Info on Seasonic M12 (and more: V8 and new S12 models)

vitaminc · Post by **vitaminc** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 2:02 pm

jvrobert wrote:You're forgetting that the DX10 cards due out are supposed to be ridiculous power hogs. A single card could conceivably be 200W+ according to the rumors. Pretty pathetic.

Rumors stay rumors. Just measure the power draw on the wall for your XBOX 360 and that's about 160W according to CNET. That's 160W for DX10 GPU, Tri Core CPU, and all other good stuff.

400-500W PSU will be way more than enough for high end single CPU gaming systems. And for typical system set up, 300W is enough even for those extreme overclockers.

sjschwinn · Post by **sjschwinn** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 2:25 pm

vitaminc wrote:
jvrobert wrote:You're forgetting that the DX10 cards due out are supposed to be ridiculous power hogs. A single card could conceivably be 200W+ according to the rumors. Pretty pathetic.
Rumors stay rumors. Just measure the power draw on the wall for your XBOX 360 and that's about 160W according to CNET. That's 160W for DX10 GPU, Tri Core CPU, and all other good stuff.

400-500W PSU will be way more than enough for high end single CPU gaming systems. And for typical system set up, 300W is enough even for those extreme overclockers.

While I agree, in general and in principle, with your points, you can't compare a PC with a special purpose game console. The game consoles are designed from the the ground up to be very power efficient. The tri-core CPU in the XBOX360 is lower power than most dual-core X86 procs.

jvrobert · Post by **jvrobert** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:11 pm

vitaminc wrote:
jvrobert wrote:You're forgetting that the DX10 cards due out are supposed to be ridiculous power hogs. A single card could conceivably be 200W+ according to the rumors. Pretty pathetic.
Rumors stay rumors. Just measure the power draw on the wall for your XBOX 360 and that's about 160W according to CNET. That's 160W for DX10 GPU, Tri Core CPU, and all other good stuff.

400-500W PSU will be way more than enough for high end single CPU gaming systems. And for typical system set up, 300W is enough even for those extreme overclockers.

Well, they're a little less than fact, and a little more than rumors. http://www.anandtech.com/tradeshows/sho ... yes&i=2770

My guess is they'll be hogs. The Xbox 360 is not relevent, it's scaled down. The G80 and ATI's next chip will be much more powerful and power hungry. I'm not saying go with the 1000W supplies, but 400W may be pushing it if you ever want to go SLI in the future.

EsaT · Post by **EsaT** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 11:30 pm

jvrobert wrote:My guess is they'll be hogs. The Xbox 360 is not relevent, it's scaled down. The G80 and ATI's next chip will be much more powerful and power hungry. I'm not saying go with the 1000W supplies, but 400W may be pushing it if you ever want to go SLI in the future.

But with rising consumptions of coming GPUs SLI/Crossfire would be IMO completely unreasonable... even if those heaters can be cooled silently there's still that heat left to warm your room.

I would see more sense in using second slot for less power hungry card for calculating physics because at least ATI has told clearly that when they add physics calculation support to drivers you can use different card in that kind Crossfire configuration.

Poodle · Post by **Poodle** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 8:55 am

jaganath wrote:
Quad core AMD processors are supposed to be out in early 2007
Yes, but this will be a server processor (Deerhound), not a desktop chip. Also it looks now like Deerhound will not arrive until late Q2 '07.

Quadcore on desktop will not arrive until 2008 at the earliest:

http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=2388

AMD will introduce no less than four quad-core families over the next two years, with the first being Deerhound. Deerhound, we are told, will be a Socket F server processor expected to ship late next year on the K8 -- not K8L -- architecture. Deerhound did not appear to support FB-DIMM.

In early 2008, AMD's corporate roadmap claims a quad core desktop CPU will make an appearance, dubbed Greyhound.
http://dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=2531

Quad-core Revision G Opterons (Deerhound) are not anticipated for at least another year. (from article dated 25-05-06)
Also, as you point out these processors will have very sophisticated power efficiency features, so I am really not convinced that a new power supply will be necessary.

We'll see as Opteron now also is an Am2 cpu.

rpsgc · Post by **rpsgc** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 9:00 am

Hmm... back on topic shall we?
Matbe reports that the M12 is now available (at least in France).
http://www.matbe.com/actualites/14140/s ... sponibles/

Post by **NeilBlanchard** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 9:00 am

Greetings,

This thread is veering of topic...please start new threads to continue your conversation, and keep this thread for the subject of it's title.

Thanks!

vitaminc · Post by **vitaminc** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 12:09 pm

rpsgc wrote:Hmm... back on topic shall we?
Matbe reports that the M12 is now available (at least in France).
http://www.matbe.com/actualites/14140/s ... sponibles/

Wow.

And what will the 80+ S12's model numbers be? There's no mention in Seasonic USA's website. ;(

rpsgc · Post by **rpsgc** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 7:03 am

vitaminc wrote:Wow.

And what will the 80+ S12's model numbers be? There's no mention in Seasonic USA's website. ;(

This?
http://www.matbe.com/actualites/14151/s ... 12-energy/

Some1 · Post by **Some1** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 12:43 am

The powersupplies are in pre-order now here in the Netherlands. No due date yet.

