case fan Noctua NF-P12 Vortex or Scythe S-FLEX or other help

meridius · Post by **meridius** » Sun Jan 31, 2010 4:27 am

Hi all soory for hugh post but i am pulling my hair out i need to replace the fasn in the antec case to make it sound better but keep the same cfm.

i just can not seem to figure out what fasn to get

Q1
I am wanting to replace my antec p183 fans and have been toled by a couple thats its between the

Noctua NF-P12 Vortex
Scythe S-FLEX 1200RPM Ultra Quiet 49.0 CFM, 20.1 dB

the fans in the antec case spec are (Low setting 39CFM, 25 dBA)
but the review on this site says
the fans in the antec case spec are (Low setting 39CFM, 17 dBA)

so what should i go for i have been toled the Noctua NF-P12 Vortex is not realy a good case fan more designed for cpu coolers and the scythe s-flex are far better at noise levels and been a case fan but seems abit to high in the cfm making it more noise would it be better to conect a fan controler

what you think ? wnat the same sort of aire flow but have a much more qiueter system than the antec case fans

Q2
what would be better in the case i am going to add 1 intake fan in front of the hardrives to keep them cool but wanted to know is it best to have 2 rear fans or take the top fan out and block it of and just have 1 rear fan.

Q3
Also would it be better to have a faster fan at the front and slower at the back or vice versa to improve the aire flow

Q4
so if i get the scythe S-FLEX 1200RPM Ultra Quiet 49.0 CFM and run it at its full speed and get the same at the back but run it at 1000rpm this would be better or just leave it at full speed ?

Q5
I was thinking of getting the scythe S-FLEX 1200RPM Ultra Quiet 49.0 CFM and slowing it down to 1000rpm so it should be on par with the antec cfm but should be at the 15db to 17db levels would this be my best bet

Q6
i just read in another forum The Scythes will point everywhere but up, so you can't use them for top exhaust. is this true as i wanted to use a fan on the top of the case

Q7
what about a Scythe Gentle Typhoon 120mm are these just good for cpu and not case fans ? are these better than a s-flex or should i just stick with a s-flex for case as Q6 has me abit worried

Q8
the problem is i have read the reviews on here of the fans and the antec sont runn at 1200rpm at low like antec say the reviews on here of this fan seems to run about 800rpm ? is this true. if thats the case should i be looking for a 800 to 1000rpm fan to get teh same air flow as the antec fans set to low

what do you think as i am going to be ordering these soon

just found this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tptu8L6i ... r_embedded

the s-flex sounds alot loduer than the antec fans when running at 1200rpm can not understand that ? the GT are totaly silent but i can not get my head around the s-flex compaired to the antec at low setting.

can anyone figure that out as i thought the s-flex would be quieter

thejamppa · Post by **thejamppa** » Sun Jan 31, 2010 6:28 am

Hello!

Few things for you:

Manufacturer's ratings for CFM and noise are not generally very accurate and they cannot be used direct measurement with SPCR's measurement due different testing methods.

You don't need to maintain same RPM's or same CFM's. Quiet cooling is about having necessary amount of air moved while being quiet enough.

It all depends on actually what hardware you have. Generally 800 RPM slipstreams are excellent case fans which you can use for 12v and have ample CFM's with little noise. Far better option that Tricools.

Not what comes for GT, GT's are interesting fan's as they are hard to perceive. Ballbearings make some noise but its little but some may percieve it. GT's are fine option too.

Generally its no need to use higher rpm fan in front. Generally front fan(s) improve anything but HDD's if placed front of them. You may actually be fine without front fan.

I personally would not use anything greater than 800 RPM fan in front as its clsoest to you. In my P182 I have 500 rpm slipstream full speed in front. That has been more than enough well.

IMHO: depending on your hardware: 800 RPM slipstream or 1200 slipstream@ 5v would be more than enough for cooling hard hardware with much more pleasantly than tricools.

I hope this helps!

meridius · Post by **meridius** » Sun Jan 31, 2010 10:07 am

thanks but i have herd that the slipstreams are sleeve and not wanting that sort of build.

but still thanks for your input i just dont know what to go for as i want to top mount it to and posted above about people saying there no good for that well the s-flex.

every place i go seem to keep saying these s-flex are the best most quiet fasn out thre for the speed and are the best for case fans

what to do, anyone with some more input

Parappaman · Post by **Parappaman** » Sun Jan 31, 2010 11:12 am

Too many redundant question, I won't answer them.

