Shin Etsu G-751: 5C cooler with no added noise!

Post by **MikeC** » Thu May 15, 2003 3:32 pm

Are you sure you have not noticed a difference with different thermal goops?

Not enough to rave about. I do use "brand name" stuff (AS generally). Joe and Dan have both done extensive enough testing and I have little reason to doubt their findings. They have tested many dozens if not hundreds of HS, and are generally quite knowledgeable about issue related to HS/cooling. Go have a read of what Dan has to say. He just rolls his eyes & laughs at the whole "super goop" marketing thing.

Justin_R · Post by **Justin_R** » Fri May 16, 2003 2:27 pm

MikeC wrote:Joe and Dan have both done extensive enough testing and I have little reason to doubt their findings. They have tested many dozens if not hundreds of HS, and are generally quite knowledgeable about issue related to HS/cooling. Go have a read of what Dan has to say. He just rolls his eyes & laughs at the whole "super goop" marketing thing.

The jury may be out on thermal greases, but the comparative reviews at overclockers.com and Dan's Data are, frankly, crap compared to the ones from insideproject.com or ocprices.com. If you need a reason to doubt their findings, how about that neither of the former allows any time for the thermal greases to cure? Dan does allow the Nanotherm to cure, and when it does, it's scores improve significantly (although when it does cure, it's still an average performer, just as the insideproject.com report indicates). The results from overclockers or Dan's are not inconsistent with the day one results from inside project or OCprices. But unless you change your heatsink every day, the day three values from inside project or OCprices are what you should pay attention to.

Dan also fails to report the actual temperature differences he measured, instead only showing the calculated thermal resistance. It's great that he has his heater block for doing testing and all, but that doesn't excuse him from reporting his raw data.

WARNING: Partially incoherent rant follows.

Further, Dan's tirade about tweaking is partially true, but just as much nonsense. Sure, maybe you can't get a 50% general-performance gain from some simple tweak, but maybe you can (for example) tweak you OS so that it loads twice as fast. Or, you can get a 10% boost in performance by using slightly more expensive cooling, RAM, or whatever, instead of forking over $50 more for a 10% faster CPU.

But the worst is Dan's attempt at giving everyone a lesson in graphic design. His "nofib" graph distorts the data pretty heavily as well, not to mention the countless other ways in which it's a lousy data graphic. First, it doesn't really make any sense for him to use 0 C/W as a baseline for his graph. Sure, it's a theoretical minimum for thermal resistance, but no one expects a thermal grease to magically give you a 0 C/W cooling solution. Next, he has the thermal greases compared by the final thermal resistance value of the heatsink plus grease cooling solution. If he's going to be using calculated values for his chart anyway, he should go whole hog and calculate the change in thermal resistance brought about by the thermal grease and compare those. Or, he could provide a couple of other greaseless heatsinks as reference points, so we could say "SK-7 plus grease equals SLK-800 with no grease" or whatever. Hey, and maybe he could actually listen to "The Visual Display of Quantitative Information" instead of just name-dropping it and make a table of his 9 data points instead of an Excel default bar chart.

Dan's usually on the ball, but he dropped it big time in this thermal grease comparison.

Ex22 · Post by **Ex22** » Sun May 18, 2003 1:20 pm

Anyone buy this product from the online stores listed in this thread?

Post by **Rusty075** » Sun May 18, 2003 9:29 pm

I've used it for my last several heatsink swaps. It is a pain to work with, but gets easier with practice. I've seen temps drop 3-4°C compared to AS3.

ez2remember · Post by **ez2remember** » Sun May 18, 2003 10:30 pm

Ex22 wrote:Anyone buy this product from the online stores listed in this thread?

Yep, I bought it from chillblast.com.

Post by **Ralf Hutter** » Mon May 19, 2003 4:45 am

Ex22 wrote:Anyone buy this product from the online stores listed in this thread?

Yeah, I got it from the Yahoo/Taisol store.

mdaniel · Post by **mdaniel** » Tue May 20, 2003 6:12 am

I got it from Chilliblast and I highly recommend it. I did the 3 day burn in as OCPrices did. My AS3 temps were 41 C - 42 C @ idle and 46 C - 47C at load. On day one, my Idle temp was 40 C and my load temp was 45 C. On day 3, my idle temp was 37 C - 38 C and load temp was 42 C - 43 C.