Source: www.4launch.nl (efficiency claims come from www.seasonic.com)

Pricing (in euro's):

Energy plus: (efficiency above 80%, max. is 88%)
S12-550W+ 125
S12-650W+ 151

Modular: (efficiency above 80%, max is 85%)
M12-500 127,50
M12-600 155,50
M12-700 187

EsaT · Post by **EsaT** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 1:14 pm

Actually those have been in stock for well over week in here:
http://www.caseking.de/shop/catalog/def ... ath=30_797

They have very good service so if anyone from Europe needs some case accessories/coolers/PSUs their site is worth of checking. (also shipping costs are very reasonable)

I wonder how they have calculated those different efficiencies because inside both series looks to use same PCB/layout.
Did they use some fixed coefficient for modular connectors or what? I really wouldn't see much sense in making many different PCBs with different efficiency components when same could be used in both series. (M12s are little longer so housing modular connectors and secondary fan isn't problem)

http://www.pcstats.com/ArtVNL.cfm?articleid=1995&page=3
http://www.hardwarelogic.com/news/137/A ... 07-27.html

jozi · Post by **jozi** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 4:54 am

So the only difference between the S12 and M12 are the little fan and that its modular?

Thanks for the link to http://www.caseking.de EsaT, they have the S12 500Watt cheaper than komplett do (who i normally get alot of stuff from).

Jozi

vitaminc · Post by **vitaminc** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 9:35 am

still can't find either in US e-tailers

Kung Fu Hung-Su · Post by **Kung Fu Hung-Su** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 9:00 pm

The Energy Plus PSUs have just hit Australia =) Too bad what I really wanted was an old S12-330 =(

http://www.pccasegear.com/prod4143.htm

PC-power help · Post by **PC-power help** » Tue Sep 05, 2006 4:38 pm

Does any one know where to purchase a S12-550 Eplus in the United States? It seams they've been released for 2 months (exaggeration) and there's still no way to get one to the US.
CrAsh!! Seasonic dropping the preverbal. ball

I'm really looking to buy a PSU soon for my new budget Linux Rig Im putting together but I can't find any sellers US or European that will ship a Seasonic S12- 550 Energy+ Internationally, mainly to the States.

There is a lot of great links to buy in Ausie, Deutschland, France etc but none ship internationally ??!!!

I may have to go with my back up PSU Silverstone's ST50EF, which isn't a bad choice by any respects, but it's not sport'n quad 12 volt rails ither

---->Gentoo Linux all about the cow!

While we're on Ausie:
Tribute to Steve Irwin, you will be missed...

dhanson865 · Post by **dhanson865** » Tue Sep 05, 2006 7:05 pm

OK, the Seasonic USA site was updated recently

The S12+ page is
http://www.seasonicusa.com/s12plus.htm

The brochure is at http://www.seasonicusa.com/images/Broch ... ochure.pdf

Still no manual or availbity in US apparently...

dhanson865 · Post by **dhanson865** » Tue Sep 05, 2006 7:10 pm

Kung Fu Hung-Su wrote:The Energy Plus PSUs have just hit Australia =) Too bad what I really wanted was an old S12-330 =(

http://www.pccasegear.com/prod4143.htm

I doubt they will discontinue the S12 series. If you want a 330w they shouldn't be hard to find. Though I'd recommend the 380w instead for the difference in the internal heat sinks.

I do see what you mean about the website you linked to. They don't list the lower watt Seasonic parts there anymore. Surely that is a temporary thing. It just doesn't make sense to me to drop the under 500w S12 parts since the M12 and S12+ start at 500w and up.

It might even be worth it for some of us to watch for clearance sales of the 380w, 430w, or even 500w of the old S12 series. Though I doubt many places would put them on clearance I don't have the inside scoop and I could be wrong...

vitaminc · Post by **vitaminc** » Wed Sep 06, 2006 6:42 am

dhanson865 wrote:OK, the Seasonic USA site was updated recently

The S12+ page is
http://www.seasonicusa.com/s12plus.htm

The brochure is at http://www.seasonicusa.com/images/Broch ... ochure.pdf

Still no manual or availbity in US apparently...

both the s12+ and m12's product websites have been updated, just that the product aint shipped yet to the e-tailers.

PC-power help · Post by **PC-power help** » Wed Sep 06, 2006 11:31 am

I just got off the phone with Seasonic USA 1-626-969-9966 tel.

I was told they won't be available to the US until October. Well to quote the rep "the end of the month" ie. Next month b/c they have no concrete dates to give me.

Well, too bad theyâ€™ve lost a sale. Release a product in July stock it in October, what a business model

By then something better will be out...