If you seek total silence, grab some S-Flex 1600 RPM and undervolt them to 5v. If you want some more ease of use, get some Gentle Typhoons 800 RPM and run them at the max speed. Noctuas are overpriced but very neat due to the extras you get, such as silicon screws and adaptors to run them at lower speeds.
Or you could differentiate using a Slipstream 500 or 800 RPM as the vertical fan and one of the above as the horizontal top fan, thus saving some money.

Just check your pockets and pick the ones that best suit your budget, they're all great choices.

meridius · Post by **meridius** » Sun Jan 31, 2010 11:39 am

thanks

can you use a s-flex as a horizontal top fan ?

you see the s-flex, Noctuas , Gentle Typhoons are all teh same price where i can get them from.

i have a Gentle Typhoons 14500rpm for my heatsink but dont mind undervolting or getting a fan controller just want somthing better and quiet than the antec tri fans in the p183

thanks

JamieG · Post by **JamieG** » Sun Jan 31, 2010 2:50 pm

S-Flex fans are ideal for horizontal mounting like the top exhaust of the P18x series cases, as they have a fluid dynamic bearing that does not suffer from horizontal mounting. I am using a S-Flex E 1200rpm at about 5V to 7V as my top exhaust in my P182 and it is great.

Sleeve bearing fans (like the Scythe Slipstreams) are not ideal for horizontal mounting.

The GTs use a ball bearing system that should be alright for horizontal mounting. Similarly, the Noctua fans have a special type of bearing as well that should be ok for horizontal mounting as well.

My suggestion is to get an S-Flex fan - the 800rpm one if you just want to run it at full speed or the 1200rpm one if you want to undervolt it a bit but would like some headroom to turn the fan up when gaming or whatever.

As for case fans, the Slipstreams should be fine. I've heard good things about the GTs but have never used one myself. Pick whatever speed suits you - 800rpm or so if you don't want to use a fan controller or something with a bit more headroom if you want to be able to turn it up while gaming.

meridius · Post by **meridius** » Sun Jan 31, 2010 10:59 pm

thanks for that so it looks like i will be gettign 3 s-flex 1200 with fan controler for the case fans front rear and top.

I willl get a Gentle typhoon 1450 for the mega heatsink which i have been toled are a exellent combo

and that should sort me is that right is this the right option to do

thanks

thejamppa · Post by **thejamppa** » Mon Feb 01, 2010 12:15 am

Is it actually verified and tested to be true that sleeve bearing fans are not "suitable" for Horizontal or is it theory or urban legend? I think it depends manufacturer. I've run 140mm SleeveBearing YL horizontally nearly 2 years without problems.

GT's won't disapoint however. I Find their sound quality much better in greater speeds than S-flexes.

Now perhaps I should get 140mm Noctua and see how it fares against the 140mm YL...

Parappaman · Post by **Parappaman** » Mon Feb 01, 2010 1:20 am

Sleeve bearing fans won't run at the rated speed when placed horizontally, and the oil that should constantly lubricate the bearing gets out of the shaft, that's enough of a reason for me

thejamppa · Post by **thejamppa** » Mon Feb 01, 2010 5:13 am

Everyone as they please... Still nobody hasn't scientificly tested this one.

JamieG · Post by **JamieG** » Mon Feb 01, 2010 2:32 pm

I've done a simple test with a clear Blue LED Nexus fan that I have lying around and I can hear a change in the sound in free air when I rotate the fan so that it is horizontal and blowing air up, as it would be in a top exhaust position.

For what it's worth, have a look at this report from NMB (originally linked from this Wikipedia article). It may be a little biased towards ball bearing fans, but it talks about lubrication being an issue for sleeve bearing fans.

I also think that horizontal mounting places extra pressure on the sleeve bearing, as the fan weight presses down on the sleeve bearing when it is horizontally orientated to exhaust air up out of the case.

Basically, as I understand it, horizontal orientation of sleeve bearing fans may cause greater noise and also reduce lifespan. Scientifically testing the reduced lifespan potential would possibly take years of 24/7 running, given the MTBF for some sleeve fans (Scythe quotes 30,000 hours for their Slipstreams), although this may apply to fans mounted vertically.

Fallen Kell · Post by **Fallen Kell** » Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:12 pm

thejamppa wrote:Everyone as they please... Still nobody hasn't scientificly tested this one.