You can read the details of my experience at AMDMB, Fourms: Cases & Cooling: Shin Etsu G751...WOW!

AS3 has been relegated to replacing AS2 on GPU and chipset HS's.

Make sure you heat it up before you apply it though.

Oli · Post by **Oli** » Thu May 22, 2003 3:10 pm

[deleted]

johnoh · Post by **johnoh** » Sun Jun 01, 2003 10:08 am

http://www.meetthegeeks.org/ourreview/2 ... etsu7798d/

Apparently there's a new kid in town and is easier to spread. No idea where to buy it. Anyone?

halcyon · Post by **halcyon** » Sun Jun 01, 2003 11:07 am

Shin Etsu X-23-7762. Apparently the successor to G-751 and should be better.

http://www.web-jussi.com/cgi-bin/sql/tu ... l?id=24149

I have a tube of this on my desk as I write this, but will have to wait a few days before I can even install it.

regards,
Halcyon

johnoh · Post by **johnoh** » Sun Jun 01, 2003 12:13 pm

Halcyon any guidance for a US resident who wants to buy some?

grnarrow · Post by **grnarrow** » Sun Jun 01, 2003 2:19 pm

johnoh wrote:http://www.meetthegeeks.org/ourreview/2 ... etsu7798d/

Apparently there's a new kid in town and is easier to spread. No idea where to buy it. Anyone?

That review seems to be from some time in 2002. Wonder why news about it doesn't seem to have spread. There seems to be a whole aura of mystery around this Shin Etsu stuff. Hardly anyone carries it, and the company website, while it mentions G-749, doesn't list G-751 or this 'new' stuff.

Ex22 · Post by **Ex22** » Sun Jun 01, 2003 2:58 pm

I'm confused,

Which one is the newer stuff?

-Shin Etsu X-23-7762
-Shin Etsu X-23-7798

Why is it so damn hard to get? They need a better marketing Dept.

halcyon · Post by **halcyon** » Mon Jun 02, 2003 7:17 am

Ex22,

I'm not sure either myself. I know that there is a more viscous and more liquid version of X-23. The one I have (X-23-7762) is the more viscous version.

Perhaps the 7798 is the more liquid version?

I can't seem to be able to find information about this on the web.

The reason for "hard to get" (info and goods) is because Shin Etsu is a huge B2B chemical supplier and they don't need to sell hobbyists like us. The marketing is pretty much left to resellers. This stuff is probably sold in barrels rather than syringes if you order straight from Shin Etsu

Where to get this in the US? I don't know, but I'd try the same sources that have sold the G-751 (Chiliblast, etc). If you want to try ordering from Finland (postage will probably kill you), then e-mail Only4Pro at their e-mail address which is on their web page at:

http://www.web-jussi.com/only4pro/kilpailu.shtml

If I find a US or UK source, I'll post in this thread.

regards,
Halcyon

Ex22 · Post by **Ex22** » Thu Jun 05, 2003 12:18 am

This is interesting.

If you get the ThermalTake 7+ you get Shin-Etsu X-23-7783D

http://www.thermaltake.com/products/venus/1770.htm

Too many versions, but atleast it's X23. now how good it that Heat Sink?

http://www.thermaltake.com.mx/details/a1480.htm
Shin-Etsu X-23-7762

johnoh · Post by **johnoh** » Thu Jun 05, 2003 12:46 pm

Shin Etsu X-23-7762
Shin Etsu X-23-7798
Shin-Etsu X-23-7783D

makes you wonder if the guy who started the stepping-code craze on cpus went to work for
shin-etsu

halcyon · Post by **halcyon** » Thu Jun 05, 2003 11:13 pm

I have the Shin Etsu X-23-7762 in my system now, but only for one day at the time of writing.

I also changed the PSU at the same time, so I have to change my old PSU back to get comparable readings to my Arctic Silver III readings.

