Symptoms from taking Nexium tabs

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brightman
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Symptoms from taking Nexium tabs

Post by brightman » Mon Feb 27, 2006 9:07 am

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Last edited by brightman on Sat Apr 24, 2010 2:54 am, edited 1 time in total.

~El~Jefe~
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Post by ~El~Jefe~ » Mon Feb 27, 2006 9:47 am

ok first off you said HDTV.

thats the problem.

I mean if it goes up to like 720p, thats ok to have a single core for future use. I have read how powerful 2 cores is in 1080i and 1080p.

NFG here

THere is an asrock nfg micro board on main page, passive, has 6150 graphics, looks really good and is 70 dollars about. I would consider this a win until I ugpraded for better audio. Audigy2zs would releive the processor from dealing with sound and be clearer to the ears. THe sound is of moderate quality as is, but heck, it's on board sound on a 70 dollar machine.

It is a 939 board, so that would be different from a sempron solution of course. I wouldnt toy with turion. instead I would get a lower ghz processor and undervolt it. turion just has such limited desktop compatibility, I didtched the idea long ago.

IN direct answer of your post, I would say, if you go with the venice on newegg for 754, which is much better than going sempron for it, I would look at Via 8t800 pro chipsets. they run sata, are rated at the highest speed for 754 platform, and having owned one, it runs very easily on a pasive heatsink. It has 15 watts less load usage than nforce options. 15 watts is a heck of a lot considering it uses only 30ish.

I looked around at respectable motherboard for 754.

I would go 939, so many competing companies for small form hdtv machines.
msi good one

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Post by stupid » Mon Feb 27, 2006 11:10 am

I would say that a single core CPU should be good enough to playback video onto a HDTV. Currently the Radeon X1xxx series offers better video playback than the GeForce 7xxx series. It should also be noted that nVidia's PureVideo costs $20 - $40 for the video software optimization. There is no such additional cost for the Radeon X1xxx series.

Encoding 1080i or 1080p is the killer especially if you intend on using the 2-pass method of encoding. A single core can do it, but dual core will be able to do it even faster. I only have SDTV right now, and an Athlon XP 2600+ HTPC. I capture using the HUFFYUV codec, then I recompress using DivX under the 2-pass method. I only get about 27fps while encoding. That means a 1 hour TV show will take over 2 hours to encode to DivX. HDTV is much higher resolution, and will definitely kill my HTPC.

A low cost Athlon 64 3200+ will probably boost encoding FPS by 40% - 50% over my Athlon XP 2600+, or 42fps (based on some performance benchmarks). Not too shabby for SDTV which is 640x480. However, moving to 1080i/p poses some serious demands. 1080i or 1080p has a resolutiun of 1920x1080. That is almost 7x the resolution of 640x480 (a SDTV has less than that). For arguement sake, let's just say that HDTV will take 5 times longer to encode than SDTV (because of the resolution). That means the hypethical 42fps for the Athlon 64 3200+ on SDTV gets cut down to 8fps for HDTV. That means a 1 hour TV program at 1920x1080 resolution will take 3.6 hours to encode, for each pass. Under the DivX 2-pass method that means it will take 7.2 hours total to process 1 hour of TV programing.

These numbers are only estimates since:

1. I do not have HDTV.
2. I do not have an Athlon 64 X2 yet.

brightman
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Post by brightman » Mon Feb 27, 2006 1:50 pm

Thanks for the quick replies!

I should have been more clear in that the frontend only needs to decode MPEG streams. Any possible encoding will get done on the backend.

As such my requirements aren't as severe as most HDTV HTPC systems.

I think El Jefe's suggestion to go down the 939 route is probably more sensible than the sempron/turion approach.

So now I want to get a mobo that runs as cool as possible once it's crammed inside a nice matx sized case. Choosing a mobo such as the asrock that has good enough onboard graphics so I don't need an extra card will really help in this respect , need to check mythtv requirements in this respect (I'm connecting to my LCD TV via VGA not TV-out/svid etc).

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Post by Chang » Mon Feb 27, 2006 7:20 pm

Ironically, capturing and playing HDTV is less intensive than SDTV. HDTV is broadcast already encoded as a MPEG-2 stream. All that needs to be done is writing the stream to your hard drive. Playback is just decoding the stream, and again, isn't all that intensive.

If I remember correctly, I was able to undervolt and underclock my mobile 35W Barton to 1.6 Ghz or so and catpure/watch HDTV fine. My 9600XT was good enough to push it at native resoltutions fine. Right now I've got a 3200+ Venice in an Xpress 200 mobo. Onboard was good enough for overlay display at native resolutions over DVI. VMR modes take a little more horsepower.

If you're starting new, I'd say try a 939 board with the Nvidia's 6150 or ATI's Xpress 200. Pick a fanless mobo and see if onboard is enough for your front end. If not, you can add a low/mid level card that should be more than enough to handle it.

