Pls help me choose memory for A8R-MVP

Xstatic · Post by **Xstatic** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 10:34 am

A new build; going to assemble for first time. Going AMD for first time. Long time lurker on this GREAT site. This will be my third quiet PC.

Decided to go with P150 case and its NEO430, an Asus A8R-MVP and x2 4400 (or the 4800 depending on how I feel the day I'm actually at the checkout) with SI-120 cooler.

I’ll move my twin 10000 rpm 74Gb Raptors in RAID1 from my current machine. (Fabulous, fantastic, *fast* & QUIET drives BTW). Have already bot an Evga 7800GT CO as the vid card and have installed the V1-Ultra.

I *may* try some o/c if there is an “easy auto” setting in the bios, but this is my primary business computer so STABIITY even trumps quiet, and fast comes from higher end components.

I typically have dozens of windows and business programs open, (word, excel, outlook, FrontPage, AutoCAD, Photoshop, and numerous others), and since I work from home, my current favorite game is Quake4. So 2 GB is what I want this time around.

I have no idea how to select memory, so I turn this over to you knowledgeable people. What’s STABLE and fast? Thanks in advance.

Aris · Post by **Aris** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 11:24 am

memory is memory. some people have inclination towards certain company's, but in general if it fits in the slot and has a low cas latency then its a good stick.

overclocking is a whole other ballpark though. i dont overclock so i dont even consider a stick of memory's "potential" in this area when i'm looking at buying more.

what i look for, in order of priority:

1. low cas latency
2. price

i used to buy nothing but corsair, but they just charge way too much for the brand name now a days. lately ive been looking at PQI and Patriot memory sticks. their prices are very competitive.

computergeek22 · Post by **computergeek22** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 12:54 pm

If you're planning to overclock your memory, this memory has proved among the best for overclocking in terms of giving more options when o/cing the processor and ram : http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6820231021

This ram is also pretty affordable right now as you can get it shipped w/tax(for california residents) for ~220. If you're not a CA resident it's even cheaper around ~204 shipped.

Shining Arcanine · Post by **Shining Arcanine** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 12:56 pm

Might I suggest Crucial:

http://www.crucial.com/

They make reliable memory, and it is priced fairly.

Newegg is selling their 2GB DDR400 memory for $87.99 less than what they ask for it:

http://www.newegg.com/product/Product.a ... T12864Z40B

computergeek22 · Post by **computergeek22** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 12:58 pm

If you aren't going to overclock there's some similar G.SKill ram for the same price that has 2-3-3-5 low timings. This will give a benefit as lower timings are more important than memory speed.

computergeek22 · Post by **computergeek22** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 12:59 pm

crucial is quite expensive unless you go for the entry-level stuff.

Xstatic · Post by **Xstatic** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 1:48 pm

Aris: Thanks for the quick reply. Memory is something I've always let my local shop choose, so I've never had to pay attention.

Therefore I don't know what CAS is or how it relates to speed and stability.

computergeek22: THANK YOU for your work on this!

Cost is secondary to primary goal of stability and any o/c will be **mild**; I know the board & bios are known to be o/c friendly is all. If I can find something in the bios within about 1/2 hour knowing NOTHING to give me a bit of a hit , then I'll try it. Otherwise, I won't.

Crucial.com does not yet list the A8R-MVP in their selection wiz. Kingston does and lists both 333Mhz and 400MHz DDR Non-ECC (3-3-3) as recommendations.

And this I really can't understand: does not the bus run at a certain speed and require a certain speed mem? Or is it that you can use 333 for crappy performance, 400 for the board spec, and 500 for when you o/c.

How does the system adjust to these different speeds? I've not seen a mem profile in the bios I use now.