Will report back later.

regards,
Halcyon

dukla2000 · Post by **dukla2000** » Fri Jun 06, 2003 2:32 am

Radeonman wrote:Since Shin-Etsu is in town, I called them up. They have minimum order of $120, but that will get me 50 grams (1 gram/syringe, about 2 uses/syringe) of X-23-7762 (the best they have availible, 7798 and 7783D are no longer in production). I'm debating buying me a whole load of shin-etsu and selling it off to friendly SPCR members at cost + shipping. Not sure how curious you guys really are into this stuff, but here's your chance to get it as cheap as it gets.

I'ld be interested. Would also be willing to act as a gateway for others in the UK/EU if that would save postage.

Also nice to know from the horse's mouth that X-23-7762 is the state of the art. One remaining question, is the G751 something even more obsolete than the X-23 series?

LushMD · Post by **LushMD** » Fri Jun 06, 2003 5:52 am

Radeonman wrote:Since Shin-Etsu is in town, I called them up. They have minimum order of $120, but that will get me 50 grams (1 gram/syringe, about 2 uses/syringe) of X-23-7762 (the best they have availible, 7798 and 7783D are no longer in production). I'm debating buying me a whole load of shin-etsu and selling it off to friendly SPCR members at cost + shipping. Not sure how curious you guys really are into this stuff, but here's your chance to get it as cheap as it gets.

I would definitely be interested. Please post/PM any further details. Many thanks. Take care.

halcyon · Post by **halcyon** » Fri Jun 06, 2003 7:39 am

Shin Etsu X-23-7762.

I've now had it for almost two days in my system.

I have now put back the same PSU I had when I originally had Arctic Silver III as the thermal paste.

I can report that my CPU temps (measured from the core of my Thoroughbred XP via MBM) have gone UP c. 5 degrees celcius maybe even a bit more.

I'm not very happy about this

I will wait another day and see if there is a change.

If not, I will reapply it and try again to cure the paste for 2-3 days.

I'll report back what happens.

My initial experience with X-23-7762 is not positive.

Ah well, just my luck :/

regards,
Halcyon

dukla2000 · Post by **dukla2000** » Fri Jun 06, 2003 4:22 pm

halcyon wrote:have gone UP c. 5 degrees celcius

When I first read your post I thought it said .5 (i.e 0.5). Now I see 5 and understand your disappointment!!

Radeonman wrote:1 gram/syringe, about 2 uses/syringe

Same old chestnut, how to apply goop. My trusty old Arctic Silver (original, none of this bleeding edge stuff) is in a 6.5g syringe and has lasted many CPUs (certainly more than 13, my guess 20-30). Despite all the instructions I actually just put about a 2mm 'line' in the middle of the core (all my CPUs have been AMD, and the K6-3 were capless so all were 'small contact'), and stuck the hs on. Seems to work fine for me, the footprint when I remove the hs always looks good. But to get to the question, where does the 0.5g/application come from because seems much more than I use?

dukla2000 · Post by **dukla2000** » Sat Jun 07, 2003 2:55 am

I'm still keen for the group deal (unless halcyon reports get even more depressing) - my original AS is definately close to pension age and I may as well go for the bleeding edge at these prices.

Also am comfortable for you to assume me for around 10 tubes on the assumption the USA/UK postage is not outrageous. I figure I need a couple for myself, maybe some other EU folk are interested, else I can try shift a few on EBay UK. PM if/when the group buy firms up: I can post $ notes (or £ or € or even my cherished 10,000,000 note, except that is Turkish Lira and worth less than you thought

) is probably cheapest for me, else EFT is no problem either except charges on small values are disproportionate.

Ex22 · Post by **Ex22** » Mon Jun 09, 2003 10:33 am

Halcyon, how did the new application go?

I'd be in for a group deal. Where you located Radeonman?

Ex22 · Post by **Ex22** » Mon Jun 09, 2003 11:40 pm

Great, let me know if you end up doing this, I'd love to try the new thermal grease.

mdaniel · Post by **mdaniel** » Tue Jun 10, 2003 3:40 am

If your next results come out better, I too would be interested in purchasing some.

Thanks