Finally, don't count on Cool 'N Quiet to help you with system temps if you're planning on watching HDTV. Watching 720p takes just enough CPU cycles to introduce a stutter. CNQ drops it down to 1 GHz. It peaks at maybe 50% at that rate, which causes it to jump back up to 2 GHz. And it drops back down to under 20% at 2 GHz, which causes it to drob back down to 1 GHz. It almost makes me wish I had gotten a faster processor. . .

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Post by ~El~Jefe~ » Mon Feb 27, 2006 7:50 pm

all of this hdtv stuff makes me weirded out.

i mean, I play a game rendered in real time with 64 people and realistic graphics at resolutions way above hdtv...

yet Maurie Povich on channel 7 is supposed to bog down my system?

something doesnt make sense about this whole thing. Must be some tiny component that is missing on either our vid cards or the software.

I would guess that my dual core 4200 and 9800 pro aiwonder have more power than a 200 dollar sony product for my tv?

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Post by Chang » Mon Feb 27, 2006 8:17 pm

Like I said, watching and capturing HDTV doesn't really much horsepower. The CPU in my old box was clocked at 1.6 Ghz and it was more than enough. I think I've heard of people using Radeon 9100's to view it. Again, since it's 2D, so long as your video card can display 1920x1080, you're golden. If you run your display at less than that, you'll need even less. I'd say the majority of systems built in the last year and a half are probably more than enough to work with HDTV.

What does mess up a lot of people are the decoders -- namely you need to have the right decoders installed. That and hard drive space. 24 is clocking in around 4.5 GB per hour. 1080i shows are roughly double that. I've still got the Superbowl sitting on my hard drive and it's just under 70 GB.

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Post by nutball » Tue Feb 28, 2006 12:13 am

Chang wrote:Ironically, capturing and playing HDTV is less intensive than SDTV. HDTV is broadcast already encoded as a MPEG-2 stream. All that needs to be done is writing the stream to your hard drive. Playback is just decoding the stream, and again, isn't all that intensive.
The situation this side of the Big Pond is a whole lot less simple than I think it is in the US. As things stand there's no HDTV content being broadcast over the airwaves (with the possible exception of a limited test service from one transmitter in London). This situation isn't going to change very fast as far as I can tell; it'll be a year or three before it's even rolled out OTA, and it'll be ~2012 before it's ubiquitous.

Most HDTV content coming soon will be from cable and satellite providers, both of whom are saying they'll be offering limited services this year. Getting at the raw data stream from those is ... challenging, as far as I'm aware, so re-encoding the output of the STB would seem to be the only option at this time. Or am I wrong?

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Post by nutball » Tue Feb 28, 2006 12:26 am

brightman wrote:So now I want to get a mobo that runs as cool as possible once it's crammed inside a nice matx sized case. Choosing a mobo such as the asrock that has good enough onboard graphics so I don't need an extra card will really help in this respect , need to check mythtv requirements in this respect (I'm connecting to my LCD TV via VGA not TV-out/svid etc).
Going integrated graphics is a very good idea I think, if nothing else it reduces the amount of clutter inside small cases!

The MSI mATX board that El Jefe linked to has DVI out too, and it had piqued my curiosity recently for that reason alone (I'm pondering getting a LCD TV with DVI input), however I don't think that the FID model is sold in the UK, only the FIL model without DVI (which would be OK if you're only after VGA though, of course!).

Gigabyte do a interesting looking S939 mATX board based on the NVIDIA 6150 chipset, which (allegedly) has hardware assist for H.264 playback. It's not clear that it allows for undervolting though.

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Post by Hifriday » Tue Feb 28, 2006 11:43 am

nutball wrote:Gigabyte do a interesting looking S939 mATX board based on the NVIDIA 6150 chipset, which (allegedly) has hardware assist for H.264 playback. It's not clear that it allows for undervolting though.
I believe the Gigabyte model does not have DVI. The MSI does, also the similarly speced ASUS A8NVM-CSM discussed here. Some people have had problems with the 6150/ASUS mb, notably early buyers, but so far I haven't had any problems with mine. However ASUS annoyingly does not include the video and spdif bracket which MSI properly does. If you're planing a hi-res screen, careful that the onboard video at 1920x1200 is only able to drive 16bit color (believe this a 6150 limitation?), however at 1600x1200 it can reach true color.

I don't have any experience with HDTV mpeg streams, but playing back H264 seems to be quite demanding on the CPU, at least using Quicktime. Using a Sempron 3000+/1GB Ram and K8M800 onboard video was only able to get the 24 fps Ice Age2 trailer to playback smoothly at 420p, it was choppy going to 720p. On a NF3 A64 3200+ system with a 6800GT, 720p was ok, but not 1080p. For my old XPM NF2 HTPC, unfortunately couldn't even manage 480p. I guess the price of high quality low bandwidth streaming is heavy cpu loading.
Where did you read about the H264 hardware support on the Gigabyte board? Is it specific to Gigabyte or the 6150?

