- Eric

Bluefront · Post by **Bluefront** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 3:29 pm

K&N filter material is cotton....and needs to be oiled slightly to catch dust. I don't think it would work well if left dry.

IMHO....sucking a little oil into an internal combustion engine won't hurt anything. But I wouldn't want to do that to a computer.

esn · Post by **esn** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 3:49 pm

Bluefront wrote:K&N filter material is cotton....and needs to be oiled slightly to catch dust. I don't think it would work well if left dry.

IMHO....sucking a little oil into an internal combustion engine won't hurt anything. But I wouldn't want to do that to a computer.

I had thought the same thing about the oil. Even the smallest amount wouldn't be nice.

As to running it dry, I'd have to see a new, unoiled filter and compare it to other filter material before I was convinced that it wouldn't work well. But, I'll not worry about it now as I'm not expecting to build, nor mod, a computer for quite some time. I was just curious as to your thoughts on the subject.

-- Eric

Bluefront · Post by **Bluefront** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 4:23 pm

FWIW....Here's a link to a thread which contains some info on filters, as well as links to my five best filtered computer setups.

EvilNick · Post by **EvilNick** » Sat Jun 19, 2004 10:56 pm

I went to the auto center near my place today to look for some pleated filters. The first few I saw were some cabin filters, but they were about US$30 which is like a quarter of my monthly allowance, so that won't work.

THen I saw another one in a frame, a cabin filter for a Honda Accord that was only about US$4. However, my original plan was to fit a filter in front of my intakes so they would be drawing air through the filter.

THis Honda filter was too big or me to fit in my intended position, so I can only fit it inside the casing itself. This mean that my intakes will now be trying to push air through it. Is the push or pull method better?

Bluefront · Post by **Bluefront** » Sun Jun 20, 2004 3:19 am

Trying to "push" air through a filter never works very well with a low-power fan. The problem has to do with back pressure.

You're running into problems I have faced. There just isn't enough room for a good filter behind the front bezel of most cases. That's the reason I am now using the bottom of the case for filtration systems. Simply it's usually an un-used area that can be modded w/o much trouble.

EvilNick · Post by **EvilNick** » Sun Jun 20, 2004 3:36 am

Hrm, I did consider going at my case front with some tin snips and making a big rectangle hole for the filter frame, then move my intake fans in behind it so they're still pulling and not pushing.

Guess I'll either start modding or get the flat aircon Filtrete instead.
Thanks for the help bluefront!

Gooserider · Post by **Gooserider** » Mon Aug 09, 2004 9:16 pm

Supposedly if a K&N filter is oiled properly (not to much oil) it doesn't put any oil residue on either the inside or outside. Considering that a K&N claims much lower airflow resistance than the same size conventional air filter I would think they'd be worth trying...

Gooserider