What are the ramifications of using the 500Mhz and not going o/c?

computergeek22 · Post by **computergeek22** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 6:42 pm

There's no problem with running your ram at 500 mhz (500mhz DDR, 250 single) except that there's no performance benefit from running it at 250* as opposed to 200 (400mhz ddr). You have to have a really powerful processor to allow the processor to take up the bandwidth of 250 memory. Example:

DDR400 memory is PC3200 or 3.2gigs/sec
DDR500 memory is PC4000 or 4.0gigs/sec

You need an extremely powerful processor to make use of the extra bandwidth provided by the pc4000 so pc3200 is the best bet. In other words DDR500 isn't more powerful or faster than DDR400. Then one would ask why people buy DDR500 ram. The reason people go with higher rated memory(ddr500) is because when overclocking at 1:1 higher rated memory allows for more options.

Example: Your processor maxes out at 280mhz htt frequency w/ multiplier of 10.

DDR400 ram will only allow 200mhz htt frequency of the processor at 1:1 settings. So the processor is limited to 200 @ 10multiplier = 2000mhz

DDR500 ram will allow 250mhz htt frequency at 1:1. So the processor is now limited to 250 @ 10 multiplier = 2500mhz.

Now the thing with Athlon 64 is you can use a thing called a memory divider that allows for more overclocking. Memory dividers don't hurt performance either.

Example: Processor maxes out at 3000mhz @ 10 multiplier

Your ram is DDR400 thus it and the htt frequency is limited to 200mhz. This however can be fixed by a divider instead of 1:1, you use 2:3. This allows you to run the htt frequency at 300 while running the ram at 200. Thus you can o/c the processor to 3 gigz while still keeping the ram at DDR400. There is no performance loss to running a divider.

Obviously I'm not that learned in this aspect either but there are various more in-depth overclocking guides that can be found @ hardocp or DFI street. Hope this explains things a bit.

computergeek22 · Post by **computergeek22** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 6:46 pm

Personally, I was planning on getting the 2gb black G.Skill modules that were DDR500 rated. Why? I was planning on getting an opteron 175 w/ a multiplier of 11. If I run at 1:1 settings I would be able to overclock my processor (250x11) 2750mhz w/ my ram at DDR500. However, this would be the best case scenario but I must wait and see because not all processors can overclock so well as each processor is different even the ones from the same batch. The memory however is rated at DDR500 so one can assume (or at least I hope) that it will work at that speed.

Though if you really wanted some premium memory not considering cost, there are some PC4000 EB sticks from OCZ that sell for around $300 for a pair (2gb). I personally would go for the g.skill because I think it's the best value and best bang for the buck.

[rant]Stupid Asus! Why can't you dumbbuts just release a good bios w/the board! Now MY purchase of the A8R is delayed because of you!!![/rant]

McBanjo · Post by **McBanjo** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 8:46 pm

Asus A8N-SLI has or had issues with atleast Kingston HyperX, thats based on Samsung TCCD.
No idea if that's any issues on A8R but thought I mension it.
Good memorys otherwise

At the bottom of this page is a good explonation about CAS and so:
http://www.kingston.com/hyperx/products/khx.asp

Doesn't explain how it works but atleast what it is.

Been looking at memorys the last 8 months or so (planning for the future and hoping) and for me it's either Crucial Ballistix or OCZ platinum. Both PC4000 and 2x1Gb
Probibly end up as Crucial.
Corsair does have a damn good customer support tho. Probibly one of the best I've seen but Crucial and OCZ products beat them (what I've read on reviews atleast)

stupid · Post by **stupid** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 7:39 am

I typically use either Corsair or Crucial for the PCs I've built for myself since 1998. Corsair has been pretty good to but a bit pricey. Crucial is also very good as well and tends to have less compatibility issues than most other brands because Crucial is Micron's own subsidiary peddling Micron's own chips.

I'm not a big overclocker since I generally do not push my CPU more 10% beyond stock speed. Therefore I tend to stick to CAS 2.5 memory. But I might consider using CAS 2 sticks in my upcoming build; got to do a little research to determine the cost/benefit though.

Bob_the_lost · Post by **Bob_the_lost** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 1:47 pm

You're asking in the wrong place

Read some reviews at www.anandtech.com, i'd go for the most expensive stuff they recomend if you're even thinking about a 4800.

BTW it's far too easy to overclock a 4400 to faster than a stock 4800, and for the extra money the 4800 just isn't cost effective.