PC-power help · Post by **PC-power help** » Wed Sep 06, 2006 11:40 am

Tried to call the corporate office in TW to get some straight answers but can't dial international without paying $10 so, I'm stickin with the original US rep time quote. October

Ps. it's only September 6th

vitaminc · Post by **vitaminc** » Wed Sep 06, 2006 11:43 am

PC-power help wrote:Tried to call the corporate office in TW to get some straight answers but can't dial international without paying $10 so, I'm stickin with the original US rep time quote. October

Ps. it's only September 6th

And its not yet 4 AM taiwan time. :p

Don't know about you, but I am going to get M12 when it comes out anyway. I think my Antec SP2 can pump my conroe box in between times. :p

merlin · Post by **merlin** » Wed Sep 06, 2006 11:58 am

PC-power help wrote:I just got off the phone with Seasonic USA 1-626-969-9966 tel.

I was told they won't be available to the US until October. Well to quote the rep "the end of the month" ie. Next month b/c they have no concrete dates to give me.

Well, too bad theyâ€™ve lost a sale. Release a product in July stock it in October, what a business model

By then something better will be out...

Hmm, they only really started the "pre-release announcement" in very late august. That's not quite releasing the product in july

I think they did promise the M12 in september, so if it shows up prior to the end of the month, they've made the date. I do agree it's a pretty long wait since we first started hearing about it...especially since it's out in other places now!

PC-power help · Post by **PC-power help** » Wed Sep 06, 2006 12:12 pm

vitaminc wrote:
And its not yet 4 AM taiwan time. :p

Don't know about you, but I am going to get M12 when it comes out anyway. I think my Antec SP2 can pump my conroe box in between times. :p

:Big Laugh: Yeah time zones... No body's on Greenwich Mean anymore.

Curvin · Post by **Curvin** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 10:15 pm

Hi All,

Stocks of both the new S12's and M12's are now available in Australia.

I have ordered both a S12 550 & an M12 700.

I will have both Monday ..

I'll drop back with a report once I get a chance to run them up..

Peace:

V:

vitaminc · Post by **vitaminc** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 10:28 pm

For once I actually want to be in Australia right now.

The Internal · Post by **The Internal** » Tue Sep 12, 2006 7:25 am

Wowies... Seasonic REALLY shot themselves in the foot on the release of the M-12. I think even non-advertising and business majors could agree.

I still can't find it in the USA, and considering the graphics card refresh by NVIDIA and ATI is started and should be in full effect in the next week (specifically the 14th is when the NDAs and product ship dates are listed by ATI and NVIDIA), they will be losing ALOT of potential sales due to lack of availability.

There's a good chance I'll be buying two of the silent XFX 7950 GTs (if the price point is reasonable) http://www.xfxforce.com/web/product/lis ... tId=638284, and will need to upgrade my PSU to an SLI capable model... I just can't seem to find a high wattage PSU that will be at least somewhat future compatible (600+ watt) that is SLI/Crossfire capable, has modular cables, and that's quiet.

If anyone finds a retailer carrying this model, please do share ^-^

Tibors · Post by **Tibors** » Tue Sep 12, 2006 8:13 am

The Internal wrote:Wowies... Seasonic REALLY shot themselves in the foot on the release of the M-12. I think even non-advertising and business majors could agree.

Not really, they hardly nicked the nail of their tiny toe when they were shooting down this time.

Don't forget that for Seasonic the retail market is not that important. The majority of there sales are made in the OEM world.

merlin · Post by **merlin** » Tue Sep 12, 2006 8:36 am

The Internal wrote:Wowies... Seasonic REALLY shot themselves in the foot on the release of the M-12. I think even non-advertising and business majors could agree.

I still can't find it in the USA, and considering the graphics card refresh by NVIDIA and ATI is started and should be in full effect in the next week (specifically the 14th is when the NDAs and product ship dates are listed by ATI and NVIDIA), they will be losing ALOT of potential sales due to lack of availability.

There's a good chance I'll be buying two of the silent XFX 7950 GTs (if the price point is reasonable) http://www.xfxforce.com/web/product/lis ... tId=638284, and will need to upgrade my PSU to an SLI capable model... I just can't seem to find a high wattage PSU that will be at least somewhat future compatible (600+ watt) that is SLI/Crossfire capable, has modular cables, and that's quiet.

If anyone finds a retailer carrying this model, please do share ^-^

I'm rather confused. There's plenty of PSU's out there that will do what you ask and some are even Seasonic OEM such as the Antec Truepower Trio, Antec NeoHE and Corsair 620W. Also plenty of FSP/FSP oem high power psu's available too... It sounds more like you specifically want the Seasonic brand, which is a slightly different want from what you said there. I'd just outright say "I want seasonic and not seasonic oem"...because that's what I'd say as my excuse

And like Tibur mentioned, retail has a minor effect on them at best.

zenfist · Post by **zenfist** » Tue Sep 12, 2006 2:12 pm

You can find some more photos of M12 series over here:

http://zenfist.pl/foto.php/pID/779/fID/25

The Internal · Post by **The Internal** » Wed Sep 13, 2006 8:56 pm

The Corsair 620W is actually one of them seasonic brands I hear nothing but praise about? *scampers off to buy one at Newegg... and two XFX passively cooled 7950 GTs... then cries over his upgrade addiction*

Info on Seasonic M12 (and more: V8 and new S12 models)

Pricing in the Netherlands for pre-order

Well that's that

Re: Well that's that