Yes they have. It is all about the design of how sleeve bearings work. In a sleeve bearing fan, the bearings are in a ring (sleeve) between the fan's blade structure and the fan housing/casing, much like the following animation:

When placed in a vertical orientation, the weight/load of the fan's blades is supported by the bearings (and transferred from the bearings to the fan housing). However, when placed in horizontal orientation, the weight of the fan's blades is no longer transferred through the bearings to the housing, but by direct contact of the fan's blade structure coming in direct contact with the housing. The lubrication oil for the bearing is then acting as lubrication between two direct sliding surfaces instead of rolling surfaces. The oil heats up faster and is pushed out of the housing faster due to the increased pressure on the oil. Without adding additional oil regularly, the fan will seize and fail. It is simply a matter of design physics.

Now some designs remove this problem, such as the suspended fluid bearing in the S-Flex fans. It is fundamentally a sleeve bearing, however, the housing is sealed with just a fluid (no real ball bearings) and magnets are used to suspend the fan blades and transfer the weight of the blades through to the magnets on the fan housing, not just let the blades grind against the housing surface with the oil as lubricant in a normal sleeve bearing design.

nyu3 · Post by **nyu3** » Sun Feb 07, 2010 4:13 am

I'd get the S-Flex. I've had four S-Flex 1200rpm fans, two Kama-Flex 1000rpm fans, and two Noctua P12 1300rpm fans. When I undervolt these fans to run at 800-850 rpm, the S-Flex and Kama-Flex were quieter than the Noctua P12. The P12 produced a low rumbling sound that won't go away under undervolted a bit further.

If you are using in vertical orientation, then the Slipstream may be even better. I've had six Slipstreams (1200rpm, but undervolted to run at 800rpm). It clearly moves more air at 800 rpm, and noise was about same. Caveat: Slipstreams' bearing noise tends to be a bit more varied. I've had one that was relatively scratchy, a couple that were a little scratchy, and the rest being smooth (but The S/Kama-Flex fans were still a bit smoother than the best Slipstream... this difference is only audible from inches away)

meridius · Post by **meridius** » Tue Feb 09, 2010 12:05 am

Thanks

I will buy 4 s-flex 2 front intake 1 rear outtake and 1 top case outtake this makes 1 horz and 3 vert.

So this would he perfect as the s-flex fan be mounted any way horz and vert is this ok

WARDOZER9 · Post by **WARDOZER9** » Wed Feb 10, 2010 9:42 am

I rmember when I built a gaming PC for a friend using the Antec 300 and filling it with 5-volted Scythe S-Flex medium speed fans that thing ran cool and dead silent. That was with 2 in the front, one on the side, one in the back, 2 on the TRUE and one zip tied to the Accelero on his 8800GTS G92 for a total of 7 of those fans.

From experience I can vouche for the silence of the S-Flex's though I wouldn't call them silent untill you undervolt a tad but the medium speed's at 5v started up every time reguardless of orrientation.

eli2k · Post by **eli2k** » Wed Feb 10, 2010 10:21 am

WARDOZER9 wrote:From experience I can vouche for the silence of the S-Flex's though I wouldn't call them silent untill you undervolt a tad but the medium speed's at 5v started up every time reguardless of orrientation.

What do you think of the slow speed @ ~7V vs medium speed @5V? Not worth it?

judge56988 · Post by **judge56988** » Wed Feb 10, 2010 10:10 pm

eli2k wrote: What do you think of the slow speed @ ~7V vs medium speed @5V? Not worth it?

I'd go for medium speed myself mainly because I would rather take 5v from the molex than use the "7v trick" which apparently carries a risk of damaging the psu.
I'd like to be able to get fans that would spin at 500rpm when fed 12v. Can't say that I've seen any.
The medium speed fans would give you more headroom for the future, should you need it.

outbackyak · Post by **outbackyak** » Thu Feb 11, 2010 12:40 am

judge56988 wrote:I'd like to be able to get fans that would spin at 500rpm when fed 12v. Can't say that I've seen any.

The SCYTHE SLIP STREAM SY1225SL12SL spins at 500rpm at 12v. http://www.silentpcreview.com/article83 ... html#SS-SL

Cheers,

Parappaman · Post by **Parappaman** » Thu Feb 11, 2010 1:06 am

There's also the Gentle Typhoon and the Kaze Maru.