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Post by Hifriday » Tue Feb 28, 2006 1:04 pm


Chang
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Post by Chang » Tue Feb 28, 2006 1:21 pm

You're right, I should have prefaced it as being for ATSC broadcasts. But I'm fairly sure you've got it even easier in some ways being in DVB-T country. I believe the SDTV carried there is handled the same was as our digital broadcasts with what I'm assuming to be lesser bandwidth from fewer lines of resolution. While you'll have the same issues trying to capture analog, the ease for capturing digital should be similar regardless of location.

Of course never having been to the UK, much less dealt with DVB-T broadcasts, much of that is an educated guess.

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Post by brightman » Tue Feb 28, 2006 1:29 pm

My primary requirements are to decode/display SDTV streamed from my backend..(the original stream is MPEG2 Freeview so the backend has very little work to do). Every now and then I'd like to be able to display HDTV clips or movies. DVI is not important as I'll always use VGA.

nutball the FID MSI is available in the UK here:

http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/ProductI ... tID=327680
Finally, don't count on Cool 'N Quiet to help you with system temps if you're planning on watching HDTV. Watching 720p takes just enough CPU cycles to introduce a stutter. CNQ drops it down to 1 GHz. It peaks at maybe 50% at that rate, which causes it to jump back up to 2 GHz. And it drops back down to under 20% at 2 GHz, which causes it to drob back down to 1 GHz. It almost makes me wish I had gotten a faster processor. . .


This is a bit worrying, Chang was this on your 1.6 GHz system? It's a bit poor that CNQ can end up flipping between states!

So it looks like the mobo choice so far is between the Asus, MSI or Gigabyte...

The question is if I slap one of these in a Silverstone LC11 case with a 90nm Venice 3000+ and get away with using onboard graphics will I need all the case fans to be going or can I get rid of them all :D Somewhere in between these I suspect! Need to investigate heat sinks/fans for such a system.

HiFriday yeah I saw that thread... interesting!

Thanks for all the feedback!

Thanks for all of the helpful comments!

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Post by Chang » Tue Feb 28, 2006 1:58 pm

The CNQ issues are with my current A64 3200+ Venice system. I believe it's just in playback that I run into CNQ induced stuttering issues, but I don't think I've tested records to verify. In any case, it's just a matter of right clicking the taskbar icon to flip between power modes.

If you want to use the LC11, I'd suggest you try to use a USB tuner instead of a PCI one (assuming they make one for DVB-T). My old analog tuner card dumped a fair amount of heat into my system. My current HDTV card does too. Not having to deal with that extra heat and riser cards configurations is probably worth it.

Finally, H.264 encoded WMV HD is also a different issue than analog TV or digital TV or HDTV. I feel that there really isn't enough content out there to worry about it now, especially for a HTPC box. IIRC, ATI's H.264 hardware assist is recently out but is only available as an addition purchase (for the Cyberlink decoder) and may only work for certain applications. NVidia's H.264 hardware assist at best is 6 months behind ATI, and at worst is still vaporware at this point. What good is hardware assist if there aren't any decoders that utilize it, drivers that support it, and programs that take advantage of both?

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Post by brightman » Tue Feb 28, 2006 2:08 pm

If you want to use the LC11, I'd suggest you try to use a USB tuner instead of a PCI one (assuming they make one for DVB-T). My old analog tuner card dumped a fair amount of heat into my system. My current HDTV card does too. Not having to deal with that extra heat and riser cards configurations is probably worth it.
The tuners (2 Nova DVB-T tuners) are in the backend so this is not a problem. It'll just be the motherboard a 2.5inch Samsung hard drive and a whopping heatsink + fans in the case :)

Still worried about CNQ stuttering.... mythtv runs full screen with a remote control... could be interesting trying to click icons if this happens!

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Post by nutball » Wed Mar 01, 2006 2:28 am

brightman wrote:nutball the FID MSI is available in the UK here:

http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/ProductI ... tID=327680
Ah! Bonza! Komplett had it listed for a few weeks but withdrew it, nice to know there's at least one supplier!

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Post by brightman » Wed Mar 01, 2006 10:32 am

Hmm maybe using these 6150 boards with linux is not such a good idea.

Just spent a happy few hours going through this:

http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=57791

It seems that nvidia's linux support is not that great... getting it all to work (especially sound) looks 'challenging' :cry:

I think I'll have to look elsewhere for my 939 mobo maybe a VIA based one, I really want one that is most likely to work with mythtv...

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Post by nutball » Wed Mar 01, 2006 11:44 pm

Hmmm. Maybe the 6150 does need some time to mature, however I can say from first-hand experience that the NF4 NVIDIA drivers are rock-solid, sound works fine.

I'm playing around with an ATI-based mobo right now (S754 as it happens so not what you're looking for), and the results under Linux are seriously disappointing to say the least (eg. USB is seriously tempramental).

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