(Maybe wait for the M2 chips to come out?)

Xstatic · Post by **Xstatic** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 4:19 pm

Bob_the_lost:

ACK! Based on the ram-is-ram theory above, here is what I selected, but there is still a day or so.

Corsair TWINX2048-3200 2GB DDR400 XMS3200
http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/ProductDe ... e=80097-40

I also did elect to go with the 4800, but this is because o/c will still require months to understand. I did read the anandtech article here:
http://www.anandtech.com/memory/showdoc.aspx?i=2560

but I came away thinking "there sure are a lot of choices", which was the reason for this thread in the first place. PLEASE someone, make my life easy - here's my cc - buy something for me!

If there's something on zipzoom, let me know 'cause I need to buy this week. (zipzoom because the mvp is in stock there).

Thanks!

BigA · Post by **BigA** » Sun Jan 08, 2006 8:37 pm

I just finished building an A8R-MVP system in my basement and can offer the following advice. For my system, I ordered two 512 MB PC3200 Crucial Ballistix modules from Newegg:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6820148007

1. QVL
Regardless of which RAM you purchase, your first step should be to go to the ASUS website and check the QVL (qualified vendor list) for your motherboard. QVL provides a listing of the different RAM chips which ASUS has certified for the A8R-MVP.

2. Dual Channel
The ASUS A8R-MVP supports dual channel memory access if your RAM meets two requirements:
* You must have two (or four) identical memory modules
* For two memory modules, they must be installed in slots 1 and 3

3. Value RAM for overclocking
OCZ PC3200 Rev2 Platinum is supposed to be the Cadillac of memory modules for overclocking, but it comes at Cadillac prices. At a much lower price, Crucial Ballistix was a good choice for me. Although the latencies aren't as good as some of the other choices at stock speeds, the RAM is overclockable and the latencies do not drop off much. This results in very fast timings at higher speeds. I overclocked my RAM from DDR400 to DDR480 and my timings went from 2-2-2-8 to 2.5-2-3-10 with an A64-3000 (Venice E3).

These results were not inconsistent with the overclocking results obtained at Anandtech:
http://www.anandtech.com/memory/showdoc.aspx?i=2226&p=2

Please note that the Anandtech link also shows a picture of one of the Micron chips and that the model number for the Crucial Ballistix memory chips and is one of the chips listed on the ASUS QVL for the A8R-MVP motherboard.

CAVEAT: Although the Crucial Ballistix RAM is rated for 2.8V (as opposed to a normal voltage of 2.6V), some people have reported burning the RAM up at 2.8V. Being conservative, I set my RAM at 2.65V and have not had any problems. I am not planning to run the RAM at a higher voltage than 2.65V. More details are available at:
http://www.sharkyforums.com/showthread.php?t=278259

4. General thoughts re: Overclocking
Overclocking the A8R-MVP is not hard, but the settings are not well documented. If you are planning to overclock your system, you should keep in mind that:
* No two systems will overclock the same
* You overclock at your own risk
* The settings for the A8R-MVP are labeled somewhat oddly
* Careful research is strongly recommended, some good starting places are:

http://www.deep-powder.net/OC_Guide/Mem ... _Guide.htm

http://www.sharkyforums.com/forumdisplay.php?f=12

http://www.sharkyforums.com/showthread.php?t=222790

I apologize if any of this is stating the obvious.

Xstatic · Post by **Xstatic** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 3:14 pm

bigA: You are NOT stating the obvious, since memory and o/c are new to me. THANKS for the o/c sites.

I have researched in the mean time, and here's what I bot:

Asus A8R-MVP Radeon Xpress 200 Athlon 64
AMD Athlon 64 X2 4400+
Corsair TWINX2048-3500LLPRO 2GB Kit DDR433 XMS3500 ProSeries

Hopefully I can o/c to meet the 4800 & I used the money saved on the processor to get some fast o/c mem.

Thanks all for yer help!!

Pls help me choose memory for A8R-MVP

Pls help me choose memory for A8R-MVP

ASUS A8R-MVP / Crucial Ballistix RAM